|
10 Pence Short
27,610 posts
86 months
|
DonkeyApple said: 10 Pence Short said: What are "these currencies"?
Why are you assuming there are multiple currency switches? You are aware businesses can have domestic accounts in alternate currencies, aren't you? So what are the $3 tln in forex trades a day?  And how do you propose a business spends its Facepound or whatever you want to call it? They will need to transfer it to their local currency (or whatever currency you buy in). You can't on one hand decry it as a benefit no more complicated or less useful than any other local currency and on the other hand expect it to be free of the costs associated with general currency transfers. It's already really easy for consumers to buy in different currencies from different jurisdictions and your internet currency idea does not solve any existing problems.
|
|
|
DonkeyApple
12,023 posts
38 months
|
KaraK said: There already is an apolitical completely digital currency and it hasn't had any meaningfull impact on the world economy - or any economy for that matter. None of them have and none of them will unless the concept is rolled out by a global entity such as FB or whoever eventually brings it to the fore. To date they have been launched by entities too small or too confined.
|
|
|
BJG1
1,905 posts
81 months
|
smartypants said: A) If they have a good API, I reckon I could have a good crack at it.
B) No, that's google.com Splitting hairs here really. Facebook has more time spent on site than Google I think whereas Google has more visitors? Regardless, if you don't think building Facebook is a useful achievement then for me this is a case of "don't argue with an idiot, they'll drag you down to your level and beat you with experience"
|
|
|
DonkeyApple
12,023 posts
38 months
|
10 Pence Short said: And how do you propose a business spends its Facepound or whatever you want to call it? They will need to transfer it to their local currency (or whatever currency you buy in).
You can't on one hand decry it as a benefit no more complicated or less useful than any other local currency and on the other hand expect it to be free of the costs associated with general currency transfers.
It's already really easy for consumers to buy in different currencies from different jurisdictions and your internet currency idea does not solve any existing problems. What is the cost of transaction for a small retail exchange? What is the cost of transaction for a large commercial exchange? Shifting the exchange cost upstream to the macro side gives an instant price advantage. Controlling the flow of retail funds gives a huge revenue advantage. Controlling the retail current account gives you massive cost and balance sheet advantages. The benefits are big. And it isn't my idea . It's been around since retail web commerce began but it can only be delivered by an entity with a large global web reach. So this is why the interest has arisen in a vehicle like FB. It's the first of its kind.
|
|
|
smartypants
17,406 posts
38 months
|
BJG1 said: smartypants said: A) If they have a good API, I reckon I could have a good crack at it.
B) No, that's google.com Splitting hairs here really. Facebook has more time spent on site than Google I think whereas Google has more visitors? Regardless, if you don't think building Facebook is a useful achievement then for me this is a case of "don't argue with an idiot, they'll drag you down to your level and beat you with experience" I for one am on Google more by a long way than Facebook. Not least their search engine, but Play store for Android apps, Gmail for mail, Maps - all off google.com. The Google model is one to be impressed with. Not FB. They've just taken the MySpace and FriendsReunited idea and ran further with it at the same time the use of social media reached the masses. Nothing has changed with it since it's inception, apart from the amount of users. I have seen no evolution from it, and can't really see how it can evolve further. But of course, I'm just an idiot, what do I know 
|
Advertisement
|
|
|
Oakey
13,728 posts
85 months
|
So how many DonkeyApples will it cost me to buy an Xbox 360 or whatever on Facebook?
|
|
|
KaraK
10,615 posts
78 months
|
DonkeyApple said: KaraK said: There already is an apolitical completely digital currency and it hasn't had any meaningfull impact on the world economy - or any economy for that matter. None of them have and none of them will unless the concept is rolled out by a global entity such as FB or whoever eventually brings it to the fore. To date they have been launched by entities too small or too confined. I'm not saying it will never happen but currently the only global or even semi global entities big enough to launch such a currency are either politcal or commercial. If a commercial entity such as facebook was to do it they would obviously be in it for a profit - which would mean presumably that they would either take a cut of all transactions in it or a cut of all currency exchanged into it and unless they were doing that at very, very small percentages and hoping to make the money on the volume why would there be any benefit to either individuals or businesses to use it? They still have the hassle and expense of exchanging in and out of their "local" currency and untill it does reach a certain level of adoption it will be awkward to use and that itself will inhibit adoption. Add in the general wariness people will have of new currency and the fact that all commercial entities ultimately have got a "parent" country and it'd be a herculean task to undertake for unproven and possibly dubious benefit.
|
|
|
Oakey
13,728 posts
85 months
|
And would you really trust the likes of Facebook with your money? I'm reluctant to use Paypal as it is thanks to all the random transactions of £1 they kept taking from my account with no explantion.
|
|
|
DonkeyApple
12,023 posts
38 months
|
KaraK said: I'm not saying it will never happen but currently the only global or even semi global entities big enough to launch such a currency are either politcal or commercial. If a commercial entity such as facebook was to do it they would obviously be in it for a profit - which would mean presumably that they would either take a cut of all transactions in it or a cut of all currency exchanged into it and unless they were doing that at very, very small percentages and hoping to make the money on the volume why would there be any benefit to either individuals or businesses to use it? They still have the hassle and expense of exchanging in and out of their "local" currency and untill it does reach a certain level of adoption it will be awkward to use and that itself will inhibit adoption. Add in the general wariness people will have of new currency and the fact that all commercial entities ultimately have got a "parent" country and it'd be a herculean task to undertake for unproven and possibly dubious benefit. Yup. But that is assuming the PayPal model which is just a payment facilitator. The model requires the concept of banking so people maintain a deposit account structure for online retail purchases. Products are easily priced online in any currency so an additional one is nothing extra. Banks already operate current accounts in all currencies so again, none of this is actually reinventing the wheel. What it does is remove an extremely costly exchange system for retail users that will always halt the growth and potential of cross border retail spending while at the same time scalping more revenue than any advertising model could ever achieve.
|
|
|
KaraK
10,615 posts
78 months
|
DonkeyApple said: KaraK said: I'm not saying it will never happen but currently the only global or even semi global entities big enough to launch such a currency are either politcal or commercial. If a commercial entity such as facebook was to do it they would obviously be in it for a profit - which would mean presumably that they would either take a cut of all transactions in it or a cut of all currency exchanged into it and unless they were doing that at very, very small percentages and hoping to make the money on the volume why would there be any benefit to either individuals or businesses to use it? They still have the hassle and expense of exchanging in and out of their "local" currency and untill it does reach a certain level of adoption it will be awkward to use and that itself will inhibit adoption. Add in the general wariness people will have of new currency and the fact that all commercial entities ultimately have got a "parent" country and it'd be a herculean task to undertake for unproven and possibly dubious benefit. Yup. But that is assuming the PayPal model which is just a payment facilitator. The model requires the concept of banking so people maintain a deposit account structure for online retail purchases. Products are easily priced online in any currency so an additional one is nothing extra. Banks already operate current accounts in all currencies so again, none of this is actually reinventing the wheel. What it does is remove an extremely costly exchange system for retail users that will always halt the growth and potential of cross border retail spending while at the same time scalping more revenue than any advertising model could ever achieve. But unless you replace all other currencies or at the very least the majority of their use then you still have to exchange your money and that's not going to be free - or as I say take a cut on the transaction which is still not free. I still can't see any benefit.
|
|
|
rohrl
3,739 posts
14 months
|
|
|
KaraK
10,615 posts
78 months
|
rohrl said: Yep.. and it's teetered between being a dismal failure and a complete irrelevance.
|
|
|
coyft
3,021 posts
80 months
|
KaraK said: rohrl said: Yep.. and it's teetered between being a dismal failure and a complete irrelevance. It's had it;s issues that's for sure. But the concept is brilliant!
|
|
|
DonkeyApple
12,023 posts
38 months
|
KaraK said: rohrl said: Yep.. and it's teetered between being a dismal failure and a complete irrelevance. They all have so far apart from the one that is used in one of those online worlds. BitCoin can't possibly entice operators to facilitate the product and haven't the funds to carry out that side themselves. This is why for the concept to work it requires an entity with monumental global coverage. Even then something like FB as it currently stands cannot do it but this whole discussion is based upon the theory that they monetise their users by become a multinational retail trade facilitator. At that point the concept becomes a requirement.
|
|
|
rohrl
3,739 posts
14 months
|
It's only been around 3 years and it's a proof-of-concept rather than a genuine attempt to compete with the dollar. It's certainly an intersting project.
|
|
|
Murph7355
9,415 posts
125 months
|
DonkeyApple said: What is the cost of transaction for a small retail exchange? What is the cost of transaction for a large commercial exchange? Shifting the exchange cost upstream to the macro side gives an instant price advantage. Controlling the flow of retail funds gives a huge revenue advantage. Controlling the retail current account gives you massive cost and balance sheet advantages. The benefits are big. And it isn't my idea . It's been around since retail web commerce began but it can only be delivered by an entity with a large global web reach. So this is why the interest has arisen in a vehicle like FB. It's the first of its kind. If this had legs, why hasn't someone like Amazon or eBay nailed it rather than have country specific versions of themselves and leaving the forex shenanigans to people like PayPal, AmEx etc? I don't really see how a social media site for mongs will have the edge over full blown retail sites already dealing globally and in any goods you care to mention both used and new. If anything were a prime mover in the "bitcoin" type space I would have thought those boys would be. I suspect the reason is that it is not in sovereign states' interests to cede the power of their currencies. And sovereign states, especially one of note, can make it very difficult for web based (or anywhere based) firms to operate if they so desire. Anyway, didn't the FB prospectus note they were just cashing in (in essence)? As others have said, if they had such a killer app up their sleeve, I (a) think we'd have seen it/heard rumours of it by now and (b) doubt they'd have IPO'd yet.
|
|
|
Oakey
13,728 posts
85 months
|
Yeah, the prospectus pretty much said they had no plans, paragraph 33 or 36 irrc.
|
|
|
coyft
3,021 posts
80 months
|
Oakey said: coyft said: I'll have a bit more stock if it stays in the teens tomorrow. You don't want to wait and see if it hits single digits? Damn up 10% today. $21.96
|
|
|
olly22n
11,765 posts
75 months
|
coyft said: Oakey said: coyft said: I'll have a bit more stock if it stays in the teens tomorrow. You don't want to wait and see if it hits single digits? Damn up 10% today. $21.96 You need a few more of those chap
|
|
|
Mermaid
12,493 posts
40 months
|
coyft said: Damn up 10% today. $21.96 Down 3.5% $21.15
|
|
