SS GB

[craigjm]

https://www.amazon.co.uk/SS-GB-Len-Deighton/dp/000...

His other books Bomber and XPD are worth reading too

[Halmyre]

Couple of questions - would the Nazis have tolerated a jazz band? I thought they considered such music as decadent:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Negermusik


At one point they mention a Captain or Admiral Connolly(?) who is de facto head of the Government in exile. Is he a real historical figure or fictional?

[FourWheelDrift]

Halmyre said:

At one point they mention a Captain or Admiral Connolly(?) who is de facto head of the Government in exile. Is he a real historical figure or fictional?

Fictional, if it was Connolly as I forget what he was named as. There was only one officer Connolly in the Royal Navy 1939-1945 - http://www.unithistories.com/officers/RN_officersC... a pilot in the Fleet Air Arm.

[marcosgt]

Halmyre said:

Couple of questions - would the Nazis have tolerated a jazz band? I thought they considered such music as decadent:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Negermusik


At one point they mention a Captain or Admiral Connolly(?) who is de facto head of the Government in exile. Is he a real historical figure or fictional?

I think you were supposed to think that that was the kind of decadent party that many Nazis, less committed to the cause than Hitler, might enjoy whilst pretending to be true to the cause.

Think Catholic Priests and choirboys.

FourWheelDrift said:

Fictional, if it was Connolly as I forget what he was named as. There was only one officer Connolly in the Royal Navy 1939-1945 - http://www.unithistories.com/officers/RN_officersC... a pilot in the Fleet Air Arm.

Not saying he's supposed to be the same person, but did they not say "He stepped off an aircraft carrier in Nova Scotia and told the world he was the leader of the British in exile" (or words to that effect, but significantly the aircraft carrier bit)?

M.

Edited by marcosgt on Monday 27th February 13:55

[Halmyre]

marcosgt said:

Halmyre said:

Couple of questions - would the Nazis have tolerated a jazz band? I thought they considered such music as decadent:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Negermusik


At one point they mention a Captain or Admiral Connolly(?) who is de facto head of the Government in exile. Is he a real historical figure or fictional?

I think you were supposed to think that that was the kind of decadent party that many Nazis, less committed to the cause than Hitler, might enjoy whilst pretending to be true to the cause.

Think Catholic Priests and choirboys.

FourWheelDrift said:

Fictional, if it was Connolly as I forget what he was named as. There was only one officer Connolly in the Royal Navy 1939-1945 - http://www.unithistories.com/officers/RN_officersC... a pilot in the Fleet Air Arm.

Not saying he's supposed to be the same person, but did they not say "He stepped off an aircraft carrier in Nova Scotia and told the world he was the leader of the British in exile" (or words to that effect, but significantly the aircraft carrier bit)?

M.

Edited by marcosgt on Monday 27th February 13:55

That's the bit, can't recall if it was 'Connolly' or not. In reality, even if Churchill had stayed put, wouldn't at least some of the cabinet have been flown/shipped to safety, with someone nominated to take charge if push came to shove? Drifting into alt.history stuff here, I know...

[FiF]

It mentions the King, but there were plans to evacuate the Royals to Madresfield Court in Malvern and thence onwards to the coast and to Canada.

Has there been any explanation about America? This was Nov 41 iirc, so Pearl harbour any day now.

[Vocal Minority]

mybrainhurts said:

Quite right. Ought to have had the SS chappie dressed as a Roman centurion. It's only a story.

PS...congrats on the apostrophe double whammy...

The trouble with this sort of thing, is people take a nit picking point that only 1% if that of the audience will notice because it is so immaterial - and then to defend it say 'so you'd be happy if....' and then insert a totally fking ludicrous scenario like it is in any way comparable as an inaccuracy. It almost highlights just how pernickety and irrelevant the complaint is.

It's basically a historical detail nerd dick measuring contest.

And I know I took part with the whole SS/Jaguar thing. But at least I am man enough to admit it is because I am an insufferable nerd, not because it genuinely detracted from the story!

[Vocal Minority]

marcosgt said:

Halmyre said:

Couple of questions - would the Nazis have tolerated a jazz band? I thought they considered such music as decadent:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Negermusik


At one point they mention a Captain or Admiral Connolly(?) who is de facto head of the Government in exile. Is he a real historical figure or fictional?

I think you were supposed to think that that was the kind of decadent party that many Nazis, less committed to the cause than Hitler, might enjoy whilst pretending to be true to the cause.

Edited by marcosgt on Monday 27th February 13:55

Could you argue it was a more simple one rule for us, another for the rest of them. Using hard tradition as a tool of control? After all, Herman Goering could hardly be accused of parsimony!

[ClockworkCupcake]

Vocal Minority said:

The trouble with this sort of thing, is people take a nit picking point that only 1% if that of the audience will notice because it is so immaterial - and then to defend it say 'so you'd be happy if....' and then insert a totally fking ludicrous scenario like it is in any way comparable as an inaccuracy.

I was taking issue with the "it's not real" comment, as if any complaint about inaccuracy, plausibility, or feasibility is somehow not allowed. My comment about flying pink elephants was reductio ad absurdum to make the point.

[4x4Tyke]

I don't get why people are bothering complaining about the wrong mk of Spitfire but let the presence of the much more obvious D-day invasion markings go unmentioned. Parroting received wisdom?

[craigjm]

FiF said:

It mentions the King, but there were plans to evacuate the Royals to Madresfield Court in Malvern and thence onwards to the coast and to Canada.

Has there been any explanation about America? This was Nov 41 iirc, so Pearl harbour any day now.

But would Pearl Harbour have happened if the Germans had won the war in Europe and were occupying mainland UK? who knows because it would be an alternate 1941.

[FourWheelDrift]

craigjm said:

FiF said:

It mentions the King, but there were plans to evacuate the Royals to Madresfield Court in Malvern and thence onwards to the coast and to Canada.

Has there been any explanation about America? This was Nov 41 iirc, so Pearl harbour any day now.

But would Pearl Harbour have happened if the Germans had won the war in Europe and were occupying mainland UK? who knows because it would be an alternate 1941.

Have they invaded the Soviet Union, which replaced the invasion of Britain. The tripartite treaty between Germany, Italy and Japan was only signed after the Battle of Britain, winning it would it still be signed? Would the US want to engage in a Europe/Soviet/Japan fight? Or be happier with peace and trade deals?

[ClockworkCupcake]

FourWheelDrift said:

Have they invaded the Soviet Union, which replaced the invasion of Britain. The tripartite treaty between Germany, Italy and Japan was only signed after the Battle of Britain, winning it would it still be signed? Would the US want to engage in a Europe/Soviet/Japan fight? Or be happier with peace and trade deals?

Quite. I sometimes wonder if Hitler in fact lost the war rather than the Allies winning it, so to speak. Had Hitler honoured his agreement with Russia, rather than opening up a second front, and also allowed the Me262 to be developed as a fighter rather than insisting it be a bomber against all advice, then I wonder if things might have turned out very differently.

[RichB]

Vocal Minority said:

...And I know I took part with the whole SS/Jaguar thing. But at least I am man enough to admit it is because I am an insufferable nerd, not because it genuinely detracted from the story!

And fortunately you didn't jump on the bandwagon to say they wouldn't have had a Jaguar during WWII (nothing more funny than a nerd with egg on his face) because as all petrolheads should know, the Jaguar was an SS model introduced in 1935

[Fonz]

Bloody hell, I only asked! I should point out that I am enjoying the show. Just asked as I thought that someone on here would know the answer to something I was wondering.

[RichB]

Fonz said:

Bloody hell, I only asked! I should point out that I am enjoying the show. Just asked as I thought that someone on here would know the answer to something I was wondering.

[craigjm]

Fonz said:

Bloody hell, I only asked! I should point out that I am enjoying the show. Just asked as I thought that someone on here would know the answer to something I was wondering.

You knew it would unleash the OCD nerds
It really is something I find hilarious that people stop watching a show because of some slight historical innacuracies or actively start looking for them. I remember my Dad going on about mk3 Allegros in Life on Mars and I'm like..... he is in a coma it's not real!

[ClockworkCupcake]

craigjm said:

It really is something I find hilarious that people stop watching a show because of some slight historical innacuracies

Wait, when did anyone say that?

It was just light-hearted discussion, that's all. Who made you a moderator?

[hidetheelephants]

ClockworkCupcake said:

FourWheelDrift said:

Have they invaded the Soviet Union, which replaced the invasion of Britain. The tripartite treaty between Germany, Italy and Japan was only signed after the Battle of Britain, winning it would it still be signed? Would the US want to engage in a Europe/Soviet/Japan fight? Or be happier with peace and trade deals?

Quite. I sometimes wonder if Hitler in fact lost the war rather than the Allies winning it, so to speak. Had Hitler honoured his agreement with Russia, rather than opening up a second front, and also allowed the Me262 to be developed as a fighter rather than insisting it be a bomber against all advice, then I wonder if things might have turned out very differently.

Stalin was planning to attack anyway, Hitler just pre-empted him.

[ClockworkCupcake]

hidetheelephants said:

Stalin was planning to attack anyway, Hitler just pre-empted him.

Ah, ok. That makes sense. Cheers.