Chris Evans on Top Gear road and track tests.
Discussion
ocallen said:
Just another view on this subject. Chris Evans may own or have owned wonderful cars but in his motoring pages in The Mail on Sunday Event magazine he really scoops the bottom of the barrel with the cars he tests and writes about, today it's the Honda Civic Type R, not a bad car but any of us can go into a local Honda dealership and try one if so inclined.
JC would rarely get out of bed for anything less than a £100k car and then he would burn the rubber at Dunsfold. That is what we wanted to see, not how good the latest Viva is to commute to Broadcasting House.
I don't have a problem with him reviewing 'ordinary' cars, certainly in the sundays.JC would rarely get out of bed for anything less than a £100k car and then he would burn the rubber at Dunsfold. That is what we wanted to see, not how good the latest Viva is to commute to Broadcasting House.
That said, his style is very poor, he criticizes the cars for things that are down to legislation rather than poor design, ie. the reason for poor throttle response these days is down to the targets for emissions, not poor engine design/implementation
ocallen said:
Just another view on this subject. Chris Evans may own or have owned wonderful cars but in his motoring pages in The Mail on Sunday Event magazine he really scoops the bottom of the barrel with the cars he tests and writes about, today it's the Honda Civic Type R, not a bad car but any of us can go into a local Honda dealership and try one if so inclined.
Must admit, I skipped to the Evans review part of the magazine and groaned when I saw what car it was. Although his reviews are by and large 'reasonably' well written, it seems a bit of a waste of a glossy two page spread to me.
Giles Smith's First Drive Reviews in the Sunday Times 'Driving' magazine are better, and Clarkson's better still.
Scuffers said:
I don't have a problem with him reviewing 'ordinary' cars, certainly in the sundays.
That said, his style is very poor, he criticizes the cars for things that are down to legislation rather than poor design, ie. the reason for poor throttle response these days is down to the targets for emissions, not poor engine design/implementation
Then what's he supposed to do? Pretend the car doesn't have horrible throttle response? I think journos have to shoot straight and say that most modern cars are pretty much worthless as driver's cars rather than just safe, comfortable transport.That said, his style is very poor, he criticizes the cars for things that are down to legislation rather than poor design, ie. the reason for poor throttle response these days is down to the targets for emissions, not poor engine design/implementation
ORD said:
Then what's he supposed to do? Pretend the car doesn't have horrible throttle response? I think journos have to shoot straight and say that most modern cars are pretty much worthless as driver's cars rather than just safe, comfortable transport.
no, he should explain it for what it is, not make some generic bulls
t up.Seeing this more and more with the current generation of EU6 cars, all too easy to blame the turbo, when in reality is the mapping constraints to meet NOx targets.
Scuffers said:
no, he should explain it for what it is, not make some generic bullst up.
Seeing this more and more with the current generation of EU6 cars, all too easy to blame the turbo, when in reality is the mapping constraints to meet NOx targets.
It's both. NA cars still have a laggy throttle but not as bad. t up.Seeing this more and more with the current generation of EU6 cars, all too easy to blame the turbo, when in reality is the mapping constraints to meet NOx targets.
ORD said:
It's both. NA cars still have a laggy throttle but not as bad.
exactly (I thought I had made that point, obviously not clearly enough)I get annoyed that they universally blame it on the turbo when in reality, 99% of them don't even understand the difference between turbo lag and boost threshold.
Most cars have plenty of both. The issue is exacerbated hugely by the mapping, I agree. Cars are mapped to have almost no torque below the boost threshold (for cruising efficiency), and they are made highly reluctant to rev (same reason).
One of the effects is to make manual cars far less engaging to drive. It almost makes them no better than autos.
One of the effects is to make manual cars far less engaging to drive. It almost makes them no better than autos.
ORD said:
Most cars have plenty of both. The issue is exacerbated hugely by the mapping, I agree. Cars are mapped to have almost no torque below the boost threshold (for cruising efficiency), and they are made highly reluctant to rev (same reason).
One of the effects is to make manual cars far less engaging to drive. It almost makes them no better than autos.
it's done because if you allow the throttle bang open suddenly, (and then throw the corresponding amount of fuel in), your NOx emissions go though the roof (relatively), now, under EU2/3/4 that was just about livable with, but since EU5, the limits are such that it's simply not possible without breaking them.One of the effects is to make manual cars far less engaging to drive. It almost makes them no better than autos.
Apparently, NOx emissions are killing thousands of children a year, etc etc..
ORD said:
Scuffers said:
no, he should explain it for what it is, not make some generic bullst up.
Seeing this more and more with the current generation of EU6 cars, all too easy to blame the turbo, when in reality is the mapping constraints to meet NOx targets.
It's both. NA cars still have a laggy throttle but not as bad. t up.Seeing this more and more with the current generation of EU6 cars, all too easy to blame the turbo, when in reality is the mapping constraints to meet NOx targets.
The are many myths regurgitated about turbo "lag". Been driving petrol turbos for close on thirty years. Turbo lag is never a problem if you have some mechanical nouse about how these things operate and use them to best advantage.
EU emissions directives are so arbitrary they do little to improve overall effects on the environment. All vehicles are filthy emissions producers even pure electrical ones. Their energy has to come from somewhere.
The farce of emission measurements. Anyone watching say a diesel car or van being tested for the UK MoT will quickly realise.
Scuffers said:
MGJohn said:
The farce of emission measurements. Anyone watching say a diesel car or van being tested for the UK MoT will quickly realise.
you do realise the MOT (emissions) test is nothing to do with any of this don't you?Too right Scuffers... cannot allow threads to evolve, develop, stray or become more interesting even and then return.
Those guilty of such misdemeanours should be shot at dawn or failing that sooner ....
I wonder how many times we've read an article said to have been written by someone but wasn't. I remember Hammond being on Danny Baker's radio show and Baker implying that he'd written stuff that was passed off as Clarkson's. As with TFI Friday I'd be surprised if Baker doesn't have a hand in new Top Gear too. Whenever I've read a Clarkson review in the Sunday Times, there have been plenty of times where the car is barely mentioned until the last few paragraphs of the article. Always made me wonder if it was just generically funny rambling with a mention of ' the C 63 AMG's snarlingly brutish 6.2-litre V8 helps to keep it ahead of its rivals - four stars' tacked on at the end.
I can't warm to Evans; he had his place in the nineties, but now he comes across like a trendy vicar who has to shoehorn how much he does for charity into every ****ing sentence.
I can't warm to Evans; he had his place in the nineties, but now he comes across like a trendy vicar who has to shoehorn how much he does for charity into every ****ing sentence.
SpeedBall said:
I can't warm to Evans; he had his place in the nineties, but now he comes across like a trendy vicar who has to shoehorn how much he does for charity into every ****ing sentence.
I don't watch or listen to him. You've just put the final nail in the coffin, so I won't be watching Top Gear now.Can't find the other top,gear thread the search option is ste in here anyway
7million per episode from Amazon
http://www.autoguide.com/auto-news/2015/08/new-ama...
te in here anyway7million per episode from Amazon
http://www.autoguide.com/auto-news/2015/08/new-ama...
Clarkson's writing was/is great even if I have absolutely no interest in the topic at hand I'd read what he has put.
CE is just a presenter, can't imagine him ever really voicing an opinion about anything. His radio programme is popular simply because there's nothing else on at that time to have on when you're getting ready for work.
CE is just a presenter, can't imagine him ever really voicing an opinion about anything. His radio programme is popular simply because there's nothing else on at that time to have on when you're getting ready for work.
ocallen said:
JC would rarely get out of bed for anything less than a £100k car and then he would burn the rubber at Dunsfold. That is what we wanted to see, not how good the latest Viva is to commute to Broadcasting House.
Who elected you spokesman?You have no idea what I want to see.
Grimshaw is awful.Gassing Station | TV, Film, Video Streaming & Radio | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff