Hewland Mk8 Rebuild costs
Discussion
I'm considering a foray into historic / classic Formula Ford.
My prior experience is Caterham Graduates so this will be a step up in costs across the board and I'm currently assessing how silly an idea this is.
I currently have a question mark over the gearboxes. I'm used to having a seasonal refresh and nothing else but I'm told that Hewland 'boxes are specialist and therefore costly to rebuild / repair. This is on top of the fact that I will need to build up a collection of ratios (expensive?)
Could somebody share what a seasonal refresh might cost with bearings and seals, and approximate costs for more significant repairs such as cracked housings etc?
My prior experience is Caterham Graduates so this will be a step up in costs across the board and I'm currently assessing how silly an idea this is.
I currently have a question mark over the gearboxes. I'm used to having a seasonal refresh and nothing else but I'm told that Hewland 'boxes are specialist and therefore costly to rebuild / repair. This is on top of the fact that I will need to build up a collection of ratios (expensive?)
Could somebody share what a seasonal refresh might cost with bearings and seals, and approximate costs for more significant repairs such as cracked housings etc?
Good individual MK8 gears can be picked up for £60 to £100. With FF1600 you only really need to change top gear between circuits providing you have appropriate 1st 2nd and 3rd which can remain the same unless you are after tenth at best. The FF1600 has a large power band so ratios are not that critical
Once the MK8 has been rebuilt by a specialist they last a good 5 years, some have left it more. The mark 8 is a racing G/box capable of over 160HP so not exactly stretched in a 100BHP FF1600.
The main problem is that Hewland parts are expensive (should have used a few expletive then to show how expensive) and depending on the state of the g/box to start with the rebuild cost can be high. But get it right and they provide long life. Get wrong and like most things will cost you more in the end.
Considering they were designed in the 60s a great bit of kit. In the end of the day once rebuilt by someone like MBR, PDS etc and then it will be the least of your worries. There are quire few ex Caterham racers going the FF1600 route.
Once the MK8 has been rebuilt by a specialist they last a good 5 years, some have left it more. The mark 8 is a racing G/box capable of over 160HP so not exactly stretched in a 100BHP FF1600.
The main problem is that Hewland parts are expensive (should have used a few expletive then to show how expensive) and depending on the state of the g/box to start with the rebuild cost can be high. But get it right and they provide long life. Get wrong and like most things will cost you more in the end.
Considering they were designed in the 60s a great bit of kit. In the end of the day once rebuilt by someone like MBR, PDS etc and then it will be the least of your worries. There are quire few ex Caterham racers going the FF1600 route.
Thanks both, your rebuild prices look more or less as I expected Bert, Hopefully I won't be having work like that done too regularly!
It's useful to know that generally you only need to fiddle with 4th gear, that allays some of my concerns that I'm going to need dosens of ratios (although I'm sure some folk do)
All in all not enough to put me off.
I did just miss out on a car I fancied though. Damn and blast.
It's useful to know that generally you only need to fiddle with 4th gear, that allays some of my concerns that I'm going to need dosens of ratios (although I'm sure some folk do)
All in all not enough to put me off.
I did just miss out on a car I fancied though. Damn and blast.
Hi, if you fancy a Historic FF1600 then the Jamun T2 that Chris has up for sale has to be one of the best at present. I've known and raced with that car for nearly 25 years. Seen it win lots of races.
https://racecarsdirect.com/Advert/Details/68674/19...
https://racecarsdirect.com/Advert/Details/68674/19...
kevski321 said:
Hi, if you fancy a Historic FF1600 then the Jamun T2 that Chris has up for sale has to be one of the best at present. I've known and raced with that car for nearly 25 years. Seen it win lots of races.
https://racecarsdirect.com/Advert/Details/68674/19...
I did see that one, seems a bit of a brave option considering how few there are. https://racecarsdirect.com/Advert/Details/68674/19...
I was peeved to miss out on this one
https://racecarsdirect.com/Advert/Details/77175/el...
Thinking to wait until the end of the season now.
Bert, we used to race Caterhams in the same club as Mick Whitehead who races on your grid with a Reynard, everyone speaks very highly of FF2000 and it seems friendly so it's a consideration.
I have been sharing my Dad's Elan in Guards but after the engine blew up at Croft I've decided that I can't with clear conscience continue using his car in case the next engine goes while I'm driving, or I crash it!
Of course I might bottle it altogether and end up in a Caterham again...
Are, we have one like that (one of the 3 Catnic works Eldens)
My son at Brands a couple of years back and now its in faster red.
Jamun are still building FF1600 nearly 50 years on. To be honest with race cars most of the parts are fabricated and you (or one of the teams etc ) just fabricate them. If it was made by man in the 70s, man can re make it now.... The difficult parts for the rare cars are rear uprights, body molds etc. but they are about for the Jamun and just as easy as an Elden, etc. In fact both cars use the same drive shafts and rear axle.
Any Elden is a great car, but so are Merlyns, Crossles, Lolas, Macons etc.
My son at Brands a couple of years back and now its in faster red.
Jamun are still building FF1600 nearly 50 years on. To be honest with race cars most of the parts are fabricated and you (or one of the teams etc ) just fabricate them. If it was made by man in the 70s, man can re make it now.... The difficult parts for the rare cars are rear uprights, body molds etc. but they are about for the Jamun and just as easy as an Elden, etc. In fact both cars use the same drive shafts and rear axle.
Any Elden is a great car, but so are Merlyns, Crossles, Lolas, Macons etc.
Thanks for the post Kevski.
The Mk20s and Eldens seem to do pretty well but so does Will Nuthall in the Jamun. I think I'm more likely to fit comfortably in a Merlyn or Jamun than the Elden though (6', 90kg). I'm going to have to work on my weight.
P.S. I approached Mk8 motorsport about having a go in one of their cars at Brands next month but they're too busy, but if you know anybody who might have a car for that meeting, the classic formula ford meeting at Snetterton, or the formula ford festival, let me know.
The Mk20s and Eldens seem to do pretty well but so does Will Nuthall in the Jamun. I think I'm more likely to fit comfortably in a Merlyn or Jamun than the Elden though (6', 90kg). I'm going to have to work on my weight.
P.S. I approached Mk8 motorsport about having a go in one of their cars at Brands next month but they're too busy, but if you know anybody who might have a car for that meeting, the classic formula ford meeting at Snetterton, or the formula ford festival, let me know.
Thanks Bert but I think I'd be inclined to try FF1600 first, slicks & wings a little intimidating for a first go in a single seater!
I'm actually not sure of Brands Indy as a venue either, it's the one circuit I know best of all but it's very short and you get a lot of cars on... perhaps I'd be better off testing over the winter instead somewhere like Snett 300.
I'm actually not sure of Brands Indy as a venue either, it's the one circuit I know best of all but it's very short and you get a lot of cars on... perhaps I'd be better off testing over the winter instead somewhere like Snett 300.
Don't be daft, go for it, they are awesome fun, a slick is just a tyre 
Anyway, if you want you'd be welcome to have a go in mine at a test session somewhere if that helps.
Bert
Anyway, if you want you'd be welcome to have a go in mine at a test session somewhere if that helps.Bert
HustleRussell said:
Thanks Bert but I think I'd be inclined to try FF1600 first, slicks & wings a little intimidating for a first go in a single seater!
I'm actually not sure of Brands Indy as a venue either, it's the one circuit I know best of all but it's very short and you get a lot of cars on... perhaps I'd be better off testing over the winter instead somewhere like Snett 300.
I'm actually not sure of Brands Indy as a venue either, it's the one circuit I know best of all but it's very short and you get a lot of cars on... perhaps I'd be better off testing over the winter instead somewhere like Snett 300.
kevski321 said:
Are, we have one like that (one of the 3 Catnic works Eldens)
My son at Brands a couple of years back and now its in faster red.
Kevin & Danny S. perchance? I had a chat with him and sat in his car at Silverstone at the weekend. I ‘sort of’ fit. I would need a removable steering wheel if I were to have to get out in 7 seconds rather than the ~7 minutes it took without one… My size 11 plates aren’t ideal for the pedal box either, at least with normal plimsoll-y things on. Then there is the small matter of what to do with the right elbow during gear changes (Danny helpfully wedged it between my rib cage and the chassis brace for me!) I would certainly need to raise the bar above the pedal box as Danny has and make a bead seat or something. Chris Sharple’s Palliser seemed as comfortable as my bed by comparison but I expect there’s a chassis performance trade-off there… My son at Brands a couple of years back and now its in faster red.
It's all academic of course because it depends on what cars become available...
The Jamun was undergoing some adjustments when I visited it so I didn’t manage to have a sit in.
BertBert said:
Don't be daft, go for it, they are awesome fun, a slick is just a tyre Anyway, if you want you'd be welcome to have a go in mine at a test session somewhere if that helps.
Bert
Must’ve missed you at the weekend, things got a bit busy for us after Dad’s Elan came back on a recovery truck (clutch!) I was sniffing around for FF1600s for sale later on though. Anyway, if you want you'd be welcome to have a go in mine at a test session somewhere if that helps.Bert
I made what I think was a reasonable offer on an Elden at the Silverstone finals but didn't even get a text back. I couldn't uncover any others that I fancied- I bet most cars change hands without ever being advertised. Plus I wonder if there was higher than usual demand because of the 50 year anniversary.
Doubtless by the time I look at HFF again, 1600s will start at £30k and 2000s will be catching up...
Bought a 2010 Supersport (nay 270r) which I'll race in the Caterham Graduates club. I had a choice of four. Buyer's market this time of year...
Thanks for the info though Bertbert.
ETA: sorry, where are my manners. Naturally you can drop me a message if ever you want to have a go. We can compare laptimes and you can assure yourself that you won't be embarrassingly last!
Doubtless by the time I look at HFF again, 1600s will start at £30k and 2000s will be catching up...
Bought a 2010 Supersport (nay 270r) which I'll race in the Caterham Graduates club. I had a choice of four. Buyer's market this time of year...
Thanks for the info though Bertbert.
ETA: sorry, where are my manners. Naturally you can drop me a message if ever you want to have a go. We can compare laptimes and you can assure yourself that you won't be embarrassingly last!
Edited by HustleRussell on Saturday 21st January 09:04
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