Pylon rear wing on GTR
Discussion
F.C. said:
Storer said:
Now before I start I should mention I have had a good deal of red wine, but....
Thinking out of the box, why do we put the wing at the back? If it creates downforce then why do we not put it in the middle of the car so that the downforce is evenly distributed over both axles!
Yes, it would look daft and we would loose some of the leverage effect. But are racing cars built as they are because of regulations? Would a wing in the middle of the car be more effective?
Discuss........
Paul
Been done.Thinking out of the box, why do we put the wing at the back? If it creates downforce then why do we not put it in the middle of the car so that the downforce is evenly distributed over both axles!
Yes, it would look daft and we would loose some of the leverage effect. But are racing cars built as they are because of regulations? Would a wing in the middle of the car be more effective?
Discuss........
Paul
See Ford RS 200, Lancia Stratos etc.
Even group B car speeds are not that high and thus aero doesn't play a massive part. Also due to the angle of has most rally cars are driven at, even in tarmac, high downforce can be dangerous. When you increase had it's very easy to loose significant downforce. Subaru pit a lot of effort into this with their rear wing. If you remember it has loads of vertical fins. This was to try and keep the air flowing over the rear wing in a straight-ish fashion even when the car was pretty sideways.
F1 cars used to have small wings mounted above the side-pods. Also I think a lot of rules state that the wing can't sit higher than the highest part of the car.
I do agree though that red wine really helps when it comes to thinking outside the box. Must mention that to my boss tomorrow!
Rusti's Ultima looks well done. Nice panel gap. I would have hinged the bonnet from the front though, as a safety measure.
It does seem like the way to go- having the clip split and the rear part fixed. It also solves the clearance problems with the diffuser. Only drawback is a slightly higher cost, or am I missing something?
Does anybody have the GTR as a CAD file? How accurate is it?
I wouldn't mind having a play with some design ideas.
It does seem like the way to go- having the clip split and the rear part fixed. It also solves the clearance problems with the diffuser. Only drawback is a slightly higher cost, or am I missing something?
Does anybody have the GTR as a CAD file? How accurate is it?
I wouldn't mind having a play with some design ideas.
Storer said:
Now before I start I should mention I have had a good deal of red wine, but....
Thinking out of the box, why do we put the wing at the back? If it creates downforce then why do we not put it in the middle of the car so that the downforce is evenly distributed over both axles!
Yes, it would look daft and we would loose some of the leverage effect. But are racing cars built as they are because of regulations? Would a wing in the middle of the car be more effective?
Discuss........
Paul
If a car like this is properly designed with a full underfloor/diffuser arrangement, the whole car should act like a wing in sectional view. The splitters and wings etc are merely trimming devices.Thinking out of the box, why do we put the wing at the back? If it creates downforce then why do we not put it in the middle of the car so that the downforce is evenly distributed over both axles!
Yes, it would look daft and we would loose some of the leverage effect. But are racing cars built as they are because of regulations? Would a wing in the middle of the car be more effective?
Discuss........
Paul
The issue we have found is that the on the original setup the splitter and wing are the only DF devices (understandable for a road car as this would make it totally inappropriate for the road) which is where we lost out heavily to the thoroughbred race cars on the grid. All sorted now...
V8Dom said:
If you want to see an ultima road car with the car as full aero i have a little supprise coming for you all.
its not finished yet but in its later stages of completition and will raise the bar .
its not a factory car either, and been sworn to secrecy but what ive seen is incredible.
I'll get some tissues...its not finished yet but in its later stages of completition and will raise the bar .
its not a factory car either, and been sworn to secrecy but what ive seen is incredible.
key750 said:
What about this?
https://www.instagram.com/p/ir60BvITMk/
Looks familiar...https://www.instagram.com/p/ir60BvITMk/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fk2nlZzFFBA
In case anyone is after the model I used, simply download Google Sketchup then look for "Ultima GTR" in the library to download. It's completely free and great for visualising ideas. Lots of on line tutorials I case you are like me and still remember using a BBC B computer..... :-)
Mart
Mart
Mart,
The position for the rear wing should be calculated accordingly with the amount of downforce produced by the front of car. Moving the rear wing backwards is the way to achieve more downforce at the rear (longer lever effect). Excesive rear downforce will be a handicap for the front of the car causing even flip effect. This will force you to increase the front downforce with extra canards or similar bits.
IMHO is just a matter of a correct balance. Leaving the aesthetics apart I would choose safety.
Cheers,
Javier
Some comments here.... http://www.f1technical.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=6...
The position for the rear wing should be calculated accordingly with the amount of downforce produced by the front of car. Moving the rear wing backwards is the way to achieve more downforce at the rear (longer lever effect). Excesive rear downforce will be a handicap for the front of the car causing even flip effect. This will force you to increase the front downforce with extra canards or similar bits.
IMHO is just a matter of a correct balance. Leaving the aesthetics apart I would choose safety.
Cheers,
Javier
Some comments here.... http://www.f1technical.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=6...
UltimaCH said:
For those who own or have owned older Porsche 911s will remember the factory recommendation NOT to use the "whale tail" on the rear without the front splitter. It is an aerodynamic combination.
that lead to some drivers putting their cars into the nearest hedge!I can see why Porsche told people that.
UltimaPanthera said:
key750 said:
What about this?
https://www.instagram.com/p/ir60BvITMk/
Looks familiar...https://www.instagram.com/p/ir60BvITMk/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fk2nlZzFFBA
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