More 'Audiophile' bullsh*t

[jmorgan]

gizlaroc said:

Who is Tim??

Speaking clock.

[spikey123]

Tim is a typo. I mean to say timbuctoo. Well spotted you all. No, fun time over, as you know it is " Does what it says on the tin"

I read on here that mains cable is every bit as good as expensive speaker cable, has anyone done any kind of comparison to evaluate this? I do know that the single core stuff is pants and I once had some oxygen free multi stranded speaker wire from Maplin that was absolute cr*p.

[P700DEE]

"I read on here that mains cable is every bit as good as expensive speaker cable, has anyone done any kind of comparison to evaluate this? I do know that the single core stuff is pants and I once had some oxygen free multi stranded speaker wire from Maplin that was absolute cr*p."

If you found significant differences between solid core and Oxygen free multi stranded then you cannot subscribe to the mains cable is as good as expensive cable theory. Differences in speaker cable are measurable especially those with high capacitance but you have pretty much answered your own question

[spikey123]

Not really, someone else said that the solid core mains was rubbish too, but that the multi strand was good, i just wondered if this was supported by evidence or other listeners. I have expensive russ Andrews cable

[TonyRPH]

spikey123 said:

<snip>I have expensive russ Andrews cable

And would you hear the difference if somebody swapped your Russ Andrews cable for a regular good quality mains lead without you knowing?

ETA: I meant without not with lol.

Edited by TonyRPH on Wednesday 30th April 13:14

[qube_TA]

I have the Maplin OFC cable on my speakers, the reason for buying it is that I hate the site of cables at the best of times so if I'm going to have to see some of it I want it to look better than some twin an earth. It's not like it's that much more expensive to buy.

[spikey123]

Maplin OFC, that stands for Odd Frequency Cutoff. I had some and it was the worst cable I ever used, even worse than poundlands own

[gizlaroc]

spikey123 said:

Tim is a typo. I mean to say timbuctoo. Well spotted you all. No, fun time over, as you know it is " Does what it says on the tin"

I read on here that mains cable is every bit as good as expensive speaker cable, has anyone done any kind of comparison to evaluate this? I do know that the single core stuff is pants and I once had some oxygen free multi stranded speaker wire from Maplin that was absolute cr*p.

Jesus, this is a whole new can of worms!!

Paul McGowan from PS Audio does a blog each day, and he cover mains cables over about 4 or 5 days, it is worth having a search.
Basically it was years back now before any of this, and he said that he made up a short cable out of something he had lying around to test a new amp (or simialr) as someone else had taken the power cables for other kit, and the kit sounded great. The next day he played the amp to others and it sounded thin, really thin, no bass weight at all. No one was impressed.
Same room, same cd player, same speakers, the only thing that had changed was the power cable.
He went back and found the short cable and sure enough the bass weight was back and the amp sounded great.
He played it to every one and every one agreed it sounded great with the new cable.

How the hell could 6" of cable make a difference, there was miles and miles of crap cable coming from the grid to the building, how could 6" of power cable increase the bass?

It didn't, the new power cable added nothing.

It was the older one that they threw in the box with every bit of kit was taking stuff away. The thin regular 99p cable was restricting things that was all.




This is from someone who sells cables and power conditioners though.

[Jon1967x]

Although the Olive ones were better

[gizlaroc]

Jon1967x said:

Although the Olive ones were better

I always take cotton wool with me when I know I am going to hear Naim gear too. Horrible, bright sounding ste designed by someone who has only 70% hearing and can not hear a thing above 15khz.

[Jon1967x]

gizlaroc said:

I always take cotton wool with me when I know I am going to hear Naim gear too. Horrible, bright sounding ste designed by someone who has only 70% hearing and can not hear a thing above 15khz.

A harsh and back to the "whatever floats your boat" argument. I was an Olive man for a while and it sounded more than OK in a balanced system.

Although... any make that comes out with an acronym like "PRaT" to describe their sound is obviously having a laugh at their customers.

[Crackie]

spikey123 said:

I read on here that mains cable is every bit as good as expensive speaker cable, has anyone done any kind of comparison to evaluate this? I do know that the single core stuff is pants.

How did you come to know that "the single core stuff is pants" ?

Edited by Crackie on Saturday 3rd May 09:41

[spikey123]

I tried it. I a-b tested it against other cables

[gizlaroc]

Jon1967x said:

A harsh and back to the "whatever floats your boat" argument. I was an Olive man for a while and it sounded more than OK in a balanced system.

Although... any make that comes out with an acronym like "PRaT" to describe their sound is obviously having a laugh at their customers.

I am now in my 40's and my top end is not quite as good, 16500hz it starts rolling off, so I would probably like it more now than before.
It was sort of tongue in cheek, but every Naim system I have heard I have hated.

I remember getting a demo of their system around 5 years back, there was about 20 black boxes in it, and it was embarrassingly bad. I was with a friend who runs a Levinson system into Dunlavy SC-IVs (which is a pretty dark system) and I was running Merdian pre, meridian Dac, Classe power into Dunlavys with a Rel Studio (which was also a very, very smooth sounding system) and we both sat there going red listening to it. Hand on heart we thought there was something wrong with it, the mid range was so bumped up and the overall sound so sharp it was horrible.

I just don't get it.

[Jon1967x]

gizlaroc said:

I am now in my 40's and my top end is not quite as good, 16500hz it starts rolling off, so I would probably like it more now than before.
It was sort of tongue in cheek, but every Naim system I have heard I have hated.

I remember getting a demo of their system around 5 years back, there was about 20 black boxes in it, and it was embarrassingly bad. I was with a friend who runs a Levinson system into Dunlavy SC-IVs (which is a pretty dark system) and I was running Merdian pre, meridian Dac, Classe power into Dunlavys with a Rel Studio (which was also a very, very smooth sounding system) and we both sat there going red listening to it. Hand on heart we thought there was something wrong with it, the mid range was so bumped up and the overall sound so sharp it was horrible.

I just don't get it.

My experience was 10 years or so ago, CDi, 82, 250 and the speakers were Kef Reference which I owned for a while. The Kefs (105/3 if I remember) were known to be a bit light on treble so balanced it out - there is a lot about having a balanced system. Soundstaging was as good as I've heard until recently where my power amps are now bespoke build from an independent, I stream flac to a some audiolab convertor/preamp and I've now got naim speakers - I have to say its not ideally set up, the room isn't ideal but its a happy compromise. My experience is the sound can change enormously from one system to another and each has merits and to most people it sounds wonmderful - but its personal preference. The Naim/kef was big sound, big stage, stuff coming from around the room (Madonna / Vogue with the funny phase thing they tried for a while was breathtaking in terms of imagining) but my current system feels a lot more intricate and detailed but without the weight. Bass feels a lot lighter but still deep if that makes sense - I think its just more refined and focused, stops and starts more cleanly etc. You can chase your tail on this so I started wasting/spending my money on cars instead

[gizlaroc]

Jon1967x said:

You can chase your tail on this so I started wasting/spending my money on cars instead

Haha, I go in cycles.

When I get bored of cars I buy gadgets, and then go back to cars again.
Not even sure which is cheaper.

[qube_TA]

We've all been missing out, we need cable towers!

http://6moons.com/audioreviews/dedicated2/cabletow...

[OldSkoolRS]

gizlaroc said:

Haha, I go in cycles.

When I get bored of cars I buy gadgets, and then go back to cars again.
Not even sure which is cheaper.

I'm a 'cycler' too...not on AVforums so much these days (having had a splurge on MK speakers earlier this year), better weather (hopefully) means that I've now taxed my Z3 and hope to get out in it this summer. Then there's the guitar and now drums playing various nights of the week. On the bright side this limits the time I have to focus on any one hobby and therefore curtails my spending to a degree. The other perk is that now I'm not so focused on AV my system seems better, or rather I'm just using it rather than analysing it for the next upgrade...

[spikey123]

I think the answer is to get out more. I learned to ride a motorbike and prefer the open sound of the countryside to any indoors system lol.
I am still re appraissing my Pioneer PDS901 that I recapped and modded the op amps in. I find it to be a really involving lively sound and it is 20 years old.
Has anyone found any sound improvements when wearing slippers, smoking a pipe and drinking a glass of nice Chianti slobber, slobber?

[OldSkoolRS]

I've found that my system improves as the evening goes on. Nothing to do with it warming up or such, just that by then I've got through a bottle of wine.