TVR Racing - Your thoughts please
Discussion
YRRunner said:
Drumroll said:
The other side is why should you be concerned how many people turn up to watch TVR's race. The gate money goes to the circuits, so even if an event gets 15,000 spectators the cost of your entry won't go down.
Correct, that's why it has nothing to do with trying to reduce the costs of race entry. Most of us would just appreciate seeing banks of TVR's and their owners cheering us on. It's a spectator sport after all and as I said previously, it has to be better entertainment than meeting at a country house for a boring Kodak moment. Admittedly, the more spectators come to watch, the bigger our exposure, and this could ultimately lead to getting some TV coverage. TV coverage could lead to securing new sponsors, which would inevitably help us fund our racing. It would also keep brand TVR in the public eye. You only need to look as far as Fun Cup to see how well it can be done and how strong a following it has now. Granted, they do have the advantage of stupendous race support and really attractive hospitality, on a par with Maserati Trofeo!It's only about 5/6 weekends through the summer and they could easily be the big Tiv meets of the year. I'm sure owners and businesses would rather support the TC than the National Trust?
I guess its all about what interests you. Some of the TVRCC people I know are only interested in runs out that involve hotels or maybe retail opportunities, other things being seen as stood around in fields and boring.
Personally I enjoy the Motorsport side and try to get to events that are reasonably local incl DTEC and the hillclimbs. It helps if you know some like minded people and the days involve watching and chatting. Often in the DTEC paddock drivers have time to chat but are also often quite busy sorting things out and getting ready for the next race/qually, etc.so chatting is not always at the top of their list - quite understandably.
I am lucky that a few members of my local TVRCC region are having a go at sprinting and also a couple race so there are people who I know and can talk to which makes you feel involved.I enjoy the DTEC but with grids of maybe 20 or so and various classes the field does get strung out which can mean less actual close stuff but when it is close it is excellent!
It would be nice if it was better supported. The comments about Oulton and the bit above cascades being not as busy is correct but then maybe mid October is not the best time to get everyone there when it might be quite chilly and inevitably there is some waiting around involved and you do have to entertain yourself during those periods - perhaps people think they need to be entertained all the time but real life is not like that and sometimes you get back what you put in.
I will be there at Oulton this year (all being well) and also at Harewood and some other places to cheer on the guys so come on and give it a go.
Jim
Personally I enjoy the Motorsport side and try to get to events that are reasonably local incl DTEC and the hillclimbs. It helps if you know some like minded people and the days involve watching and chatting. Often in the DTEC paddock drivers have time to chat but are also often quite busy sorting things out and getting ready for the next race/qually, etc.so chatting is not always at the top of their list - quite understandably.
I am lucky that a few members of my local TVRCC region are having a go at sprinting and also a couple race so there are people who I know and can talk to which makes you feel involved.I enjoy the DTEC but with grids of maybe 20 or so and various classes the field does get strung out which can mean less actual close stuff but when it is close it is excellent!
It would be nice if it was better supported. The comments about Oulton and the bit above cascades being not as busy is correct but then maybe mid October is not the best time to get everyone there when it might be quite chilly and inevitably there is some waiting around involved and you do have to entertain yourself during those periods - perhaps people think they need to be entertained all the time but real life is not like that and sometimes you get back what you put in.
I will be there at Oulton this year (all being well) and also at Harewood and some other places to cheer on the guys so come on and give it a go.
Jim
I like donkeyapple's post above ^^ maybe the tvrcc should hold it's flagship event at a race circuit instead of a stately home? One for a member to suggest, I've not been in the cc for years.
I also don't think there ever were the big spectator crowds post factory involvement were there? There were quite a few spectators at some brands and oulton rounds but they were the exception rather than the rule. I remember pembrey in the freezing cold with 5 race cars and fewer spectators.
I think you've just got to accept that the racing isn't really that interesting for the majority of owners. I've been involved to a very small degree in a few of the race cars over the years and even I get bored of the racing .. it's not exactly touring cars for excitement is it? Come to that, even touring cars isn't touring cars of old. Nostalgia, it ain't what it used to be is it?
Fact is that people who like tvr racing will turn up, the rest won't. I don't think adding any bells and whistles to what is essentially a fixed basic package will do much to change that,shame though it is.
I also don't think there ever were the big spectator crowds post factory involvement were there? There were quite a few spectators at some brands and oulton rounds but they were the exception rather than the rule. I remember pembrey in the freezing cold with 5 race cars and fewer spectators.
I think you've just got to accept that the racing isn't really that interesting for the majority of owners. I've been involved to a very small degree in a few of the race cars over the years and even I get bored of the racing .. it's not exactly touring cars for excitement is it? Come to that, even touring cars isn't touring cars of old. Nostalgia, it ain't what it used to be is it?
Fact is that people who like tvr racing will turn up, the rest won't. I don't think adding any bells and whistles to what is essentially a fixed basic package will do much to change that,shame though it is.
I Think that's a great idea to hold the flagship event at a racing event, with the amount of people attending it must get at least a few more people interested in attending future race meetings.
How many people have been hooked on events after there first meet. Whatever sporting occasion.
Colin
How many people have been hooked on events after there first meet. Whatever sporting occasion.
Colin
I echo the last few posts.
There's doing and there's watching.
I love track days.....but as a driver, not just as a spectator/passenger.
If you are seriously into fast powerful cars like TVRs there's not that much fun in watching. You want to be driving.
But many of us don't have the budget to race, and if we could afford a few grand frankly we would be in something cheap and cheerful. I get the firm impression that the TC is £30k+ for the car, and probably as much again to do the season?
Correct me please if I am wrong. I do realise that some could spanner their own cars, but I couldn't. And I do realise that one could get a Chim to race standard for £15-20k, it doesn't have to be an original TC car. But the tales I hear are all about smashed cars, blown engines, broken gearboxes and disintegrating differentials.
There's doing and there's watching.
I love track days.....but as a driver, not just as a spectator/passenger.
If you are seriously into fast powerful cars like TVRs there's not that much fun in watching. You want to be driving.
But many of us don't have the budget to race, and if we could afford a few grand frankly we would be in something cheap and cheerful. I get the firm impression that the TC is £30k+ for the car, and probably as much again to do the season?
Correct me please if I am wrong. I do realise that some could spanner their own cars, but I couldn't. And I do realise that one could get a Chim to race standard for £15-20k, it doesn't have to be an original TC car. But the tales I hear are all about smashed cars, blown engines, broken gearboxes and disintegrating differentials.
If those costs were true I can assure you I wouldnt be racing!! Our car was bought crash damaged and as a front running class B Griff stood us under 15k including buying it, though we did most ourselves in house.
I generally budget around 1k a.race weekend without damage. A full season inc prep is probably around 8k for me (without major damage). When I raced in class C (Tasmin) car was cheap as was racing, and I was at the front of the class! A friend and I shared the car and including buying the car we did a full season for about 4.5k each (and the car was 4k!!). It can be done cheaply, though maybe not if you go ajp tuscan lol.
There is talk of several cars in build.for this year so hopefully 20+ grids will.be a norm. And thats a great idea about having flagship cc meetings at a race meeting! Just need to make it happen...
Some.good ideas being banded about at the moment though, hopefully some will actually happen.
I generally budget around 1k a.race weekend without damage. A full season inc prep is probably around 8k for me (without major damage). When I raced in class C (Tasmin) car was cheap as was racing, and I was at the front of the class! A friend and I shared the car and including buying the car we did a full season for about 4.5k each (and the car was 4k!!). It can be done cheaply, though maybe not if you go ajp tuscan lol.
There is talk of several cars in build.for this year so hopefully 20+ grids will.be a norm. And thats a great idea about having flagship cc meetings at a race meeting! Just need to make it happen...
Some.good ideas being banded about at the moment though, hopefully some will actually happen.
No worries! Dont get me wrong people.can and do spend lots but it doesnt have to cost silly money... A lot of people have misconseptions about how much (or how little) it can be done for. Class C is a cheap class, pretty standard cars meaning things shouldnt really break. Class B engines or obviously more prone to breaking (full race rv8 mainly) but no more than a highly modded road car?? And still cheaper than ajp to fix. My gearbox is a gearbox man box from about 2000!! Been opened twice in its lifetime...
Cant comment on class A costs though as not there yet...
Most of us have nothing to hide though so ask away at race meetings. You are free to look under/over my car too if you are building one! Nothing is secretive with us really as Id likd.more.people on track to beat... ;-p
Cant comment on class A costs though as not there yet...
Most of us have nothing to hide though so ask away at race meetings. You are free to look under/over my car too if you are building one! Nothing is secretive with us really as Id likd.more.people on track to beat... ;-p
My costs are about the same in an RV8 tuscan I budget on 1k an hour, but that includes lifing things and end of season rebuilds.. a race weekend is an hours running..
Im normally fairly light on the car, for example I've raced the tuscan since 2005 and only on my 3rd set of front pads and 2nd set of rears !! some people ( who are generally much slower) can go through a set of disks and pads every few races !!!
My 5ltr engine is just a modded tvr rover from a 5ltr griff with a dry sump, running through throttle bodies, again in the 8 years I've run that engine its had to be refreshed 3 times
a) dropped a core plug and overheated
b) Spun a main after swarf in oil pump
c) heads warped, must have overheated after the end of a 1 hour race. still took pole at next race with no compression on 1 pot !
Gearboxes, I've had 1 jam in gear and take 3 attempts by the builder to sort it ! broken one layshaft, and one a bearing on the input shaft that smashed a gear.
Diffs have all been fine, i rotate 2 to keep them fresh
I've not broken a half shaft but probably will at some point. although again we do take them out to inspect a lot and change cv's when they show wear
Accidents
1) cadwell jammed throttle in testing
2) cadwell after rebuilding from 1 over the weekend, an oil union broke and went off on own oil
3) Spun after running wide at rivage and damaged rear corner of body work ( finished race)
4) Spun halfway down hanger straight in october and damaged front and front right suspension.
Dont forget thats over 10 years of racing 1 overall dtec win and 2 class championship wins and a win rate in he races of over 50 % ( the other 50% were eithe podium or dnf. dnfs usually minor things that stopped the car, electrical fault, puncture etc or not happy with something so parked it) so I drive it fairly hard. accidents 1 and 2 were related and the same weekend doh... I've not had any car on car other than a small bit of rubbing every now and then but nothing that wouldnt t-cut out.
you can increase the cost by spending loads on tyres but i tend not to , and testing obviously adds to the seasons cost. The year I won overall my total spend was 6.5k!
The cheapest way to get into TVR racing would be a tasmin, there are some great cars available from around 4.5k! with the right driver and setup they should be capable of giving a 4ltr chim a good run for their money as they are not limited in the mods you can make. But admittedly the tasmins are not everyones taste.. but I like them, and if things work out will run the tas at some point this year in dtec and cscc
Another alternative would be to arrive and drive in a class C chimaera, Classic World Racing ( David Gerald TVR ) have a fully prepped Chimaera available for hire... you just turn up and they provide the car and do everything else.. great if you dont want the outlay of a car and having to look after it.
Im normally fairly light on the car, for example I've raced the tuscan since 2005 and only on my 3rd set of front pads and 2nd set of rears !! some people ( who are generally much slower) can go through a set of disks and pads every few races !!!
My 5ltr engine is just a modded tvr rover from a 5ltr griff with a dry sump, running through throttle bodies, again in the 8 years I've run that engine its had to be refreshed 3 times
a) dropped a core plug and overheated
b) Spun a main after swarf in oil pump
c) heads warped, must have overheated after the end of a 1 hour race. still took pole at next race with no compression on 1 pot !
Gearboxes, I've had 1 jam in gear and take 3 attempts by the builder to sort it ! broken one layshaft, and one a bearing on the input shaft that smashed a gear.
Diffs have all been fine, i rotate 2 to keep them fresh
I've not broken a half shaft but probably will at some point. although again we do take them out to inspect a lot and change cv's when they show wear
Accidents
1) cadwell jammed throttle in testing
2) cadwell after rebuilding from 1 over the weekend, an oil union broke and went off on own oil
3) Spun after running wide at rivage and damaged rear corner of body work ( finished race)
4) Spun halfway down hanger straight in october and damaged front and front right suspension.
Dont forget thats over 10 years of racing 1 overall dtec win and 2 class championship wins and a win rate in he races of over 50 % ( the other 50% were eithe podium or dnf. dnfs usually minor things that stopped the car, electrical fault, puncture etc or not happy with something so parked it) so I drive it fairly hard. accidents 1 and 2 were related and the same weekend doh... I've not had any car on car other than a small bit of rubbing every now and then but nothing that wouldnt t-cut out.
you can increase the cost by spending loads on tyres but i tend not to , and testing obviously adds to the seasons cost. The year I won overall my total spend was 6.5k!
The cheapest way to get into TVR racing would be a tasmin, there are some great cars available from around 4.5k! with the right driver and setup they should be capable of giving a 4ltr chim a good run for their money as they are not limited in the mods you can make. But admittedly the tasmins are not everyones taste.. but I like them, and if things work out will run the tas at some point this year in dtec and cscc
Another alternative would be to arrive and drive in a class C chimaera, Classic World Racing ( David Gerald TVR ) have a fully prepped Chimaera available for hire... you just turn up and they provide the car and do everything else.. great if you dont want the outlay of a car and having to look after it.
Edited by Graham on Sunday 1st February 16:24
I have been a supporter for the past several years. First starting out watching the likes of Ian Flux, Bobby Verdon-roe and Chris Hodgetts racing in the TVR's back in the mid / late 90's on TV. It was watching this at an age of around 15 that got me in to TVR's, buying my Chim in 2002. Then in 2003/4 I watched a few races, live, at Brands Hatch (my local circuit) which were arranged by the RO of my local TVR club. In the last few years I have been to nearly every race meeting to follow the TVR's.
From a spectator’s point of view having been to all sorts of race meetings including BTCC I prefer to support the club racing scene due to the fact that the racing is close, the drivers/teams are all very welcoming and take time to talk to you about their cars and their interest. With the BTCC you just don't seem to be able to get as close to the action or Drivers/Teams.
The amount of effort / work that goes in to preparing the cars is immense, as is the organisation of the events. It my view it is part of TVR heritage and I'm a proud supporter of it.
Everyone has their own interests and everyone is different, but I'm sure many people in the car club or on here after going to a race meeting would get hooked.
Some of my pics from the last few years.
From a spectator’s point of view having been to all sorts of race meetings including BTCC I prefer to support the club racing scene due to the fact that the racing is close, the drivers/teams are all very welcoming and take time to talk to you about their cars and their interest. With the BTCC you just don't seem to be able to get as close to the action or Drivers/Teams.
The amount of effort / work that goes in to preparing the cars is immense, as is the organisation of the events. It my view it is part of TVR heritage and I'm a proud supporter of it.
Everyone has their own interests and everyone is different, but I'm sure many people in the car club or on here after going to a race meeting would get hooked.
Some of my pics from the last few years.
perhaps a few TVR factory cars will one day grace the grid and even help finance the events for the privateers? You know, publicise the brand and all that, just a thought.....
I would happily race my griff if it were trackday money to enter, its the cost that puts me off to be honest.
Phil.
I would happily race my griff if it were trackday money to enter, its the cost that puts me off to be honest.
Phil.
Had a few responses from my regions, mostly boils down to...
Issues...
1 - We are not interested in racing
2 - waiting around between races or for races without anything to do is boring
3 - Long distance to travel to events, timings are very short notice and not much to do there
Improvements...
1 - interested in tech talks if someone of hand to explain preparation and/car would be great
2 - let people know race timings as soon as possible so can plan day
3 - mix it somehow with social event
Issues...
1 - We are not interested in racing
2 - waiting around between races or for races without anything to do is boring
3 - Long distance to travel to events, timings are very short notice and not much to do there
Improvements...
1 - interested in tech talks if someone of hand to explain preparation and/car would be great
2 - let people know race timings as soon as possible so can plan day
3 - mix it somehow with social event
KSV said:
I still think the way to go is to have a flagship event at a race meeting, it's got to be better than standing around in a field all day!
As lovely as Chatsworth is, I do have my senile years to get on a miserable coach and go and wet myself on the lawn of a country house. There are only 5 races this year according to the calendar and one of them must be able to support a couple of hundred TVRs turning up.
The Calendar is still provisional at the moment and may change but as it currently stands
May 16th/17th Rockingham (DH)
June 26h/27th Snetterton 200(DH)
Aug 8th/9th Anglesey (DH)
TBC TBC
October 17th Oulton Park (DH)
As soon as they are confirmed they will be on http://www.tvrchampionship.co.uk/ and the TVRCC site..
May 16th/17th Rockingham (DH)
June 26h/27th Snetterton 200(DH)
Aug 8th/9th Anglesey (DH)
TBC TBC
October 17th Oulton Park (DH)
As soon as they are confirmed they will be on http://www.tvrchampionship.co.uk/ and the TVRCC site..
alex_gray255 said:
Graham said:
If i could get RO's to badger the committee with that sentiment it would be great
The AGM is next month. Propose it there.I am aiming to have some time with all of the Ro's at the mtg after the AGM
G
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