Rape Gang - How'd they get away with it for so long?

Rape Gang - How'd they get away with it for so long?

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Du1point8

21,604 posts

191 months

Tuesday 21st February 2012
quotequote all
I not understanding why this is just rape and not peadophilia straight through and through... they groomed them and then raped them...

Or is this a forbidden word now?

heppers75

3,135 posts

216 months

Tuesday 21st February 2012
quotequote all
Mojooo said:
heppers75 said:
Mojooo said:
heppers75 said:
Not wanting to state the bleeding obvious but numerically surely there are more white than Asian teenagers in the UK so therefore in any given location statistically there is likely to be numerically more anyway so that is a statistically spurious argument at best!?
Yes, but even proportionatley.
Ok so I assume then you know all the figures to back that up? I don't BTW so happy to learn from your sharing of them, or is this simply an assumption on your part?
As I said, it was my experience.
So an assumption then... Based on no demonstrable fact at all.... oooook whistle

kieranjholland

3,572 posts

169 months

Tuesday 21st February 2012
quotequote all
It's because the Muslamic Infidel has Interacial/Iraqi/Muslamic Law which condone Muslamic Ray Guns. Fact. This guy said so:



click image to see video

Edited by kieranjholland on Tuesday 21st February 22:26

Chrisw666

22,655 posts

198 months

Tuesday 21st February 2012
quotequote all
Mojooo said:
Fair points. But why do we seemingly have so many more teenagers 'straying' than we did 20 years ago.
Detection, improvement in the care system and other related services that provide support to children, more widespread media reporting of everything brings it to more people's attention.

The moral decline of men isn't an issue but there are groups of men who are from communities that are less worried about judgement by the majority thinking 'why not'. The other issue is that men who would have been considering younger girls 20 years ago can now contact kids from their mums bedroom instead of hanging around bus shelters, which leads us to the final group being younger men who would have never had contact with the opposite sex pre-internet being able to sexually exploit teenagers who are vulnerable and have lower self-esteem online and through building trust online.

Mojooo

12,668 posts

179 months

Tuesday 21st February 2012
quotequote all
heppers75 said:
Mojooo said:
heppers75 said:
Mojooo said:
heppers75 said:
Not wanting to state the bleeding obvious but numerically surely there are more white than Asian teenagers in the UK so therefore in any given location statistically there is likely to be numerically more anyway so that is a statistically spurious argument at best!?
Yes, but even proportionatley.
Ok so I assume then you know all the figures to back that up? I don't BTW so happy to learn from your sharing of them, or is this simply an assumption on your part?
As I said, it was my experience.
So an assumption then... Based on no demonstrable fact at all.... oooook whistle
An assumption based on experience, if you will.

Its also a subject that is probably very difficult to demonstrate by fact and statistics unless you spent a significant amount of time hanging around streets all over the UK recorfing how many girls you see that look like they are upto stuff like underage drinking.


Chrisw666

22,655 posts

198 months

Tuesday 21st February 2012
quotequote all
Would there be any point suggesting that the fact that young Asian males often coat themselves in bling, drive cars with the right badges, have all the latest must have gadgets, and often act like wide boys makes them attractive to troubled young women?

Mojooo

12,668 posts

179 months

Tuesday 21st February 2012
quotequote all
Chrisw666 said:
Would there be any point suggesting that the fact that young Asian males often coat themselves in bling, drive cars with the right badges, have all the latest must have gadgets, and often act like wide boys makes them attractive to troubled young women?
Often yes, but not the majority (unless you can prove it with a demonstratable fact of course!)

Although these guys pictured don't look like the type you described.

heppers75

3,135 posts

216 months

Tuesday 21st February 2012
quotequote all
Mojooo said:
heppers75 said:
Mojooo said:
heppers75 said:
Mojooo said:
heppers75 said:
Not wanting to state the bleeding obvious but numerically surely there are more white than Asian teenagers in the UK so therefore in any given location statistically there is likely to be numerically more anyway so that is a statistically spurious argument at best!?
Yes, but even proportionatley.
Ok so I assume then you know all the figures to back that up? I don't BTW so happy to learn from your sharing of them, or is this simply an assumption on your part?
As I said, it was my experience.
So an assumption then... Based on no demonstrable fact at all.... oooook whistle
An assumption based on experience, if you will.

Its also a subject that is probably very difficult to demonstrate by fact and statistics unless you spent a significant amount of time hanging around streets all over the UK recorfing how many girls you see that look like they are upto stuff like underage drinking.
So not sure where you live OP but I am not a million miles outside of Leicester and I can all but guarantee you right now if I went for a wander around the city centre and/or some of the various estate, parks and other 'hang out' type locations (and I do drive past them as rat runs on the odd occasion so have observed as much) I would see a greater or equitable concentration of Asian teenagers both male and female engaging in drinking smoking and I suspect worse.

However if I went for a wander around half a dozen of the smaller villages between the city and where I live I am sure it would be far fewer to zero, demographics are what they are but to suggest there is some sort of ubiquitous national truth based on your own personal experience would be as daft as me saying the reverse based on the fact I am using a city with a huge Asian population or agreeing with you based on observing a village where it is as likely as not there is not a single Asian resident!

carmonk

7,910 posts

186 months

Tuesday 21st February 2012
quotequote all
Mojooo said:
Knowing lots of Muslims I wouldnt say that is a view shared by anyone I know. I very much doubt these guys are much practising Muslims because here is a humdinger for you, most people of any background will realise shagging a drunk 14 year old is probably wrong on some level. Whilst the Koran may say this that or the other I think you overestimate how many follow it or believe it to the letter. I would suggest they are just scum."
Saying they're scum doesn't negate any other criticism and we often see it rolled out in situations like this. What it actually means is, how dare people actually look at the reasons and motivations for the crime and attempt to link it with the Pakistani Muslim community. 'Most people of any background' would not subscribe to a book that states women should be beaten, rape victims stoned and infidels murdered so be aware that an appeal to accepted morality is worthless in this situation.

Mojooo said:
Culturual issues may come into it in that women may be classed less equal than men and to some extent (and not to sound nasty) if there are lots of teenagers hanging around on the street for the 'taking' then it is unsurprising these types of gangs preying on easy targets.
'Less equal'; you can't even bring yourself to admit what any educated person accepts as fact. I've also lived in areas where lots of teenagers hang out and so far I've managed to avoid raping any of them. Muslims through the Koran acknowledge themselves as weak-minded when it comes to sexual urges which is the basis of how the burqa and niqab arose. In Islam, a woman who shows flesh is asking for it and if she is raped then it's her own fault and she should be punished. When you link this fact with the religosity and religious-inspired culture of the criminals it's no surprise that this sort of behaviour is hugely over-represented in the Islamic communities of the UK.

Mojooo said:
I find it interesting that when asian criminals are bought to justice the first things that are always mentioned are their ethnicity, religion and community - yet when you get a white paedo gang none of that is mentioned.
Firstly the ethnicity of white criminals may not be mentioned because, to quote Shane Meadows, this is England. Although the presence of white British in this country is becoming more rare by the day it hasn't yet got to the stage when we marvel that a group of criminals share the indiginous ethnicity.

Secondly, when culture and religion can account for motivation then only an apologist would suggest that the law abiding citizens of the land should refrain from addressing the issue and calling a spade a spade.

Mojooo said:
Do white padeo gangs have less respect for women? Why didnt the community in Cornwall pick up this lot? http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2010/nov/26/cornwall-...
The community didn't report them because they didn't know about them. Do you think that if people in the community had known about them they would have turned a blind eye? Can you imagine that happening in an English secular or Christian community (Catholic Church excepted)? On a recent documentary a reporter visited a Pakistani Muslim community and spoke to a bunch of youths on the street. Even though they (allegedly) weren't involved in any crime they knew what was going on and weren't afraid to talk about it.

Mojooo said:
The simple fact is there is a section of society out there that these scumbags dont resepect (i.e these teenagers that seem to be wandering the streets or whatnot) - whether the offenders are white or brown. it really says more about our country that these girls can be bought and sold so easily. maybe is says something about their culture that asian girls are not the ones wodnering the street getting drunk and "other stuff".
If you make any more excuses for these people you'll disappear up your own rectum, honestly.

Mojooo said:
Failure of parenting if you ask me - or possibly the care system if an earlier post is accurate.
Failure of parenting leaves kids to wander the street. Failure at being a civilised human causes people to rape them. It's that simple.

Mojooo said:
I think the problem is probably worse than we think and I think a lot more people would be at it if they had access and knew how easy it probably is.
From anecdotal reports it is far worse that we are given to believe. So let's see what proportion of the culprits of this type of crime are from the 90% indiginous population and how many are from the 2% Pakistani Muslim. If the former turns out to outnumber the latter by 45:1 instead of the latter outnumbering the former by 5:1 then I'll come back and apologise for my ridiculous assertions.

Chrisw666

22,655 posts

198 months

Tuesday 21st February 2012
quotequote all
Mojooo said:
Often yes, but not the majority (unless you can prove it with a demonstratable fact of course!)

Although these guys pictured don't look like the type you described.
They don't but I'd imagine some of that was part of the grooming phase, the men from West Yorks that are currently operating in my home town do fit the demographic I described.

cazzer

8,883 posts

247 months

Tuesday 21st February 2012
quotequote all
carmonk said:
calling a spade a spade.
Racist.....


richinleeds

738 posts

199 months

Tuesday 21st February 2012
quotequote all
carmonk said:
Mojooo said:
Knowing lots of Muslims I wouldnt say that is a view shared by anyone I know. I very much doubt these guys are much practising Muslims because here is a humdinger for you, most people of any background will realise shagging a drunk 14 year old is probably wrong on some level. Whilst the Koran may say this that or the other I think you overestimate how many follow it or believe it to the letter. I would suggest they are just scum."
Saying they're scum doesn't negate any other criticism and we often see it rolled out in situations like this. What it actually means is, how dare people actually look at the reasons and motivations for the crime and attempt to link it with the Pakistani Muslim community. 'Most people of any background' would not subscribe to a book that states women should be beaten, rape victims stoned and infidels murdered so be aware that an appeal to accepted morality is worthless in this situation.

Mojooo said:
Culturual issues may come into it in that women may be classed less equal than men and to some extent (and not to sound nasty) if there are lots of teenagers hanging around on the street for the 'taking' then it is unsurprising these types of gangs preying on easy targets.
'Less equal'; you can't even bring yourself to admit what any educated person accepts as fact. I've also lived in areas where lots of teenagers hang out and so far I've managed to avoid raping any of them. Muslims through the Koran acknowledge themselves as weak-minded when it comes to sexual urges which is the basis of how the burqa and niqab arose. In Islam, a woman who shows flesh is asking for it and if she is raped then it's her own fault and she should be punished. When you link this fact with the religosity and religious-inspired culture of the criminals it's no surprise that this sort of behaviour is hugely over-represented in the Islamic communities of the UK.

Mojooo said:
I find it interesting that when asian criminals are bought to justice the first things that are always mentioned are their ethnicity, religion and community - yet when you get a white paedo gang none of that is mentioned.
Firstly the ethnicity of white criminals may not be mentioned because, to quote Shane Meadows, this is England. Although the presence of white British in this country is becoming more rare by the day it hasn't yet got to the stage when we marvel that a group of criminals share the indiginous ethnicity.

Secondly, when culture and religion can account for motivation then only an apologist would suggest that the law abiding citizens of the land should refrain from addressing the issue and calling a spade a spade.

Mojooo said:
Do white padeo gangs have less respect for women? Why didnt the community in Cornwall pick up this lot? http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2010/nov/26/cornwall-...
The community didn't report them because they didn't know about them. Do you think that if people in the community had known about them they would have turned a blind eye? Can you imagine that happening in an English secular or Christian community (Catholic Church excepted)? On a recent documentary a reporter visited a Pakistani Muslim community and spoke to a bunch of youths on the street. Even though they (allegedly) weren't involved in any crime they knew what was going on and weren't afraid to talk about it.

Mojooo said:
The simple fact is there is a section of society out there that these scumbags dont resepect (i.e these teenagers that seem to be wandering the streets or whatnot) - whether the offenders are white or brown. it really says more about our country that these girls can be bought and sold so easily. maybe is says something about their culture that asian girls are not the ones wodnering the street getting drunk and "other stuff".
If you make any more excuses for these people you'll disappear up your own rectum, honestly.

Mojooo said:
Failure of parenting if you ask me - or possibly the care system if an earlier post is accurate.
Failure of parenting leaves kids to wander the street. Failure at being a civilised human causes people to rape them. It's that simple.

Mojooo said:
I think the problem is probably worse than we think and I think a lot more people would be at it if they had access and knew how easy it probably is.
From anecdotal reports it is far worse that we are given to believe. So let's see what proportion of the culprits of this type of crime are from the 90% indiginous population and how many are from the 2% Pakistani Muslim. If the former turns out to outnumber the latter by 45:1 instead of the latter outnumbering the former by 5:1 then I'll come back and apologise for my ridiculous assertions.
Great post carmonk bow

12gauge

1,274 posts

173 months

Tuesday 21st February 2012
quotequote all
Mojooo said:
I am (and have) quite happily caled the blokes who did it scum.

What I don't agree with is the veiled suggestions that they are the only ones that do this kind of stuff when quite clearly that is not the case/

The only difference is when an ethnic minority commits a crime it is pounded home that they are an ethnic minority.

You are one of the main ones to always bring it up.

Hopefully you will be doing the same nexttime an englishman commits such a heinous act.
Should we ignore the fact they are men too, lest it prejudices all men as sex offenders?

Its got nothing to do with being an 'ethnic minority' I dont see Sikhs or Hindus involved in it on any wide scale. Theres simply no hiding the fact Mohammed, the central human embodiment of their religion, was a Paedophile.

No ones suggesting non-muslims don't do it, but in the case of Muslims, their religion give's them the belief its their 'moral' right to do so.

12gauge

1,274 posts

173 months

Tuesday 21st February 2012
quotequote all
Mojooo said:
So how do we address the problem of an asian male being 5 times more likely to be a paedo than a white man?
Firstly getting the media to admit its not 'asian' males but 'muslim' males would be a start.

Mojooo

12,668 posts

179 months

Wednesday 22nd February 2012
quotequote all
Interesting theory. But not one I'll bother debating over.

-Z-

5,980 posts

205 months

Wednesday 22nd February 2012
quotequote all
The elephant in the room is the fact that (IMO) it's unfair to label this as a specifically 'Muslim' problem. The last time I checked, one particular country does not represent the views or actions of the Islamic world.

E.g. Almost all UK Albanians are Muslim but Albanian gang crime is not labelled as Muslim gang crime. Why is that?

Islam has nothing to do with this.

Only 11% of the Worlds muslims are from Pakistan, did you know there are more Muslims from Indonesia than any other country in the World? How often do Indonesians cause trouble?

Chrisw666

22,655 posts

198 months

Wednesday 22nd February 2012
quotequote all
The report I heard earlier on 6 musics news mentioned that some of the men in court are from the same villages in Pakistan, which is the closest thing to identifying a specific group I have read.

From the media POV though by suggesting it is Muslim or Pakistani men they risk stirring up racial hatred, especially when to the dumber right wing apologists Muslim or is a generic term used to describe a brown person. The other issue is that by making this problem one cause by a small number of men they lose the ability to create a moral panic about the wider issue of blokes grooming vulnerable children.

-Z-

5,980 posts

205 months

Wednesday 22nd February 2012
quotequote all
Chrisw666 said:
The report I heard earlier on 6 musics news mentioned that some of the men in court are from the same villages in Pakistan, which is the closest thing to identifying a specific group I have read.

From the media POV though by suggesting it is Muslim or Pakistani men they risk stirring up racial hatred, especially when to the dumber right wing apologists Muslim or is a generic term used to describe a brown person. The other issue is that by making this problem one cause by a small number of men they lose the ability to create a moral panic about the wider issue of blokes grooming vulnerable children.
That is the issue. As much as it offends me as a Muslim to label it as a Muslim problem, it is offensive to Pakistanis to label it as a Pakistani problem.

I think sticking to labelling them as a bunch of s works for me.

carmonk

7,910 posts

186 months

Wednesday 22nd February 2012
quotequote all
-Z- said:
Chrisw666 said:
The report I heard earlier on 6 musics news mentioned that some of the men in court are from the same villages in Pakistan, which is the closest thing to identifying a specific group I have read.

From the media POV though by suggesting it is Muslim or Pakistani men they risk stirring up racial hatred, especially when to the dumber right wing apologists Muslim or is a generic term used to describe a brown person. The other issue is that by making this problem one cause by a small number of men they lose the ability to create a moral panic about the wider issue of blokes grooming vulnerable children.
That is the issue. As much as it offends me as a Muslim to label it as a Muslim problem, it is offensive to Pakistanis to label it as a Pakistani problem.

I think sticking to labelling them as a bunch of s works for me.
And it's that attitude which allows this kind of behaviour to go unchallenged.

12gauge

1,274 posts

173 months

Wednesday 22nd February 2012
quotequote all
-Z- said:
The elephant in the room is the fact that (IMO) it's unfair to label this as a specifically 'Muslim' problem. The last time I checked, one particular country does not represent the views or actions of the Islamic world.

E.g. Almost all UK Albanians are Muslim but Albanian gang crime is not labelled as Muslim gang crime. Why is that?

Islam has nothing to do with this.

Only 11% of the Worlds muslims are from Pakistan, did you know there are more Muslims from Indonesia than any other country in the World? How often do Indonesians cause trouble?
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/7717819.stm

Not many Indonesians in the UK would be the probable reason we dont hear much of them.

Also, i think different so called 'muslims' find themselves in the western world for different reasons. The Persian (Iranian) muslims that seem quite common in the USA were fleeing Islamic theocracy. I would consider them Islamic in name only. The Pakistani/Bangladeshi ones that arrive in the UK come mainly for economic reason's and seem more than happy to set up their own little backward theocratic bubbles, sharia courts etc

I dont consider it 'unfair' to label Islam anything, its not slanderous. Islam like all religions has the blood of millions on its hands. Criticizing what is nothing more than a made up ideology should never be off limits. I consider followers of christianity idiots, albeit nowadays mostly harmless idiots. I consider followers of Islam very dangerous idiots. If they want to consider me a hellbound kuffar infidel in return, they can do that too.
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