Anybody tow with a petrol engined car

[Al Weyman]

Just a quick Goggle suggest you shouldnt be towing a trailer of more than 600ks in weight and that will include the wieght of race your car, the trailer and anything like tools, tyres and petrol. http://www.cuddles.abelgratis.net/nissan.htm Then you also have to concider the gross train weight that will include occupants and stuff carried in the Nissan.

Edited by Al Weyman on Tuesday 13th April 21:41

[onomatopoeia]

cytefx said:

most cars have a plate on them with the weight it can tow on a braked trailer, you should really not do this to the full though, think you should pull gross weight - 10%

so if car can pull 1850kg according to the plate (owners manual) you should really only be pulling 1850 - 185 = 1665 (thats including the trailer)

think there is something about the total weight of car with pax in etc also, as you could load up car fully and pull trailer and still get in the deep do do with the law.

Land Rovers can tow 3500kg. They do not weigh 3900kg.

[Al Weyman]

I think it takes a whole lot of things into consideration not just the weight of the vehicle. For example 4x4 vehicles will have a higher towing capacity. Also the power of the engine and the stopping power and if the vehicle is designed for the job must all be factors. For example I was surprised at how little a standard Transit van is rated at, the Land Rover in the previous post is rated at 3500kgs braked trailer where as a Transit van only 1800kgs!

[Graham]

Interestingly I was talking to a Vosa chap last week, trying to untangle the rules on running a 7.5 ton truck... even he said he didnt want to go anywhere near trying to explain the current trailer rules..

half the problem seems to be


A) Vosa come up with the rule
B) Plod inforces them
c) The courts then decide whats right!!!


until some one actually gets taken to court no precident is set, so its all open to interpretion. With the lack of dedicated traffic cops these days he reckoned most Plod didnt actually know the correct law. mainly as they dont have the time to read up on it and when the do its constantly changing.

THe vosa chap reckoned i was much better off running a private good vehicle..

He sugggested various vosa documents and other documentation i should carry so if i ever do get stopped, It should highlight that Im probably better informed than the guy stopping me..

Edited by Graham on Wednesday 14th April 14:23

[cytefx]

onomatopoeia said:

cytefx said:

most cars have a plate on them with the weight it can tow on a braked trailer, you should really not do this to the full though, think you should pull gross weight - 10%

so if car can pull 1850kg according to the plate (owners manual) you should really only be pulling 1850 - 185 = 1665 (thats including the trailer)

think there is something about the total weight of car with pax in etc also, as you could load up car fully and pull trailer and still get in the deep do do with the law.

Land Rovers can tow 3500kg. They do not weigh 3900kg.

Land rovers can tow 3500 cos thats what it says on the plate, my BM can tow 1850 cos thats what it says on the plate, a volvo owner I know can only tow 1700 cos thats what his plate says, its nothing to do with car weight, as the volvo weighs more than the bmw.

[dellow]

cytefx said:

Land rovers can tow 3500 cos thats what it says on the plate, my BM can tow 1850 cos thats what it says on the plate, a volvo owner I know can only tow 1700 cos thats what his plate says, its nothing to do with car weight, as the volvo weighs more than the bmw.

the number on the plate your reading is the d.g.w. NOT the towing weight

[Al Weyman]

Interesting discussion actually because I was most surprised at some of the max braked trailer towing figures when I was looking at vehicles and did wonder why the 4x4 vehicles like my Chevy Blazer 4x4 SUV and Land/Range Rovers were so high and yet Transit type vans reletively low. I came to the conclusion it must be the weight and low down of the 4x4's as you certainly wouldnt be towing in 4 wheel drive mode unless its the fact its there with low range gears should you need it, also the shear grunt from the larger engines and prehaps bigger brakes and tyres. Its a bit of an odd one really that I would like to know the answer to.

[Jetset Rich]

Love it SuperT!
I was going to say our fine 94 405 Executive 2.0 petrol tows our 10ftx6ft 4 wheel "Tow-a-van" with 2 ATVs inside plus all the gear quite well
You seemed to have trumped me there!
Mind you our trailer has the aero of a small house (2 storey) - there seems to be an invisble wall at 50mph that goes away once u hit 60-65
Before that you are rowing from 4th to 5th with every change in gradient
I must treat myself to that Toureg V10
Rich

Supertoadylight said:

PAH! your are all wimps.

We tow a brian james minno-shuttle with a caterham R500 in it with a 1.0 nissan micra!

Its fine on motorways - just sit back at 55, and change down to fourth for hills on the motorways, drop to 50 and smell that engine :P

But seriously - its actually fine. All these horse boxes and trailer users with massive 4x4 or 3.0 diesils are wasting their money!

the cars done 120000 miles and only ever needed one clutch at 90k miles. great little car!

[TVRleigh_BBWR]

Al Weyman said:

Interesting discussion actually because I was most surprised at some of the max braked trailer towing figures when I was looking at vehicles and did wonder why the 4x4 vehicles like my Chevy Blazer 4x4 SUV and Land/Range Rovers were so high and yet Transit type vans reletively low. I came to the conclusion it must be the weight and low down of the 4x4's as you certainly wouldnt be towing in 4 wheel drive mode unless its the fact its there with low range gears should you need it, also the shear grunt from the larger engines and prehaps bigger brakes and tyres. Its a bit of an odd one really that I would like to know the answer to.

I think the reason the Transit vans have a lower tow limit, is do the the amount of weight you can carry inside, compared to what you can carry in a 4x4, if they had a 3500KG limit, and fully loaded you could go past 7.5 ton total weight (Inc the weight of the van also)

[Al Weyman]

A factor of course but not the definitive reason. Look at the towing capacity of the new Ford Ranger for example I think its in the 3500-3800 range and I am sure that can carry plenty on board as well. Also if you look on Fords brosure for the vehicle there is an asterix that points out the fact that you may in some circumstances need a tacho fitted when towing a trailer of that weight!

Edited by Al Weyman on Monday 19th April 14:00

Edited by Al Weyman on Monday 19th April 14:01

[papercup]

drmotorsport said:

I tow my Fiesta racer with a BMW 530i auto with no real probs. Just need to use the steptronic rather than full auto to save the box from overheating. Got about 20mpg on the trek up to Cadwell Park last weekend.

I use a 540 and found gearbox over heating started, then got worse and worse (always changing down to 3rd). I fitted a gearbox oil cooler which fits perfectly in the grille and I've never overheated it since.

I put a thread in the BMW section about it; maybe have a look?

Andy

[cytefx]

dellow said:

cytefx said:

Land rovers can tow 3500 cos thats what it says on the plate, my BM can tow 1850 cos thats what it says on the plate, a volvo owner I know can only tow 1700 cos thats what his plate says, its nothing to do with car weight, as the volvo weighs more than the bmw.

the number on the plate your reading is the d.g.w. NOT the towing weight

Grabbed this from the web for my car, the 320d... so as you can see max towing weight is 1850, and this figure is also on the car as a plate, yes it has the other numbers too, but this is the one that I am using as its a braked trailer.


Weight and Capacities Weight and Capacities
Fuel Tank Capacity (Litres) 61
Gross Vehicle Weight 2045
Luggage Capacity (Seats Down) 1385
Luggage Capacity (Seats Up) 460
Max. Loading Weight 540
Max. Roof Load 75
Max. Towing Weight - Braked 1850
Max. Towing Weight - Unbraked 745
Minimum Kerbweight 1505
No. of Seats 5
Turning Circle - Kerb to Kerb 11

[drmotorsport]

papercup said:

drmotorsport said:

I tow my Fiesta racer with a BMW 530i auto with no real probs. Just need to use the steptronic rather than full auto to save the box from overheating. Got about 20mpg on the trek up to Cadwell Park last weekend.

I use a 540 and found gearbox over heating started, then got worse and worse (always changing down to 3rd). I fitted a gearbox oil cooler which fits perfectly in the grille and I've never overheated it since.

I put a thread in the BMW section about it; maybe have a look?

Andy

Ah, not had that particular problem, but did have one episode when towing an empty trailer after a lot of stop start town traffic got home, parked up and smoke started billowing from the rear of the engine bay! On that occasion I had just driven in normal auto mode with an empty car as I thought things were light enough to get away with it. Had towed perfectly before then plenty of times and has been ok since, but always run in manual mode when towing any heavy load and drive in a fairly mechanically sympathetic style.

I'm pretty sure theres a gearbox oil cooler fitted as standard on most german cars, and poking around in my engine bay there appears to be a cooler with pipework not connected to cooling or air con that may do the job.

[papercup]

drmotorsport said:

papercup said:

drmotorsport said:

I tow my Fiesta racer with a BMW 530i auto with no real probs. Just need to use the steptronic rather than full auto to save the box from overheating. Got about 20mpg on the trek up to Cadwell Park last weekend.

I use a 540 and found gearbox over heating started, then got worse and worse (always changing down to 3rd). I fitted a gearbox oil cooler which fits perfectly in the grille and I've never overheated it since.

I put a thread in the BMW section about it; maybe have a look?

Andy

Ah, not had that particular problem, but did have one episode when towing an empty trailer after a lot of stop start town traffic got home, parked up and smoke started billowing from the rear of the engine bay! On that occasion I had just driven in normal auto mode with an empty car as I thought things were light enough to get away with it. Had towed perfectly before then plenty of times and has been ok since, but always run in manual mode when towing any heavy load and drive in a fairly mechanically sympathetic style.

I'm pretty sure theres a gearbox oil cooler fitted as standard on most german cars, and poking around in my engine bay there appears to be a cooler with pipework not connected to cooling or air con that may do the job.

Yes, the 540 had a gearbox oil coller but it was pathetic. Same size and shape as a tin of sardines, and about as much use! Hidden near the nearside lower suspension arm. We left it there and simply added this other one 'in series'. Its been good as gold since. Just know that if yours starts dropping down to 3rd on uphills, you know what to do!

[mrcnc53]

I used a 3lt VX Omega for 7 years towing an Uno no problems. Just changed the
ATF and filter every 2 years. Finally lost the gearbox racing an Astra Van,
not towing at the time. Now I have another Omega with cruise which means I
can walk when I get to the circuit.