Conversion to Fuel Injection from Holley Carb

[V8Dom]

been talking to charles Dunn today and i might think about keeping the car....

however if i do, whats the opion of this discusion... fast/holley/msd etc etc they all fuel injection now

and four barrel injection of direct 8 injectors.? id be interested to know


dom

[Racingroj]

Dom
Great to hear that you are thinking of keeping it. It's hard to know if you've made the right decision until it's gone, but I've sold a couple of cars and really regretted it. Looking forward to catching up soon.

[The Italian]

The easy way is one of several kits http://www.edelbrock.com/automotive/mc/efi/pf2-che...
Or direct, meaning you must change your air induction a bit and add a "traditional" MAF, manifold & computer management, air sensors.The latter being better, tuning options, more work.

[V8Dom]

thanks.. i sa those but only upto 450hp.. mines 600 plus

dom

[confusionhunter]

Before I even got my car I did a little investigation on what to do with the SBC thats in it.
I spoke to a one person who had nothing but issues that were never really resolved by converting an SBC to EFI and swore you would be better off selling on the open market and then putting in an LS3. So selecting the right kit would be a careful decsion to make.

It depends what you are after really, more power? more reliability? better tank range? something a bit different? LS3s are are a benchmark of reliability and power, but you might need something a bit more to be a match for what you have. LSA? wait for some LT-1 developments?

I guess thats the issue with ultimas..... where do you go next?

I guess thats what it must be like being a jet fighter pilot... what on earth do you do for thrills after that???

Edited by confusionhunter on Sunday 22 February 18:27

[Storer]

Dom has mentioned that he is not a big earner (hope that is a fair description Dom) and money is not flowing freely.
There is no way you can replace an SBC with an LS (of any type) for a few quid. The SBC will be worth small beer compared to any new LS. Then there are the other 'bits' that get it to work which add a fair sum.

Injecting an SBC would be a much more affordable proposition. You will need to go the whole hog and have full electronic control of all elements of the engine but it will be cheaper than an engine swap.

I think the least expensive option is to fit an injection kit to the existing inlet manifold by replacing the carb with an injected throttle body. I have no idea if this is the best route to take, so listening to Charles on what is best (especially if you will get him to do the work) is probably best.

Reading between the lines what you are looking for is better on road (engine) manners and it has got to be worth trying what Charles suggests before you give up......


Paul

[V8Dom]

thanks Paul.

converting isnt an option as you say, due to money and the engine i have would cost a fortune in mods to get an ls3 to the same level.

Ask Martin with Steve smiths car to see how fast mine is!!

Charles is a carb man through and through and as a machanic and engineer i will be doing all the work myself,

there are a few setups on the market.. the fast, msd, holley and 3 others which are carb replacement as apposed to complete manifold changes.

teh advantages are cheaper mpg, cold start up and under hard braking stumbling tickover.

[barpilot]

I've opted for the MSD Atomic EFI Dom.

Fitting my build with an EFI'd SBC as the cost of the LS route is exorbitant for me.

After weighing up all the options (FAST/MSD/Edelbrock etc.) I preferred to have amatched fueling and ignition system by MSD for a clean and tidy install. At a later date when the car is registered and on the road I could fit an LS of some description if I felt it was needed.

Personally I'm aiming for a daily-ish GTR overall and the SBC with EFI will be loads better than pissing about with a carb at the side of the road. Been there,done that with temperamental V-twin 2 strokes!

[BogBeast]

I will be going for a full FAST EZ-EFI2 system as soon as I can wangle a trip to the states.

http://www.fuelairspark.com/fas/ez-efi-2-0r-multi-...

Together with the http://www.fuelairspark.com/fas/e6-digital-cd-igni...

Hoever I have just seen this : http://www.inglese.com/ing/self-tuning-ez-efir-bas...

[MarkWebb]

Having had the basic Fast EZEFI which has worked brilliantly for 4 years. I am changing engine but once again SBC based. I am prob going to do Inglese and an upgrade ECU.

[F.C.]

V8Dom said:

thanks.. i sa those but only upto 450hp.. mines 600 plus

dom

Dom
I don't know about other FI systems but can confirm a DTA S80 is capable, albeit with forced induction of supporting over 900BHP on dyno.
The guys I used for tuning/dyno work said they have seen the same ECU running well over 1000 BHP.
The biggest problem with mine is limiting the torque to sensible levels.
I have capped the power to 550ish at about 1 lb boost.
reality I suspect is I should run it without the S/C.

[V8Dom]

problem i have is my cam is massive and vacuum very low at low rpm.. i think an ecu is programable is it?c

[F.C.]

V8Dom said:

problem i have is my cam is massive and vacuum very low at low rpm.. i think an ecu is programable is it?c

Absolutely.
A good tuner will be able to factor in a lumpy cam, smooth out the idle and sort out any transitional issues that present themselves.

[T-Rev]

Hi Dom, presumably you have a full race cam in your modified SBC to achieve 600+BHP? If so, don't you find driving at low revs rather difficult to put it mildly (normal road driving in traffic etc.) until the engine is 'on cam' and pulling up quickly at low revs causes fuel to exit the float chamber vents flooding the engine and cutting out? I had these problems and more with the race cam in my SBC (with 595BHP), so decided to opt for a milder cam, lower BHP (just under 500 but with increased torque) and much improved smooth wide power band, see the spec on my web site. It made the car much more drivable at low rpm in tarffic, though still not ideal, still a little 'hunting' and flooding/cutting out if you pull up very hard at low rpm. But, for me the performance on track is more important that road driving - I don't go cruising any more, the roads are too rough and there is far too much traffic in the South East to enjoy it these days. I'm focusing on using my GTR on track from now on. If, or when I next rebuild my engine I will seriously consider injection, so I will be very interested in your developments and progress. I wish you well with your modifications and look forward to reading all about it.
Best regards, Trevor.

[V8Dom]

hi Trevor

yes the cam is huge... Gail at AS says its the highest lift one he does for sbc and although low down grunt a little rough, its not that bad tbh and quite usable... its all about ignition timing and carb settings.

i think the only injection i could do would be programable as self learning wont be able to cope at low revs

[MarkWebb]

You are correct Dom. Self learning no good with low vac cams. I have self learning FAST with 550hp 383. It just about works at idle but is flawless at any rpm/load above that. I have saved fortunes in RR and tuning costs. I like playing and doing stuff to hopefully improve my car. I also have looked down the LS route but having spent a lot of money on the top end of my SBC I have decided to keep it and replace the bottom end. My next move intake wise will be an inglese intake system which does not give the same low vac problems as it has individual intakes. Then a slightly more sophisticated ECU which still has self learn but this can be switched off at lower rpm so manual inputs can be used if necessary.
BTW I have a carb type efi intake with injectors for 600hp and all sensors sat on the shelf at home.

[TuxMan]

I converted mine myself using a Autonomics throttle body and fitting injectors into my carb intake manifold . Dave a Walker at Emerald supplied a ecu and mapped it , a massive improvement over the bucket with holes in it 😉