Cameron - crackdown on booze abuse
Discussion
Yet another policy planning idea that has been bubbling away in politicians heads for years is being resurrected, again. Lets crackdown on all those nasty peasants who go out at weekends with the sole intention of getting completely off their heads by over boozing. We have all seen the CTV footage of city centre pubs and clubs, people staggering out drunk creating unwanted problems for BiB and NHS.
So will the Government raise the duty on booze, minimum price it per unit, treat drunks like they used to and sling them into 'Drunk Tanks' or just talk about it and do nothing.
I hope that pricing will remain unaffected and only those that get off their heads in public are penalised.
So will the Government raise the duty on booze, minimum price it per unit, treat drunks like they used to and sling them into 'Drunk Tanks' or just talk about it and do nothing.
I hope that pricing will remain unaffected and only those that get off their heads in public are penalised.
crankedup said:
I hope that pricing will remain unaffected and only those that get off their heads in public are penalised.
Good luck with that. Now that smoking has been virtually criminalised and everyone accepts high prices it was obvious that alcohol would be the next target (probably junk food next).It is fortunate that all of society's ills can be cured by extra tax.
Something needs to be done, though. I and my mates spent 20 years getting royally a
holed yet we didn't start fights, smash windows, puke in the street (much), assault coppers, shout abuse and litter the place up and we only had one visit to A&E between us (not me). There's a difference between getting pissed and behaving like thousands of these s behave every night.
holed yet we didn't start fights, smash windows, puke in the street (much), assault coppers, shout abuse and litter the place up and we only had one visit to A&E between us (not me). There's a difference between getting pissed and behaving like thousands of these s behave every night.
frosted said:
As a non drinker I am in favour of pricing people out, seriously dislike drunks
A genuine question. Does one attain a position atop a horse so high, or is one born with it?I'd also add that I'm in favour of pricing people out of cars, as I seriously dislike accidents. While I'm there, I'd like to price people out of having children, because some of them become criminals, and I seriously dislike those. I'd also rather like to price out all pets, because some of them poo on the pavement, and I seriously dislike that.
Oh to live in a frosted-centric world.
Edited by iphonedyou on Wednesday 15th February 16:50
In 1986 0r 7 Brighton introduced a licensing unit. It had a sergeant in charge, with an inspector having overall responsibility. There were three or four PCs. The idea was to go round to pubs and clubs and report for any offences seen. Odd though it sounds it had the support of the majority of landlords.
The change was quite remarkable. Licencees suddenly started doing their job. If there were fights outside their pub then it went on the pub record. Any number of fights and they were in danger of losing their licence. PCs in uniform would walk round inside a pub and if they found anyone drunk they were excluded, by the licencee, and a report made, sometime resulting in a fine.
All of a sudden trouble dropped remarkably. Bouncers would not simply throw drunks into the street but manage them. It was a success. The number of problems dropped.
But as with such things the superintendent of the nick decided that as we had no problems now with pubs the licensing unit was a waste of money and officers and binned it. And so the trouble increased.
The inspector in charge of the unit was a miserable bod who was tea-total. He was great.
Initially there were a considerable number of breeches of the licensing regs but as time went on these plummeted to the level of pre LU.
When I ran a shift, one of my officers, a WPC, was assaulted outside a pub. I patrolled it for the rest of the night duty and then the following set of lates, with the LU taking up the slack when I was off. The brewery apologised to the LU (although not to the WPC) and we had little or no trouble from then on.
We don't need such things as drunk tanks and all that stuff. It might look good on paper but it is expensive (at a time of massive cuts) and will cure nothing. You need to hit pubs before the problems start. But that would require initiative and imagination. Not the strong points of any MP. Headlines only for them.
The change was quite remarkable. Licencees suddenly started doing their job. If there were fights outside their pub then it went on the pub record. Any number of fights and they were in danger of losing their licence. PCs in uniform would walk round inside a pub and if they found anyone drunk they were excluded, by the licencee, and a report made, sometime resulting in a fine.
All of a sudden trouble dropped remarkably. Bouncers would not simply throw drunks into the street but manage them. It was a success. The number of problems dropped.
But as with such things the superintendent of the nick decided that as we had no problems now with pubs the licensing unit was a waste of money and officers and binned it. And so the trouble increased.
The inspector in charge of the unit was a miserable bod who was tea-total. He was great.
Initially there were a considerable number of breeches of the licensing regs but as time went on these plummeted to the level of pre LU.
When I ran a shift, one of my officers, a WPC, was assaulted outside a pub. I patrolled it for the rest of the night duty and then the following set of lates, with the LU taking up the slack when I was off. The brewery apologised to the LU (although not to the WPC) and we had little or no trouble from then on.
We don't need such things as drunk tanks and all that stuff. It might look good on paper but it is expensive (at a time of massive cuts) and will cure nothing. You need to hit pubs before the problems start. But that would require initiative and imagination. Not the strong points of any MP. Headlines only for them.
It's interesting. I was in New York a few months back, and chatting to the bar man in our hotel, he told us that he couldn't serve anybody he percieved to be drunk. And that, incredibly, were a person he'd served go on to commit a crime, he'd be liable in some way for having served him to the point of drunkenness.
He routinely kept track of how many drinks, and what type, a customer had, and related it to their size, age, etc.
I thought that was quite mad.
He routinely kept track of how many drinks, and what type, a customer had, and related it to their size, age, etc.
I thought that was quite mad.
As part of growing up I was also out and about downing pints and shorts like there was no tomorrow. Stagger home, usually ten miles or more, and be home by 4.00 or 5.00am. Sleep it off for the day and repeat Saturday night. Never had problems (that I can remember
)and after a few years of this I grew up. So I helped the local economy by spending all of my left over wages, after paying Mum housekeeping, in the pubs.
The only difference I can see now is that the drunks seem to be unable to walk/stagger home without needing a ambulance to offer them comfort. Bloody lightweights.
)and after a few years of this I grew up. So I helped the local economy by spending all of my left over wages, after paying Mum housekeeping, in the pubs.The only difference I can see now is that the drunks seem to be unable to walk/stagger home without needing a ambulance to offer them comfort. Bloody lightweights.
Mojooo said:
I believe in the UK you cannot serve drunks either - that was what i was told when I worked at a supermarket anyway.
May not apply to pubs though.
Still true iirc - there are 3 groups that a landlord cannot serve by law:May not apply to pubs though.
People known to be drunk
Policeman/woman in uniform
A known prostitute
This may be b
ks though, it's been a while (read: many years) since I looked at that particular section of the law. frosted said:
As a non drinker I am in favour of pricing people out, seriously dislike drunks
Right...
(seem to be using this meme more and more).
I've had my fair share of experiences with drunks working in a very busy Essex A&E on a Friday/Saturday night. Ranges from minor things - cuts and bruises to people coming in unconscious/vomiting compromising their airway, skull fractures from falls or fights. Takes up a BIG proportion of your time and it is VERY difficult to assess someone who is drunk if you are suspecting an underlying medical problem.
The pricing is not the issue. It is the cultural attitude in this country to alcohol and getting wrecked. The rest of mainland Europe seem to drink as much (if not more) but seem to avoid the issues we have here. Over there, alcohol is introduced at an earlier age at the dinner table under the parent's supervision.
I couldn't possibly take a higher moral stance, suffice to say 6 years at university resulted in the 'occasional' slightly squiffy night.
I think the problem is that people think that they have to get wasted to have a good time now. I'm currently a student (not a heavy drinker) and it seems from talking to my parents that nowadays it seems that alcohol has become more integral to the whole thing, rather than just a part.
It seems that my parents would go out,drink what they felt like, and if they got drunk it was just a product of that, whereas nowadays people seem to push themselves to get drunk on nights out.
IMO the problem lies with the above and the cheap booze from supermarkets. 75 cl of Vodka can cost you 2-3 pints worth so people can get their hands on much more alcohol for less ££. I don't particularly think that the problem is the bars etc, more the fact that people now drink a load of booze before heading out (I worked in a student bar and we'd be empty on a Friday night, people would just stay at home and get off their faces before heading to a club)
It seems that my parents would go out,drink what they felt like, and if they got drunk it was just a product of that, whereas nowadays people seem to push themselves to get drunk on nights out.
IMO the problem lies with the above and the cheap booze from supermarkets. 75 cl of Vodka can cost you 2-3 pints worth so people can get their hands on much more alcohol for less ££. I don't particularly think that the problem is the bars etc, more the fact that people now drink a load of booze before heading out (I worked in a student bar and we'd be empty on a Friday night, people would just stay at home and get off their faces before heading to a club)
Is it any wonder we have a culture of getting bladdered in the UK, all of the soaps use boozers as a focal point and I've seen many occasions where the characters make a reference to getting off their face or some reference to celebrating something by getting wasted......always the female ones too.
g3org3y said:
The pricing is not the issue. It is the cultural attitude in this country to alcohol and getting wrecked. The [-]rest of mainland[/i]south of Europe seem to drink as much (if not more) but seem to avoid the issues we have here. Over there, alcohol is introduced at an earlier age at the dinner table under the parent's supervision.
Getting pissed and then having one, some or all of having a fight, a shag, a spew and a kebab (not necessarily in that order) is commonplace in northern Europe.It's easy to have a sunny, laid-back attitude to drinking in a sunny, laid-back place. Anywhere you get long, dark, miserable winters, you get massive pissheads.
Worked example: Russia.
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