Hi end home cinema speaker recommendations
Discussion
Thank you all for the education. I'm a little out of the game, so it is a learning curve.
One thing for sure is that Sarah's going to be pissed to hear that I need more mono-blocks! At least the cost of these (about £500 a pair for the British - superior to the Chinese made -) M's shall be covered by being able to use the 752's to the front.
This afternoon I'm going to pop to see Andy at Nottingham hi-fi centre to get his recommendations too. What they don't know isn't worth knowing IME.
One thing for sure is that Sarah's going to be pissed to hear that I need more mono-blocks! At least the cost of these (about £500 a pair for the British - superior to the Chinese made -) M's shall be covered by being able to use the 752's to the front.
This afternoon I'm going to pop to see Andy at Nottingham hi-fi centre to get his recommendations too. What they don't know isn't worth knowing IME.
I suspect your money would be better spent on a mid range A/V receiver.
Yamaha / Pioneer / Denon all do some good stuff in the £500 range (and often less).
Buying an A/V receiver will enable you to control the HDMI from your various sources, and will also allow for lip sync correction and a host of other features.
As good as the TAG stuff is - it's outdated now.
There are loads of high end receivers on Ebay at terrific prices, but they all lack HDMI (like your TAG).
You could sell all the kit you have, and probably get yourself a decent receiver and be part way to a set of speakers with the outcome.
My advice is not to spend any more money on your existing system, unless you are wanting stereo only.
Yamaha / Pioneer / Denon all do some good stuff in the £500 range (and often less).
Buying an A/V receiver will enable you to control the HDMI from your various sources, and will also allow for lip sync correction and a host of other features.
As good as the TAG stuff is - it's outdated now.
There are loads of high end receivers on Ebay at terrific prices, but they all lack HDMI (like your TAG).
You could sell all the kit you have, and probably get yourself a decent receiver and be part way to a set of speakers with the outcome.
My advice is not to spend any more money on your existing system, unless you are wanting stereo only.
TonyRPH said:
I suspect your money would be better spent on a mid range A/V receiver.
Yamaha / Pioneer / Denon all do some good stuff in the £500 range (and often less).
Buying an A/V receiver will enable you to control the HDMI from your various sources, and will also allow for lip sync correction and a host of other features.
As good as the TAG stuff is - it's outdated now.
There are loads of high end receivers on Ebay at terrific prices, but they all lack HDMI (like your TAG).
You could sell all the kit you have, and probably get yourself a decent receiver and be part way to a set of speakers with the outcome.
My advice is not to spend any more money on your existing system, unless you are wanting stereo only.
Agreed in principle. Modern AV amps allow 4k sources, they have apps to control them, they allow separate speaker zones in another room, and they decode the myriad of sound encoding schemes that you get from Apple TV, Amazon Fire TV boxes, Playstations, X Boxes, BD and UHD BD players, and so on. They come with Spotify and the like for casual listening, and can normally read FLAC files directly from a NAS. Having got an AV amp with pre-outs you could still power the floorstanders from the monoblocs, the AV amp then does the lighter load of rears and centre. The sub is self-powered anyway. Having a sub takes quite a bit of load off the mains so you might find the monoblocs are superflous - it is a small room.Yamaha / Pioneer / Denon all do some good stuff in the £500 range (and often less).
Buying an A/V receiver will enable you to control the HDMI from your various sources, and will also allow for lip sync correction and a host of other features.
As good as the TAG stuff is - it's outdated now.
There are loads of high end receivers on Ebay at terrific prices, but they all lack HDMI (like your TAG).
You could sell all the kit you have, and probably get yourself a decent receiver and be part way to a set of speakers with the outcome.
My advice is not to spend any more money on your existing system, unless you are wanting stereo only.
Fermit The Krog and Sexy Sarah said:
The existing kit is staying. I've always wanted a Tag/Audiolab set up (since I worked at Nottm Hifi Centre 21 years ago!) and I've spent a lot of time sourcing it all.
Then you'll have a redundant stereo only preamp...Simplest thing to do is source a decent sub and go 2.1 for a while to see how you get on - the scale and depth added matters more to me than any surround effect.
legzr1 said:
Fermit The Krog and Sexy Sarah said:
The existing kit is staying. I've always wanted a Tag/Audiolab set up (since I worked at Nottm Hifi Centre 21 years ago!) and I've spent a lot of time sourcing it all.
Then you'll have a redundant stereo only preamp...Simplest thing to do is source a decent sub and go 2.1 for a while to see how you get on - the scale and depth added matters more to me than any surround effect.
TonyRPH said:
I suspect your money would be better spent on a mid range A/V receiver.
Yamaha / Pioneer / Denon all do some good stuff in the £500 range (and often less).
Buying an A/V receiver will enable you to control the HDMI from your various sources, and will also allow for lip sync correction and a host of other features.
As good as the TAG stuff is - it's outdated now.
There are loads of high end receivers on Ebay at terrific prices, but they all lack HDMI (like your TAG).
You could sell all the kit you have, and probably get yourself a decent receiver and be part way to a set of speakers with the outcome.
My advice is not to spend any more money on your existing system, unless you are wanting stereo only.
I just about prefered my AV32R with Dolby Digital to Mid Range AVR's (Denon and Onkyo, £900ish IIRC) with Dolby TrueHD or whatever is on Blurays. It was swings and roundabouts, you get more detail and impact with the AVR but you loose that smooth refinement and space that better amps give you. That was about 7 or 8 years ago.Yamaha / Pioneer / Denon all do some good stuff in the £500 range (and often less).
Buying an A/V receiver will enable you to control the HDMI from your various sources, and will also allow for lip sync correction and a host of other features.
As good as the TAG stuff is - it's outdated now.
There are loads of high end receivers on Ebay at terrific prices, but they all lack HDMI (like your TAG).
You could sell all the kit you have, and probably get yourself a decent receiver and be part way to a set of speakers with the outcome.
My advice is not to spend any more money on your existing system, unless you are wanting stereo only.
With music however there was no contest, are AVR's now better for music? I've read some good things about Pioneer but not heard them.
The way I see it, good speakers and amps are good speakers and amps, it doesn't matter when they were made. Yes the DAC/ processing in the TAG is getting on a bit but it's still a good match for the rest.
I agree it would be cheaper to sell off the TAG/ Audiolab gear and buy and AVR, you would get more functionality and it would be easier to use, but it won't sound as good, especially if you use the syetm to listen to music.
As has already been said, setup the system as 2.0 (DVD(via optical/ coax)->AV32R->8000Ms->752Fs) or 2.1 and see how it goes, the AVR can do a phantom centre with DD or just leave it as a stereo system with PCM.
Mr_Yogi said:
With music however there was no contest, are AVR's now better for music? I've read some good things about Pioneer but not heard them.
I agree - music is still likely to sound better with the TAG, although obviously it will depend on the (modern) AVR concerned.To match the TAG for music playback would probably take a fairly high end AVR although that's not a given these days with modern DACs etc.
Mr_Yogi said:
The way I see it, good speakers and amps are good speakers and amps, it doesn't matter when they were made. Yes the DAC/ processing in the TAG is getting on a bit but it's still a good match for the rest.
I agree - I was primarily referring to the processing and connectivity (HDMI) of 'modern' receivers.OK, an update, having been to Nottm hifi centre. They suggested an amp called the Arcam P429, as it is 4 channel. This would mean it can serve 2x rear and centre, leaving the 8000m's to drive the 752's. A very considered cost at £1600.
The other alternative is to acquire 3 more 8000m's. Cheaper at probably £750, but that would be 5x monoblocks, Sarah would love that! (she may just have to lump it.)
Rears, they suggested that B&W M1's or Kef E301's would be fine, as would my existing Celestion Little Ones, due to the limited work they do. Obviously, put them on the front and you'd notice their limitations.
Centre, he suggested the Kef 301, which I need to research, not sure. I think he was trying to work within budget, aiming for the best for the money. I personally am leaning more to a second hand Mission 78c, to match the 752's sound style.
Oh, and I bought an active sub, a KEF Q400B, £300 reduced from £500, and they've bought the last stock.
The 8000c as others have informed me, shall now be redundant, with the AV32 taking it's place. If anyone wants it (mint condition, British made not Chinese example) for £250 (what I bought it for) then let me know.
The other alternative is to acquire 3 more 8000m's. Cheaper at probably £750, but that would be 5x monoblocks, Sarah would love that! (she may just have to lump it.)
Rears, they suggested that B&W M1's or Kef E301's would be fine, as would my existing Celestion Little Ones, due to the limited work they do. Obviously, put them on the front and you'd notice their limitations.
Centre, he suggested the Kef 301, which I need to research, not sure. I think he was trying to work within budget, aiming for the best for the money. I personally am leaning more to a second hand Mission 78c, to match the 752's sound style.
Oh, and I bought an active sub, a KEF Q400B, £300 reduced from £500, and they've bought the last stock.
The 8000c as others have informed me, shall now be redundant, with the AV32 taking it's place. If anyone wants it (mint condition, British made not Chinese example) for £250 (what I bought it for) then let me know.
I'm fascinated by the apparent price fixing on hifi equipment.
I looked at several dealer websites, and every one of then had the amp for £1599.
One would almost suspect there is a cartel...
@OP - I guess you plan is to use one of the monoblocks for the centre channel then?
Regarding that Arcam amp - reading the marketing blurb they rave on about "class g" as if it was something new.
The NAD2200 (+ other NAD amps) have used class g since the 80's and it was originally developed by Hitachi IIRC.
Class G is also not known for extremely low levels of distortion, due to commutation effects in the design (it basically switches between power supply rails according to power output demand).
I looked at several dealer websites, and every one of then had the amp for £1599.
One would almost suspect there is a cartel...
@OP - I guess you plan is to use one of the monoblocks for the centre channel then?
Regarding that Arcam amp - reading the marketing blurb they rave on about "class g" as if it was something new.
The NAD2200 (+ other NAD amps) have used class g since the 80's and it was originally developed by Hitachi IIRC.
Class G is also not known for extremely low levels of distortion, due to commutation effects in the design (it basically switches between power supply rails according to power output demand).
TonyRPH said:
I'm fascinated by the apparent price fixing on hifi equipment.
I looked at several dealer websites, and every one of then had the amp for £1599.
One would almost suspect there is a cartel...
@OP - I guess you plan is to use one of the monoblocks for the centre channel then?
Regarding that Arcam amp - reading the marketing blurb they rave on about "class g" as if it was something new.
The NAD2200 (+ other NAD amps) have used class g since the 80's and it was originally developed by Hitachi IIRC.
Class G is also not known for extremely low levels of distortion, due to commutation effects in the design (it basically switches between power supply rails according to power output demand).
If going down the monoblock route it shall be 5 in total, one for each speaker, except the sub which is active. I looked at several dealer websites, and every one of then had the amp for £1599.
One would almost suspect there is a cartel...
@OP - I guess you plan is to use one of the monoblocks for the centre channel then?
Regarding that Arcam amp - reading the marketing blurb they rave on about "class g" as if it was something new.
The NAD2200 (+ other NAD amps) have used class g since the 80's and it was originally developed by Hitachi IIRC.
Class G is also not known for extremely low levels of distortion, due to commutation effects in the design (it basically switches between power supply rails according to power output demand).
All I'm concerned about is if it sounds good, which according to reviews I've read suggest it should, as would the mono block option I'd say.
Is the £1600 Arcam a power amp?
If so, I'd save around £400 and go for this (yes, it's used but they're excellent amps - if you follow the trail you'll find a post from me trying to buy it a few months ago!) :
https://www.avforums.com/threads/halcro-mc50-high-...
If so, I'd save around £400 and go for this (yes, it's used but they're excellent amps - if you follow the trail you'll find a post from me trying to buy it a few months ago!) :
https://www.avforums.com/threads/halcro-mc50-high-...
Fermit The Krog and Sexy Sarah said:
If going down the monoblock route it shall be 5 in total, one for each speaker, except the sub which is active.
All I'm concerned about is if it sounds good, which according to reviews I've read suggest it should, as would the mono block option I'd say.
5 monos is surely overkill, there is no need for monos for the rears. Just get any Audiolab stereo power amp. I think I would rather biamp my fronts with 4 8000Ms before I used mono's for the rears All I'm concerned about is if it sounds good, which according to reviews I've read suggest it should, as would the mono block option I'd say.
BTW just been able to see your photos, is that AV32R a DP, noticed the Avant Garde badging? If so that will sound epic, do not be tempted to chuck it in for an AVR. However 250MRs or 8000MB's could be considered?
Mr_Yogi said:
Fermit The Krog and Sexy Sarah said:
If going down the monoblock route it shall be 5 in total, one for each speaker, except the sub which is active.
All I'm concerned about is if it sounds good, which according to reviews I've read suggest it should, as would the mono block option I'd say.
5 monos is surely overkill, there is no need for monos for the rears. Just get any Audiolab stereo power amp. I think I would rather biamp my fronts with 4 8000Ms before I used mono's for the rears All I'm concerned about is if it sounds good, which according to reviews I've read suggest it should, as would the mono block option I'd say.
BTW just been able to see your photos, is that AV32R a DP, noticed the Avant Garde badging? If so that will sound epic, do not be tempted to chuck it in for an AVR. However 250MRs or 8000MB's could be considered?
Rather liked a nice £10000 pair of KEFs they had in there, but £10K, on a pair of speakers, car money that! I'll look at the regular power amp comment, hadn't thought, of course, two channel.
Edit. Surely I need three channels (NHFC said I'd need 3x 8000M's if going down this route) do any Audiolab power amps support 3 channels? An M-PWR?
Edited by Fermit The Krog and Sexy Sarah on Friday 24th March 21:57
Would this - http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Audiolab-8000X7-/2224486... work?
Would it be overkill? consider also that in time (bigger house, + when funds allow) there may in the future be some serious upgrading to the centre and rear speakers.
Bet it shall shoot up in price mind!
Would it be overkill? consider also that in time (bigger house, + when funds allow) there may in the future be some serious upgrading to the centre and rear speakers.
Bet it shall shoot up in price mind!
TonyRPH said:
I'm fascinated by the apparent price fixing on hifi equipment.
I looked at several dealer websites, and every one of then had the amp for £1599.
One would almost suspect there is a cartel...
Ain't that the truth...I looked at several dealer websites, and every one of then had the amp for £1599.
One would almost suspect there is a cartel...
...I'm finalising a spec for a cinema room upgrade (7.1.4 and projector) and have been looking at the Anthem MRX 1120 which has the same price absolutely anywhere you look. £4400 list price and not a penny less. Seems a bit...unlikely...in the modern age.
Fermit The Krog and Sexy Sarah said:
Would this - http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Audiolab-8000X7-/2224486... work?
Would it be overkill? consider also that in time (bigger house, + when funds allow) there may in the future be some serious upgrading to the centre and rear speakers.
Bet it shall shoot up in price mind!
That would work fine, you could even use the spare 2 channels to bi amp the 752Fs Would it be overkill? consider also that in time (bigger house, + when funds allow) there may in the future be some serious upgrading to the centre and rear speakers.
Bet it shall shoot up in price mind!
It's the same type of amp I suggested in an earlier post; such as the NAD T955 and T975.Regarding a stereo power amp for the rears instead of 2 mono power amps; you could use a cheaper stereo power amp (something like an 8000P and I think they also did a cheaper 60W power amp but I can't remember the model) instead of 2 expensive monoblocs. You would end up with 3 x mono amps (for the front three) and a stereo amp for the rears, it cuts the box count by 1, should be cheaper and easier to find.
The AV32R DP or Dual Processor, was the near final version of the AV32R and had much more processing power and better components throughout compared to the original AV32R or the uprated AV32R 192 with the better DAC. I think it was well over £4K new!
Gassing Station | Home Cinema & Hi-Fi | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff