More Argie Bargie

[Badgerboy]

superlightr said:

cant we un-mothball, buy back our Harriers? If not why not contact our buddies in the USA and buy/lease a dozen US AV8B to use until 2020 when the catapult can be fitted and use the planned aircraft?

Waste of time. The Harriers we were operating had no real Air to Air capability since the FRS was retired, and limited range and payload. If we were to deploy them we have to tie up other air assets to protect them as they were incapable of providing any effective form of CAP work to defend themselves. At least the Marines retained a capability with the AV8B.

The Harrier force was marginalised as soon as the FRS was retired.

[Apache]

ExFiF said:

Well the Govt has now decided to buy jump jets for the carriers.

About turn on new variant of carrier fighters

Too late for this thread mind but must be good news.

I thought these burned holes in the deck?

[IanMorewood]

Apache said:

I thought these burned holes in the deck?

Yep one of the potential problems. Also we now cant buddy refuel, have a shorter range, a smaller payload and each unit is more complex/expensive than it need be. Only positive I can see with a type B is that would could in an emergency fly them off some of our support ships or even land them on a merchant vessel (was it Lt Watson that did this with a Harrier when he couldn't find the carrier?) Of course HMS Ocean rocking up somewhere with 2 or 3 F35's (with even less payload/fuel capacity than flying off Lizzy) wouldn't put many tinpot dictators off.

[Seight_Returns]

IanMorewood said:

was it Lt Watson that did this with a Harrier when he couldn't find the carrier

Don't know whether that was the pilot's name - but the story as it was told to me (with usual caveats for yacht club bar bullst) was that the owners of the Spanish freighter that the SHAR landed on subsequently invoked their right to claim salvage for saving the aircraft - such that the MOD had to pay so much to get it back, that they would have been less out of pocket if they'd bought a new one after the pilot had ejected alongside the the freighter and dropped the aircraft in the sea.

Edited by Seight_Returns on Wednesday 9th May 15:29

[Ian Lancs]

Apache said:

ExFiF said:

Well the Govt has now decided to buy jump jets for the carriers.

About turn on new variant of carrier fighters

Too late for this thread mind but must be good news.

I thought these burned holes in the deck?

Nope - thats all media hype. Yes they're hotter than a Harrier exhaust, but there are many techniques that will prevent damage - testing has been done to death.

[Mojocvh]

Ian Lancs said:

Apache said:

ExFiF said:

Well the Govt has now decided to buy jump jets for the carriers.

About turn on new variant of carrier fighters

Too late for this thread mind but must be good news.

I thought these burned holes in the deck?

Nope - thats all media hype. Yes they're hotter than a Harrier exhaust, but there are many techniques that will prevent damage - testing has been done to death.

Example please.

[Ian Lancs]

Mojocvh said:

Ian Lancs said:

Apache said:

ExFiF said:

Well the Govt has now decided to buy jump jets for the carriers.

About turn on new variant of carrier fighters

Too late for this thread mind but must be good news.

I thought these burned holes in the deck?

Nope - thats all media hype. Yes they're hotter than a Harrier exhaust, but there are many techniques that will prevent damage - testing has been done to death.

Example please.

USS Wasp. F-35B made VL on it during recent trials. No burnt deck.

[hidetheelephants]

Mojocvh said:

Ian Lancs said:

Apache said:

ExFiF said:

Well the Govt has now decided to buy jump jets for the carriers.

About turn on new variant of carrier fighters

Too late for this thread mind but must be good news.

I thought these burned holes in the deck?

Nope - thats all media hype. Yes they're hotter than a Harrier exhaust, but there are many techniques that will prevent damage - testing has been done to death.

Example please.

Grey funnel line solutions Inc. usually made do with 2 matelots equipped with charged firehoses and something heavy to tie them to to stop the jetblast sending them into the oggin. 'Twas the preferred solution until Ark Royal MkIV got her fancy watercooled blast fence things.

[Talksteer]

Elroy Blue said:

ExFiF said:

Well the Govt has now decided to buy jump jets for the carriers.

About turn on new variant of carrier fighters

Too late for this thread mind but must be good news.

Nope. Stupid, stupid decision.

Article on the register about why this is a stupid decision and why it was in BAe's interest to quote a very high figure for adjusting a carrier that wasn't even built yet, when historically carrier shave been refitted with angled decks, cats and traps economically.

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2012/04/17/f35_carrie...

Can't help but agree, there would be a certain logic to going for cats and traps ant then just standardising the RAF's planes as carrier compatible F18's and F35C.

[Fat Fairy]

Seight_Returns said:

Don't know whether that was the pilot's name - but the story as it was told to me (with usual caveats for yacht club bar bullst) was that the owners of the Spanish freighter that the SHAR landed on subsequently invoked their right to claim salvage for saving the aircraft - such that the MOD had to pay so much to get it back, that they would have been less out of pocket if they'd bought a new one after the pilot had ejected alongside the the freighter and dropped the aircraft in the sea.

Edited by Seight_Returns on Wednesday 9th May 15:29

Not quite. The pilot had not left the Aircraft, so it was not 'salvage'. However 'The ship’s crew and owners filed a salvage claim and were awarded some £570,000 ($1.14 million at the time) as compensation for the “rescue.” '
Unit cost of a FRS1 was 12 million quid in 1979. (Sharkey Wards figures)


FF

[Ayahuasca]

10 days to go until Argentina's national day...

[Mark.H]

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/4327433/...

[sjn2004]

Funny how when Argentina's economy is screwed they always turn towards the Falklands as a distraction. Seem mother Spain is taking on their idea's now they are in difficulties.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-18200678

[ViperPict]

sjn2004 said:

Funny how when Argentina's economy is screwed they always turn towards the Falklands as a distraction. Seem mother Spain is taking on their idea's now they are in difficulties.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-18200678

Is the Argentine economy not always screwed?

[superlightr]

sjn2004 said:

Funny how when Argentina's economy is screwed they always turn towards the Falklands as a distraction. Seem mother Spain is taking on their idea's now they are in difficulties.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-18200678

you can see it coming. With the demise of the Euro, just before a breakup of the EU the UK will leave the stupid party then the EU will fall apart but the UK gets the blame for bailing.

Be interesting if Spain starts to dispatch its navy. How far would the UK navy go to enforce no fishing around Gib against Spanish fihermen and if they had 'protection' from Spanish police?

[jbi]

superlightr said:

Be interesting if Spain starts to dispatch its navy. How far would the UK navy go to enforce no fishing around Gib against Spanish fihermen and if they had 'protection' from Spanish police?

Can't see it escalating beyond a few shaking fists. Too much to lose on both sides.

[superlightr]

jbi said:

superlightr said:

Be interesting if Spain starts to dispatch its navy. How far would the UK navy go to enforce no fishing around Gib against Spanish fihermen and if they had 'protection' from Spanish police?

Can't see it escalating beyond a few shaking fists. Too much to lose on both sides.

We have had the question in the 80's put to us about defending the FI and making sure they are defended now.

As an exercise, How/Could would we stop spain marching in to Gib? The boarder is weak, spain is strong and could mount a quick land grab. Dont think we could stop it. Be hard to get it back.

Would they? financial crisis looming for them.

[Caulkhead]

superlightr said:

jbi said:

superlightr said:

Be interesting if Spain starts to dispatch its navy. How far would the UK navy go to enforce no fishing around Gib against Spanish fihermen and if they had 'protection' from Spanish police?

Can't see it escalating beyond a few shaking fists. Too much to lose on both sides.

We have had the question in the 80's put to us about defending the FI and making sure they are defended now.

As an exercise, How/Could would we stop spain marching in to Gib? The boarder is weak, spain is strong and could mount a quick land grab. Dont think we could stop it. Be hard to get it back.

Would they? financial crisis looming for them.

Gib is a matter of pride for Spain, not money. They wouldn't consider while both the UK and Spain are in the EU and it would set a precedent for others to try to march into contested territory held by Spain. Far too counter-productive to be worthwhile.

[Seight_Returns]

Not to mention the implcationns of an attack by one NATO member upon another.

[Happy82]

At least Spain is within aircraft bombing range, a bit easier to get to than the Falklands / Argentina

Plus we have a huge population in Spain who could stage an uprising when British food / beer is banned