How much have Hi-Fi separates moved on in 15 years?
Discussion
Driller said:
gaz1234 said:
Driller said:
t, was that not a joke then? It's just that Sonos is being pushed so hard on this forum these days it has become the automatic answer to everything like "MX5".On reflection, it not being a joke made it even funnier
As a couple of lads have already said have a look at the second hand market, there is some seriously well priced kit to be had, mostly boxed and in awesome condition.
The beauty is you can play with it, set it up and if it's not your taste move it on again for no loss, often even make a shilling on it.
I heard a couple of sonos/expensive sound bars/Richer sounds systems mates had shelled out on and decided to have a play on the second hand market to see what could be done.
I started picking up stuff last year and it's become a real good hoot.
Here's my main stereo set up at present............although it'll probably change next week
I reckon to get the sort of sound and quality this chucks out you'd need to spend 6k plus on new stuff, it's made a few mates junk their AV amps and multi speaker set ups!!!!
Also here's a selection of integrated amps I've recently acquired, only yesterday I put 5 of them back to back to pick one for the system in my play room!!
They range from decent-ish to bloody brilliant.
As I say it's all good fun and not over heavy on the wallet.........although Mrs is now muttering about the 5 sets of speakers that are "waiting to be moved on"
The beauty is you can play with it, set it up and if it's not your taste move it on again for no loss, often even make a shilling on it.
I heard a couple of sonos/expensive sound bars/Richer sounds systems mates had shelled out on and decided to have a play on the second hand market to see what could be done.
I started picking up stuff last year and it's become a real good hoot.
Here's my main stereo set up at present............although it'll probably change next week
I reckon to get the sort of sound and quality this chucks out you'd need to spend 6k plus on new stuff, it's made a few mates junk their AV amps and multi speaker set ups!!!!
Also here's a selection of integrated amps I've recently acquired, only yesterday I put 5 of them back to back to pick one for the system in my play room!!
They range from decent-ish to bloody brilliant.
As I say it's all good fun and not over heavy on the wallet.........although Mrs is now muttering about the 5 sets of speakers that are "waiting to be moved on"
I have an old Sony Scala 2 separates system sitting in the cupboard upstairs. All perfect working order and no scratches, even has a minidisc player that doesn't work so well! Bought it new in 1996 with a pair of Mission 733 floor standers and it sounds really nice but I have since upgraded and don't know what to do with it. I don't believe in throwing away perfectly good equipment.
Edited by anonymous-user on Sunday 20th July 12:32
CIS121 said:
I've got a system that sounds great - a Yamaha Ax392 Amp and some black MDF covered B&W floorstanders.
The floor standers have suffered water damage to one box and look dreadful. I was considering replacing them with Dali Zensor 1's at about £200, but wondering would I get a much better sound by replacing the amp as well and going for higher quality speakers at say £1k for both or am I getting into the law of diminishing returns?
£1000 budget ?The floor standers have suffered water damage to one box and look dreadful. I was considering replacing them with Dali Zensor 1's at about £200, but wondering would I get a much better sound by replacing the amp as well and going for higher quality speakers at say £1k for both or am I getting into the law of diminishing returns?
http://www.krksys.com/krk-studio-monitor-speakers/...
http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/may12/articles/krk... Currently £800.00
+
http://www.aune.co.uk/aune-x1-mk2.html currently £145.00
40 years ago I was a real HiFi buff running concrete horns with an SME arm, Shure M75 EJ cartridge on a Garrard turntable and Lowther Super Acousta units in the horns with a Quad amplifier driving the set up and a Quad FM tuner giving decent radio reception.
The horns were a real nuisance because of the sheer space they occupy but the bass reproduction is still the best I ever managed to produce and with the very high flux in the Lowther units the brilliance of the response and massive power output was way beyond the level needed for home use. Turning the volume up produced prodigious output but the plasterboard ceilings objected and the boards started flexing in their mountings with the plastebard nail heads breaking through. I was never able to use more than a maximum of one tenth of the amplifiers output.
Although there has been a significant improvement in overall capability and design and Class A amplifiers are better the improvents over that set up are marginal IMO although i do not claim to be an expert at all in any way on modern hi fi.There may well have been an improvement over the last fifteen years but I am no longer as exacting as I was and quite happy personally with much lesser (in theory) equipment using Monitor reference speakers and Cambridge audio equipment.
Live transmissions on public broadcasting seems to me to be very the best form of transmitted music today. I find both DVD's and CD's compress the overall sound and I am no longer picky enough to return to vinyl although some of these with appropriate equipment can produce a remarkably open sound. Better IMO than the digital media but again simplicity appeals.
In reality I think once the Quad and the other associated specialists of that era in high fi had developed stereo recording and reproduction to the best levels back in the 1970's the really big improvements were already extent. There have been changes and modern media is much more robust and simple to use but in terms of sound quality I think the digital age has not really moved things on except in the robust nature and portability and diminutive size of the equipment. Surprisingly given the age, I am not a valve fan except for my personal guitar amplification which is Marshal valve based. I prefer the warmer sound of the valve amp with blue guitar playing. Just personal choice I find the transistorised power amps accentuate the treble above the level I prefer.
The horns were a real nuisance because of the sheer space they occupy but the bass reproduction is still the best I ever managed to produce and with the very high flux in the Lowther units the brilliance of the response and massive power output was way beyond the level needed for home use. Turning the volume up produced prodigious output but the plasterboard ceilings objected and the boards started flexing in their mountings with the plastebard nail heads breaking through. I was never able to use more than a maximum of one tenth of the amplifiers output.
Although there has been a significant improvement in overall capability and design and Class A amplifiers are better the improvents over that set up are marginal IMO although i do not claim to be an expert at all in any way on modern hi fi.There may well have been an improvement over the last fifteen years but I am no longer as exacting as I was and quite happy personally with much lesser (in theory) equipment using Monitor reference speakers and Cambridge audio equipment.
Live transmissions on public broadcasting seems to me to be very the best form of transmitted music today. I find both DVD's and CD's compress the overall sound and I am no longer picky enough to return to vinyl although some of these with appropriate equipment can produce a remarkably open sound. Better IMO than the digital media but again simplicity appeals.
In reality I think once the Quad and the other associated specialists of that era in high fi had developed stereo recording and reproduction to the best levels back in the 1970's the really big improvements were already extent. There have been changes and modern media is much more robust and simple to use but in terms of sound quality I think the digital age has not really moved things on except in the robust nature and portability and diminutive size of the equipment. Surprisingly given the age, I am not a valve fan except for my personal guitar amplification which is Marshal valve based. I prefer the warmer sound of the valve amp with blue guitar playing. Just personal choice I find the transistorised power amps accentuate the treble above the level I prefer.
Thanks for all the help folks. After looking at a lot of reviews I'm going to go for the Q Acoustics 2050i. I'm sure there are better used bargains on Ebay, but I've got to factor in my limited knowledge and also time and the 2050i seems very popular and something that I shouldn't go too far wrong with
FlossyThePig said:
With all the research into psychoacoustics at the moment the could be some interesting things coming along.
I'm not sure if the audiophile will like it though.
But much of it is here already, what with the different surround sound formats and then the psuedo 5 / 6 / 7 (.1) formats form a stereo source.I'm not sure if the audiophile will like it though.
But just like the old quadrophonic recordings from back in the 70's, I've yet to hear anything better than a proper stereo mix.
But any recording is essentially only a representation of a performance (whether is be live or studio).
Perhaps it's just what I'm used to - but I certainly don't find myself wishing for more ambience etc. when I'm listening to music - which means I'm happy what what I have!
kenny.R400 said:
As I say it's all good fun and not over heavy on the wallet.........although Mrs is now muttering about the 5 sets of speakers that are "waiting to be moved on"
If Mrs-C ever looks in the loft and finds the stash of stuff I've "moved on" there'll be an interesting conversation. I'm also a big fan of the eBay approach to building hi-fi systems. There are some bargains out there but also other stuff (NAD 3020s as an example) that seem to go for top dollar.CIS121 said:
Thanks for all the help folks. After looking at a lot of reviews I'm going to go for the Q Acoustics 2050i. I'm sure there are better used bargains on Ebay, but I've got to factor in my limited knowledge and also time and the 2050i seems very popular and something that I shouldn't go too far wrong with
Not a bad pick. I had the older QA 1050s prior to the B&W 685s I am about to sell. They are a nice speaker but are not in the same league as B&W. Did you demo them? The QA 1050s I had were very bass light for a floor stander.0a said:
Driller said:
gaz1234 said:
Driller said:
t, was that not a joke then? It's just that Sonos is being pushed so hard on this forum these days it has become the automatic answer to everything like "MX5".On reflection, it not being a joke made it even funnier
- **ing expensive one.
And it's not like the sound is all that? Is there a reason people buy them other than the apple clause, ie I'm (probably rich and middle class and) prepared to be rinsed to have the k3wL3st brand?
OP: Demo. In a shop. Seriously.
hairyben said:
- **ing expensive one.
And it's not like the sound is all that? Is there a reason people buy them other than the apple clause, ie I'm (probably rich and middle class and) prepared to be rinsed to have the k3wL3st brand?
OP: Demo. In a shop. Seriously.
Good post.
Bought the 2050is. Absolutely love them - they're noticeably crisper than my old DM220s and I can enjoy music at a lower volume than before. Wish I'd bought these before!
One last thing that needs an upgrading is my old pocket mp3/FLAC player:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Sony-NWZE585-Walkman-Video...
I'm guessing I can get a much better sound from something dedicated. The Denon DNP720AE and Cambridge Audio Sonata NP30 both get good reviews - anyone got one of these?
One last thing that needs an upgrading is my old pocket mp3/FLAC player:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Sony-NWZE585-Walkman-Video...
I'm guessing I can get a much better sound from something dedicated. The Denon DNP720AE and Cambridge Audio Sonata NP30 both get good reviews - anyone got one of these?
With the Cambridge and Denon (most network players!) you'll need some form of storage for your music etc.
Although most of them will play from a USB stick (and in some cases a USB HDD too).
Have a look on Ebay for the players made by Aune.
ETA: Something like this.
Although most of them will play from a USB stick (and in some cases a USB HDD too).
Have a look on Ebay for the players made by Aune.
ETA: Something like this.
Edited by TonyRPH on Wednesday 23 July 15:17
Some thoughts:
- Speakers are really bound by the laws of physics, i.e. box sizes, cones etc. Different techologies for implimentation have been around now for decades, e.g. normal ported speakers (presently the most common), sealed box, electrostatics, ribbons and horns.
- Analogue circuits and power supplies are generally unchanged
- Mechanical engineering is most important to turntables, and whilst we have new materials to use (e.g. CF is now very common in decks), it's still expensive to precision engineer components
- Silicon is the only real area of change (e.g. supported higher resolutions, upsampling etc), but personally my belief is that the implementation is far more important than the £5 silicon chip being used
The real changes in stereo kit has been the move to follow new trends, e.g. "more wife acceptable" smaller speakers, the use of subs etc. Personally I think they've been mainly sideways moves.
As an example of that, I'm using 15 year old speakers, AV processor from 10 years ago, power amp from a similar time, and it was still capable of competing with a Linn system fronted by a brand new streamer/pre-amp combo costing nearly £9k.
Ah yes, streaming, now THAT has been a genuine area of improvement with the move to dedicated streamers that can actually do a good job with digital music in a very user friendly way. Love that.
- Speakers are really bound by the laws of physics, i.e. box sizes, cones etc. Different techologies for implimentation have been around now for decades, e.g. normal ported speakers (presently the most common), sealed box, electrostatics, ribbons and horns.
- Analogue circuits and power supplies are generally unchanged
- Mechanical engineering is most important to turntables, and whilst we have new materials to use (e.g. CF is now very common in decks), it's still expensive to precision engineer components
- Silicon is the only real area of change (e.g. supported higher resolutions, upsampling etc), but personally my belief is that the implementation is far more important than the £5 silicon chip being used
The real changes in stereo kit has been the move to follow new trends, e.g. "more wife acceptable" smaller speakers, the use of subs etc. Personally I think they've been mainly sideways moves.
As an example of that, I'm using 15 year old speakers, AV processor from 10 years ago, power amp from a similar time, and it was still capable of competing with a Linn system fronted by a brand new streamer/pre-amp combo costing nearly £9k.
Ah yes, streaming, now THAT has been a genuine area of improvement with the move to dedicated streamers that can actually do a good job with digital music in a very user friendly way. Love that.
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