"Epic Movies" where have they gone?
Discussion
The word "epic" is used by younger people in a different way to when true "epic" movies were made. The OP defined an "Epic Movie" as referring to what were once called "Hollywood Epics" i.e a movie with a massive budget, huge box office stars, lavish sets and usually a massive biblical or historical event as the theme with a cast of thousands.
They just don't make films like this any more for a number of reasons. Cost is the obvious one. Subject matter is another and CGI is the third.
Cost is obvious - although perhaps the correct word is "risk". "Cleopatra" is an object lesson in how an old style "epic" could get completely out of control. Although someone has said it eventually made money, that is not really relevant. It's like saying Van Gogh paintings eventually made money.
In the shorter term financial damage had been done and the studio was in big trouble.
Another "epic" that went badly wrong was Michael Cimino's "Heaven's Gate". It also bankrupted the studio (United Artists) and forced it into a merger with MGM.
Regarding subject matter, the great historical and biblical themes that had been the inspiration for old style epics (from the original 1920s "Ben Hur" up until "El Cid" or "Zulu") just don't excite modern audiences. Maybe it's because modern audiences are clueless about the Bible or history?
And of course, you don't need casts of thousands of extras when CGI can generate them for a fraction of the cost.
They just don't make films like this any more for a number of reasons. Cost is the obvious one. Subject matter is another and CGI is the third.
Cost is obvious - although perhaps the correct word is "risk". "Cleopatra" is an object lesson in how an old style "epic" could get completely out of control. Although someone has said it eventually made money, that is not really relevant. It's like saying Van Gogh paintings eventually made money.
In the shorter term financial damage had been done and the studio was in big trouble.
Another "epic" that went badly wrong was Michael Cimino's "Heaven's Gate". It also bankrupted the studio (United Artists) and forced it into a merger with MGM.
Regarding subject matter, the great historical and biblical themes that had been the inspiration for old style epics (from the original 1920s "Ben Hur" up until "El Cid" or "Zulu") just don't excite modern audiences. Maybe it's because modern audiences are clueless about the Bible or history?
And of course, you don't need casts of thousands of extras when CGI can generate them for a fraction of the cost.
I doubt anyone will agree what makes a film an 'Epic' seems lots of us point to large casts of nameless extras roaming, a biblical story, both literally and figuratively and an over-blown budget a-la Spartacus - but Gone with the Wind is a copper bottomed Epic, which doesn't conform to this.
For me an epic is more about the story, it needs a HUGE story, spanning years, even decades and usually encompasses the main characters entire life, adult life certainly - it's almost always a 2hr+ film - I know that's the norm now, but films used to be shorter - 3hrs feels like a proper Epic to me, as long as it's not all filler.
For me Forrest Gump is a fantastic Epic, yes there's a large crowd scene - but it's by no means it's defining moment.
For me an epic is more about the story, it needs a HUGE story, spanning years, even decades and usually encompasses the main characters entire life, adult life certainly - it's almost always a 2hr+ film - I know that's the norm now, but films used to be shorter - 3hrs feels like a proper Epic to me, as long as it's not all filler.
For me Forrest Gump is a fantastic Epic, yes there's a large crowd scene - but it's by no means it's defining moment.
Eric Mc said:
I think you are confusing the modern useage of the word "epic" (meaning very good) with the original use by Hollywood - which meant large, extravagant, big themed of historical or religious import etc etc etc.
The trailers were also epic, that guy with the deep gravelly voice " Thrill to the sight of a thousand chariots........ weep to the tender love scenes.........."P-Jay said:
I doubt anyone will agree what makes a film an 'Epic' seems lots of us point to large casts of nameless extras roaming, a biblical story, both literally and figuratively and an over-blown budget a-la Spartacus - but Gone with the Wind is a copper bottomed Epic, which doesn't conform to this.
For me an epic is more about the story, it needs a HUGE story, spanning years, even decades and usually encompasses the main characters entire life, adult life certainly - it's almost always a 2hr+ film - I know that's the norm now, but films used to be shorter - 3hrs feels like a proper Epic to me, as long as it's not all filler.
For me Forrest Gump is a fantastic Epic, yes there's a large crowd scene - but it's by no means it's defining moment.
Wiki states the following - For me an epic is more about the story, it needs a HUGE story, spanning years, even decades and usually encompasses the main characters entire life, adult life certainly - it's almost always a 2hr+ film - I know that's the norm now, but films used to be shorter - 3hrs feels like a proper Epic to me, as long as it's not all filler.
For me Forrest Gump is a fantastic Epic, yes there's a large crowd scene - but it's by no means it's defining moment.
"In its classification of films by genre, the American Film Institute limits the genre to historical films such as Ben-Hur. However, film scholars such as Constantine Santas are willing to extend the label to science-fiction films such as 2001: A Space Odyssey and Star Wars.[2] Nickolas Haydock suggests that "Surely one of the hardest film genres to define is that of the "epic" film, encompassing such examples as Ben-Hur, Gone with the Wind....and more recently, 300 and the Star Wars films...none of these comes from literary epics per se, and there is little that links them with one another. Among those who espouse film genre studies, epic is one of the most despised and ignored genres"[3] Finally, although the American Movie Channel formally defines epic films as historical films, they nonetheless state the epic film may be combined with the genre of science-fiction and cite Star Wars as an example.[4]"
I think the one requirement of an "epic" movie is that it most have a sense of "majestic sweep" i.e covering great events with lavish style.
Never mind the decline of 'Epics', I just miss the huge event that used to be the release of a massive Blockbuster 
When I was a kid in the 80's and 90's it seemed like the release of something like Jurassic Park or Ghostbusters was a simply huge event involving promotional vehicles, shops full of branded clothes, vast arrays of toys for Christmas, computer games and board games based on the film, food products from the film, red carpet events... It was just massive.
Remember when Jurassic Park came out? All the stars arriving at events in London in fleets of Discovery's converted to be replicas of the Ford Explorers used in the film, shops bursting with clothing, toys, games and merchandise, all the video and computer games, board games... Even furniture and home decor. Endless.
That's before I even mention Star Wars... Surely the biggest brand for film related merchandise?
Now it's just China knocking out a few crappy 'Frozen' dolls for Asda to sell.
Or maybe I've grown up??
When I was a kid in the 80's and 90's it seemed like the release of something like Jurassic Park or Ghostbusters was a simply huge event involving promotional vehicles, shops full of branded clothes, vast arrays of toys for Christmas, computer games and board games based on the film, food products from the film, red carpet events... It was just massive.
Remember when Jurassic Park came out? All the stars arriving at events in London in fleets of Discovery's converted to be replicas of the Ford Explorers used in the film, shops bursting with clothing, toys, games and merchandise, all the video and computer games, board games... Even furniture and home decor. Endless.
That's before I even mention Star Wars... Surely the biggest brand for film related merchandise?
Now it's just China knocking out a few crappy 'Frozen' dolls for Asda to sell.
Or maybe I've grown up??
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