More Argie Bargie
Discussion
EskimoArapaho said:
The campaign that was fought was certainly not a foregone conclusion. Had we lost enough men and material, then we would have changed tactics and fought (and won, I believe) a different sort of war. But those who went and gave their lives and limbs are done a dishonour by claims that the winning was somehow easy.
This.im is quite wrong ("Which made the whole affair pretty much a forgone conclusion bar the numbers that would have to die to achieve it")
I had the pleasure of getting 10 minutes with Admiral of the Fleet Lord Lewin, top dog in 1982, at a family do in Suffolk, not long before he died. His words were 'I didn't have the faintest idea how we'd do it, or indeed if we'd do it before the political clock ran out...' And that's the rub. We did not have unlimited time to get the Islands back - both militarily (weather and increasingly knackered kit) and politically. He's on public record as saying much the same thing.
I also had the privilege of having the XO of HMS Conqueror in 82, as my CO in 1999 - a finer officer, you'd struggle to meet. I asked him the same (obvious question) as a junior officer over a beer in Singapore when I was his temporary Flag Lt. He said exactly the same - there was nothing forgone about Op Corporate at all. Quite the opposite. Without air superiority, landings would have been even harder, perhaps impossible without significant ramp up in troop numbers. Without carriers there was no air superiority. Without the picket ships and carrier escorts there was no carrier protection. Without the FF/DDs there was no Naval Gunfire Support. And we were losing these steadily.
The Falkands was an expeditionary operation, led by a Cold War military - I've ding donged with G15G on here before, but she's got it pretty much nailed on.
donutsina911 said:
This.
im is quite wrong ("Which made the whole affair pretty much a forgone conclusion bar the numbers that would have to die to achieve it")
I had the pleasure of getting 10 minutes with Admiral of the Fleet Lord Lewin, top dog in 1982, at a family do in Suffolk, not long before he died. His words were 'I didn't have the faintest idea how we'd do it, or indeed if we'd do it before the political clock ran out...' And that's the rub. We did not have unlimited time to get the Islands back - both militarily (weather and increasingly knackered kit) and politically. He's on public record as saying much the same thing.
I also had the privilege of having the XO of HMS Conqueror in 82, as my CO in 1999 - a finer officer, you'd struggle to meet. I asked him the same (obvious question) as a junior officer over a beer in Singapore when I was his temporary Flag Lt. He said exactly the same - there was nothing forgone about Op Corporate at all. Quite the opposite. Without air superiority, landings would have been even harder, perhaps impossible without significant ramp up in troop numbers. Without carriers there was no air superiority. Without the picket ships and carrier escorts there was no carrier protection. Without the FF/DDs there was no Naval Gunfire Support. And we were losing these steadily.
The Falkands was an expeditionary operation, led by a Cold War military - I've ding donged with G15G on here before, but she's got it pretty much nailed on.
Let me pre-empt him. im is quite wrong ("Which made the whole affair pretty much a forgone conclusion bar the numbers that would have to die to achieve it")
I had the pleasure of getting 10 minutes with Admiral of the Fleet Lord Lewin, top dog in 1982, at a family do in Suffolk, not long before he died. His words were 'I didn't have the faintest idea how we'd do it, or indeed if we'd do it before the political clock ran out...' And that's the rub. We did not have unlimited time to get the Islands back - both militarily (weather and increasingly knackered kit) and politically. He's on public record as saying much the same thing.
I also had the privilege of having the XO of HMS Conqueror in 82, as my CO in 1999 - a finer officer, you'd struggle to meet. I asked him the same (obvious question) as a junior officer over a beer in Singapore when I was his temporary Flag Lt. He said exactly the same - there was nothing forgone about Op Corporate at all. Quite the opposite. Without air superiority, landings would have been even harder, perhaps impossible without significant ramp up in troop numbers. Without carriers there was no air superiority. Without the picket ships and carrier escorts there was no carrier protection. Without the FF/DDs there was no Naval Gunfire Support. And we were losing these steadily.
The Falkands was an expeditionary operation, led by a Cold War military - I've ding donged with G15G on here before, but she's got it pretty much nailed on.
Your wrong, the Admiral is wrong, the XO is wrong, the history books are wrong and the whole world is wrong. im right! Being there is irrelevant, being part of making the history is irrelevant and everybody is irrelevant, except me, im relevant!
Edited by Grumfutock on Friday 18th April 21:16
deltaevo16 said:
Grumfutock said:
Ozzie Osmond said:
Of course it was a foregone conclusion - otherwise it would never have been fought.
Of course the military chiefs are bound to say, "Ooh, that was really difficult and we are very clever and courageous". Blowing their own trumpets.
Of course you are welcome to go and fight to keep far off islands with nobody on them if you want to. I'm not going and I wouldn't send anyone else.
Of course the total death toll of the incident was utterly and completely unacceptable,
Of course UK wouldn't have raised a finger if the "other side" had been Russia or China.
Of course it was a foregone conclusion.....
Well I have read some complete bOf course the military chiefs are bound to say, "Ooh, that was really difficult and we are very clever and courageous". Blowing their own trumpets.
Of course you are welcome to go and fight to keep far off islands with nobody on them if you want to. I'm not going and I wouldn't send anyone else.
Of course the total death toll of the incident was utterly and completely unacceptable,
- 900 people killed
- 2,500 people wounded
- Population of the Falklands in 1982 - just 1,800 people
- An overall death ratio of 50% and more people wounded than actually lived there!
Of course UK wouldn't have raised a finger if the "other side" had been Russia or China.
Of course it was a foregone conclusion.....
ks on PH, I have even written some myself. I also accept that the tinternet is full of weirdo's, racists, morons and trolls. However that is one of the funniest and yet ludicrous post I have ever read on PH. Well done sir.Ot the Sir Galahd got hit with the majority of the Welsh Guards still on it.
Like I said in an ealrier post so much drivel being spouted whilst not understanding anything about being in combat.
Apache said:
As a participant in that debacle I'd like to remind some on here that would be wise to consider their comments a little more carefully as the ability to make oneself look an utter arse is remarkably easy. Read any book about the war, it was not a fight we picked or chose to engage in with any research or preparation. We came very close to losing it on many levels from Goose Green to Operation Black Buck. Christ, we didn,t even have any air to air refuelling capability!
I read somewhere, might have been Admiral Woodwards book 100 days that quite a lot of the intelligence on where to land the troops came from a Naval Officer who'd spent his holidays sailing around the Falklands.Tango13 said:
Apache said:
As a participant in that debacle I'd like to remind some on here that would be wise to consider their comments a little more carefully as the ability to make oneself look an utter arse is remarkably easy. Read any book about the war, it was not a fight we picked or chose to engage in with any research or preparation. We came very close to losing it on many levels from Goose Green to Operation Black Buck. Christ, we didn,t even have any air to air refuelling capability!
I read somewhere, might have been Admiral Woodwards book 100 days that quite a lot of the intelligence on where to land the troops came from a Naval Officer who'd spent his holidays sailing around the Falklands.Tango13 said:
Apache said:
As a participant in that debacle I'd like to remind some on here that would be wise to consider their comments a little more carefully as the ability to make oneself look an utter arse is remarkably easy. Read any book about the war, it was not a fight we picked or chose to engage in with any research or preparation. We came very close to losing it on many levels from Goose Green to Operation Black Buck. Christ, we didn,t even have any air to air refuelling capability!
I read somewhere, might have been Admiral Woodwards book 100 days that quite a lot of the intelligence on where to land the troops came from a Naval Officer who'd spent his holidays sailing around the Falklands.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-2712...
New scientific research vessels on order, will be a common sight in the Falklands soon.
New scientific research vessels on order, will be a common sight in the Falklands soon.
anonymous said:
[redacted]
I spend too much time on here; when I saw the artist's impression of how the new ship will look I immediately thought that 'SCIENCE' should have an exclamation mark after it. 
IanMorewood said:
Good news let's hope no one leaves the sea cocks open on this one.
That was the Grey Funnel boys; this is a civvy job manned by the British Antarctic Survey, if BAS had the RN's budget to spend on research we'd have found that secret nazi base by now. 
Edited by hidetheelephants on Sunday 27th April 05:32
anonymous said:
[redacted]
Looks like our Ocean Shield vessel, a regular sight in Sydney Harbour.Anyhow, anyone have an update on the search for Oil around Falklands?
I'd love to see BP or the like hit upon a masssive field and play it straight with revenues to HMCR.
That's the only way to truly upset the Argies.
Argentina’s players unfurl Falklands banner at Slovenia friendly - Slogan proclaims ‘Malvinas are Argentinian’ before kick-off
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/southame...
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/southame...
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