There are other series that have pretty much all of the selling points that you mention for The Wire, Spartacus and Dexter immediately spring to mind, and I've watched many of those episodes back to back in tv marathons late into the night. The difference with those series is that they never felt like a grind to watch.

Fans of The Wire seem to see the slow pace and focussing on the (overly IMO) intricate details as adding realism, but if I want realism I watch a documentary, or read a non-fiction book on the subject (both of which I quite often do).

If I watch fiction, especially a cop show, realism isn't my primary concern: I expect to be entertained first and foremost, not forced to undertake a test of endurance for next to no pay-off, just because that's more "real".

I think the superiority and smugness from Wire fans is simply because IT IS HARD WORK.
You have to invest some time at the beginning remembering names, attempting to understand a virtually different language, pre-existing relationships that aren't explained, the hardship of some long panning shots etc...

So for those who have made the investment and found it a very fulfilling show as a result they feel pretty vindicated for time well spent.
If you watch, say, Hawaii-5-0 where the characters are one-dimensional and plots are wrapped up in one episode, then sure that can be time well spent too but you haven't exactly put much effort in.

I think it is simply that effort-reward pay-off works for so many that The Wire became legendary.

Clearly, this isn't for everyone.

I imagine that many TV viewers have a sort of hierarchy in their mind for different types of show/movies.
Action-adventure and rom-coms on one side with more intellectually challenging viewing on the other perhaps.
The Wire is clearly on one side of that.

Another good example is The West Wing - the speed of the dialogue and the issues they are discussing are more challenging than watching someone blow st up.

Again, clearly, this isn't for everyone and the conclusion that is too easily jumped to is that if you prefer watching action movies you are somehow intellectually inferior or lazy etc...
That's wrong. Plenty of brains can disagree about how much they enjoy a challenging show, it doesn't make one smarter than the other: you just happen to be in the minority, with regards to The Wire.

But equally clearly it isn't the Emperor's New Clothes because that enjoyment of The Wire is very real for many people.
As Season 3 and 4 reached their denouements I literally couldn't stop watching because I was enjoying it so much.
It was nothing to do with peer pressure or wanting to fit in. No one else knew I was watching!

Again with the assumption that people who don't enjoy The Wire don't make the same investment as those who do.

It doesn't take a genius to understand the plot of The Wire, the quality of the acting, its screenplay, unsually high number of characters explored and so on and it's more than possible to be just as aware of all of those aspects of it and still not enjoy it.

I've had to explain many of the subtle elements of the plot to my girlfriend (who hasn't paid as much as attention to it as me), e.g. Greggs' reaction on realising that Omar had manipulated her and the department to get Savino out of the picture so he could confront Wee-Bey and Stinkum on more even terms, so it's not like I haven't made the investment and paid attention.

I just feel the pay-off doesn't warrant the investment, and therefore I don't understand why those who have made the investment and ultimately enjoyed it feel smug or superior. IMO, they're not better than those who don't enjoy it, they just have different tastes.

I agree.
I wasn't assuming you hadn't made the same investment.

I was just trying to explain WHY people feel superior vs. say your typical non-Wire watcher or someone who gave up.
You clearly aren't in that category.

I disagree about Spartacus, some of the plot twists and machinations are exquisite. There's one twist in particular (that I won't mention as it's a big spoiler) that springs to mind as completely unexpected and evil. I believe it would easily standalone without the sex and extreme gore, although having a series about someone who trains to be a Gladiator with no violence might be a bit of a stretch!

You genuinely believe that Lucretia or Batiatus' characters, to name just two of the supporting characters in Spartacus, have the depth of "fag paper" in comparison to supporting characters such as Bubbs or Daniels in the Wire?

I disagree.

There are also plot twists in both of the series I mentioned that are absolutely superb:

- Dexter's wife
- Spartacus and Ilithyia

... to name just two.

I clearly haven't seen all five seasons, but then my entire point is that if it takes 60 hours plus of screen time to get to know the characters, then that's a failing in and of itself.

It wouldn't be so bad if the majority of the time you were actually getting to know the characters, but as I keep repeating, a lot of it is torturous and irrelevant filler without even a character being on screen.

Let's not forget: this is a TV show, after all!

Wasn't meant as an insult at all, but in my experience it does take a lot of watching, you have to get into it in ways that you dont need to with other TV.
I started watching it on BBC2 a few years back, but I had missed all of the first series and most of season 2. It was only when I got in to series 3 that I really enjoyed it. I would watch 2 or 3 episodes at a time, thanks to Sky+. I then got the DVD box set and started at the beginning. While watching it I realised I had watched half of an episode at some stage and switched off, it was the episode where D'Angelo gets arrested.

I think you are actually being over critical, but the world would be a very dull place if we all liked the same things.

Everyone likes different things but I'd not really call the wire that slow? Great plot lines run through the series and characters are interesting, well to me anyways.
I watched the whole 1st season in like 3 evenings after work...? Same with the second dvd set the week after. I think the other seasons did't last to logn either ;-)Good times!
However I've not read all the pages of this thread but if you don't like it by now, don't bother!! Life's to short to watch TV that you don't like!!!

You have taken a bit of a beating in some of the posts but your point are valid, I laid my cards on the table earlier on in this thread by stating how much I love The Wire, I also loved Spartacus and Dexter is prob my favourite show along with Entourage. Seen pretty much all the big boxsets- Shield, 24, Heroes, Sopranos, Sons of Anarchy, The Unit, Prison Break, Entourage, Dexter, Mad Men etc.
Of all these I must admit The Wire was the one I was not sure about, almost gave up on it halfway thru season 2 but stuck it out and glad I did, girlfriend hated it tho but she aint the sharpest tool in the box(sound familiar op?? )
You are right tho it is all a matter of individual taste, a lot of the guys on here love Battlestar Galactica but I think it was worse than rubbish.
People on PH also seem to think that Mazda Mx-5s are amazing, again I think they are horrific It is all a matter of taste.