Many children killed in another ski trip coach crash

[croyde]

Just terrible just doesn't bear thinking about. All those families affected by this, so tragic.

Was trying to work out how so many were killed and injured until I saw that picture of the tunnel

The other day I stupidly drove my car into a brick wall when parking. I probably hit the wall at about 3 or 4 miles an hour, maybe less and although there was no damage to the car, it surprised me how much I was jolted.

It made me then realise the trauma suffered when a car hits a tree, wall or similar unmovable object at only 20 miles an hour. The designers of that tunnel should be shot.

[Derek Smith]

sunbeam alpine said:

Belgian TV news have just shown footage of the coach being towed out of the tunnel. The front and RH side of the coach took the impact and are destroyed - the RH side of the coach is wrecked for about half the length. They are also showing footage from a Swiss press conference saying that the coach was narly new and fitted with seatbelts.

Terrible tragedy.

ETA - slow typing - pics above.

The pictures I saw earlier didn't show the front right.

They have said a number of times that the coach was new. I thought there were complaints a few years ago about the new EU regs on construction of coaches but the EU pushed them through. Makes you wonder doesn't it, what might have happened.

[Cheib]

My god just seen the video of the coach being removed from the tunnel on SKY.

Shocking, absolutely bloody shocking.

Driven through many of these tunnels myself and have actually driven on that road a few times.

SKY are also reporting that there are pictures on a Blog for the trip of the children on the buses earlier in the trip...they appeared not be wearing seat belts apparently.

[Roop]

Sad news indeed. The tunnel wall is in fact at an angle, just too acute it would seem.

Generally speaking road design and road safety here in Switzerland is miles behind the rest of western Europe. It really is like living in the 1970s in that respect. Factor in the very little common sense all round (design and planning, road users and pedestrians alike) means that many accidents are totally avoidable IMO.

[superkartracer]

Eric Mc said:

Two?

Yes TWO in a few weeks, very sad

[over_the_hill]

nick s said:

righhhttt, so i'm flying into Geneva on Saturday ngiht and have a 3 hour coach transfer to a Ski resort. This really fills me with confidence!!! :0

Over the next 3-4 days approximately 30 people will die on British roads.
This will not make headline news and no one will bat an eyelid other than close family and friends.
Mainly because they will be isolated incidents involving 1 or 2 people at a time.

Do you intend to drive your car this week or do you not have the confidence.

Get some perspective.

Also as noted above, although the coach was almost certainly fitted with seat belts it doesn't mean they were being worn, and knowing what kids are like they were probably hanging over the seats talking to their mates in the row behind/in front etc.

[J B L]

As a parent, I cannot begin to imagine what it's like to receive such news. Just thinking about how they could feel makes me very sad.

A thought as well for the first rescuers who got on the scene and in the bus first.

[Munter]

Along with others I cant work out why they would put a flat face on that wall in the tunnel. Do they not want to deflect cars back into the traffic? Better to have a one vehicle accident than "bounce" it back into the traffic?

[Bluebarge]

Seems to be quite a lot of loose timber in the interior of that coach - presumably what were luggage racks etc. I can't imagine that would do much good flying around in a crash. Time to look again at crash standards for coaches perhaps.

[anonymous-user]

SystemParanoia said:

why are coaches falling off the roads left right and centre lately?

Because coach drivers drive like idiots

[JonnyFive]

Bluebarge said:

Seems to be quite a lot of loose timber in the interior of that coach - presumably what were luggage racks etc. I can't imagine that would do much good flying around in a crash. Time to look again at crash standards for coaches perhaps.

I very much doubt the kids were wearing seatbelts.. I know on school trips/bus to school we never wore seatbelts.

[ewenm]

nick s said:

righhhttt, so i'm flying into Geneva on Saturday ngiht and have a 3 hour coach transfer to a Ski resort. This really fills me with confidence!!! :0

Just to help you out, last time I did a coach transfer from Tignes to Geneva, it was about 6am, icy and snowy, and the coach driver overtook the snowplough on the way down the mountain.

But I'm sure you'll be fine...

[Melman Giraffe]

JonnyFive said:

Bluebarge said:

Seems to be quite a lot of loose timber in the interior of that coach - presumably what were luggage racks etc. I can't imagine that would do much good flying around in a crash. Time to look again at crash standards for coaches perhaps.

I very much doubt the kids were wearing seatbelts.. I know on school trips/bus to school we never wore seatbelts.

My sons on a school trip today, and before the coach left all the children were require to fasten seat belts. Looking at the damage on that coach even if they were wearing belts they wouldn't stand a chance

[JonnyFive]

Melman Giraffe said:

JonnyFive said:

Bluebarge said:

Seems to be quite a lot of loose timber in the interior of that coach - presumably what were luggage racks etc. I can't imagine that would do much good flying around in a crash. Time to look again at crash standards for coaches perhaps.

I very much doubt the kids were wearing seatbelts.. I know on school trips/bus to school we never wore seatbelts.

My sons on a school trip today, and before the coach left all the children were require to fasten seat belts. Looking at the damage on that coach even if they were wearing belts they wouldn't stand a chance

True, many people do coaches carry.. 50? Half of the bus looks seriously damaged so maybe they were wearing them and didn't make much difference.

[dandarez]

Mentions of driver falling asleep, nobody else picked up that 'both' drivers killed then?
These coaches have 2 drivers.
It also has a 75 disc sticker on the rear so it's speed limit is under 50 mph. More normal applications for coaches is for 100kmh sticker.

Also is coach 'safety' keeping up with the strides made in car safety?
All that glass area above waistline and apparently still no strengthening of roof area - same applies to buses.
To me the coach looks like it has disintegrated at the front. If it was keeping to 'its' speed limit under 50, that is horrendous!

I agree the tunnel wall angles look suspect, but aren't hazards everywhere?
Imagine if that tunnel had been full of busy traffic!

[ewenm]

dandarez said:

Mentions of driver falling asleep, nobody else picked up that 'both' drivers killed then?
These coaches have 2 drivers.

Well, two people allowed to drive, but only one driver at any one time. If that driver falls asleep/has heart attack/goes mad/etc the "other" driver has little to no time/capability to prevent an accident.

[Bill]

dandarez said:

Mentions of driver falling asleep, nobody else picked up that 'both' drivers killed then?
These coaches have 2 drivers.

LHD coach so the spare driver could well have been sat on the right

Ghastly all round

[dandarez]

ewenm said:

dandarez said:

Mentions of driver falling asleep, nobody else picked up that 'both' drivers killed then?
These coaches have 2 drivers.

Well, two people allowed to drive, but only one driver at any one time. If that driver falls asleep/has heart attack/goes mad/etc the "other" driver has little to no time/capability to prevent an accident.

Well, obviously.
My point was simply that they do have 2 drivers to allow for the 'tiredness' aspect, so that shouldn't play a part.
Heart attack etc (not sure about 'going mad'!) is of course unpreventable.

[anonymous-user]

Let's not forget that there are a number of reasons why vehicles crash, some are driver error (lack of care or attention, tiredness, substance abuse), but it could equally have been something out of his control (heart attack, cut up by another driver, mechanical failure) so let's not rush in and blame the driver just yet, i'm sure his family are suffering enough as it is.

[Puggit]

I guess there's a high chance of cameras in the tunnel - time will tell.