US Elections 2012 Obama v Romney Official Thread
Discussion
This sums a lot up for me.
Surely there has never been a time before when so many people have planned to vote against their own economic interests. Under the Romney plan everyone pays more except the very wealthy (like Romney himself) who will get a massive tax break. Even those making over $200k a year, which is only a tiny percentage would pay more under Romney. The average family will be $2k a year worse off under the Romney tax plan. Of course if you make $millions a year you will be massively better off. No wonder Sheldon Alderson has given the GOP $40 million this year and the Koch brothers much more!
Surely there has never been a time before when so many people have planned to vote against their own economic interests. Under the Romney plan everyone pays more except the very wealthy (like Romney himself) who will get a massive tax break. Even those making over $200k a year, which is only a tiny percentage would pay more under Romney. The average family will be $2k a year worse off under the Romney tax plan. Of course if you make $millions a year you will be massively better off. No wonder Sheldon Alderson has given the GOP $40 million this year and the Koch brothers much more!
Police had to throw two delegates out of the RNC after they threw nuts at an African American CNN camerawoman and said "this is how we feed animals".
Beggars belief. This is 2012, the GOP is living in 1876.
http://www.boston.com/politicalintelligence/2012/0...
Beggars belief. This is 2012, the GOP is living in 1876.
http://www.boston.com/politicalintelligence/2012/0...
Jimbeaux said:
A good bit like when the NAACP audience threw Oreo cookies at Micheal Steele, huh? Yes, both of those instances beggars belief.
The NAACP are not the democratic party. These people are delegates at the Republican National Convention, representatatives of a party that is anxious to deny that they are in any way racist............I think there is a misconception abroad about democrats and republicans. I still think people in the UK have a skewed view of this because they make the mistake of comparing the Republicans with the tories. In fact the 2012 republicans are so out there on the right that they bear no relation to any UK party although some members would feel probably comfortable in the old NF.
I also think some people believe that democrats are all union members or welfare recipients with their hand out. They think that because they are being told that constantly by GOP commentators and politicians. As I have said before I am a conservative (British version). Apart from one EU election when I voted UKIP I voted tory my whole life in the UK. I'm a pretty regular PHer, I have a reasonably nice home that I own, I like my cars and my daily drive is a new Jag that I own, I'm solvent (not always a good thing in the US where the credit agencies regard you as suspect unless you have debt!), I like to dine out regularly and I like nice things. I earn a decent enough living and lead a pretty comfortable life. I believe in personal responsibility and financial discipline. I dislike "scroungers" but believe in helping those who can't help themselves whilst encouraging those that can work and provide from thelselves to do so. I believe in strong defence but would always be very wary of taking action in other people's back yards, especially unilateral action. I support a few charities that I care about, I could do more but then most of us could. I think I'm most (British) people's idea of a conservative.
Yet I see no appeal whatsoever in what the republicans have to offer and I believe that by US standards I am actually a pretty typical democrat. And I think a lot of British conservatives would feel the same way if they were to live on this side of the pond.
I'm not blinkered either, I disagree with some of what Obama has done. I didn't agree with the extension of the 99 week unemployment benefit program, I believe in the right to work and I felt that whilst he was right about the Keystone pipeline he handled it badly and it was a PR disaster because of that. He should have closed Gitmo as he promised and he was too willing to compromise over affordable healthcare with republicans who were prepared to oppose it come what may. But overall for the reasons I mentioned above and others I think he has done a good job in the circumstances and the alternative, to me, is very unpalatable.
I also think some people believe that democrats are all union members or welfare recipients with their hand out. They think that because they are being told that constantly by GOP commentators and politicians. As I have said before I am a conservative (British version). Apart from one EU election when I voted UKIP I voted tory my whole life in the UK. I'm a pretty regular PHer, I have a reasonably nice home that I own, I like my cars and my daily drive is a new Jag that I own, I'm solvent (not always a good thing in the US where the credit agencies regard you as suspect unless you have debt!), I like to dine out regularly and I like nice things. I earn a decent enough living and lead a pretty comfortable life. I believe in personal responsibility and financial discipline. I dislike "scroungers" but believe in helping those who can't help themselves whilst encouraging those that can work and provide from thelselves to do so. I believe in strong defence but would always be very wary of taking action in other people's back yards, especially unilateral action. I support a few charities that I care about, I could do more but then most of us could. I think I'm most (British) people's idea of a conservative.
Yet I see no appeal whatsoever in what the republicans have to offer and I believe that by US standards I am actually a pretty typical democrat. And I think a lot of British conservatives would feel the same way if they were to live on this side of the pond.
I'm not blinkered either, I disagree with some of what Obama has done. I didn't agree with the extension of the 99 week unemployment benefit program, I believe in the right to work and I felt that whilst he was right about the Keystone pipeline he handled it badly and it was a PR disaster because of that. He should have closed Gitmo as he promised and he was too willing to compromise over affordable healthcare with republicans who were prepared to oppose it come what may. But overall for the reasons I mentioned above and others I think he has done a good job in the circumstances and the alternative, to me, is very unpalatable.
Countdown said:
Rush is just a moron. But he has a huge audience! Like I before, I urge people to listen to him and the brain dead listeners who call in. Today he's actually pissed off with the GOP because they have told speakers at the RNC that they are not allowed to mention his name. 
turbobloke said:
At the end of 2010 did Barack Obama not extend the tax cuts at all income levels through 2012 so they now expire in 2013? If so, and it appears to be, is that funny too?
He had no choice but to sign the bill. Had he not done so taxes would have gone up dramatically for middle class families and poorer tax payers. He said at the time that he was unhappy about it but the alternative would have hurt all Americans. The President has the power of veto but cannot pick and choose which bits of a bill he passes, it's all or nothing.FOX News slam Ryan's speech as pack of lies.
Yes, FOX News!
http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2012/08/30/paul-rya...
Yes, FOX News!
http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2012/08/30/paul-rya...
Just watching Romney. The guy is as fake as a nine bob note. The only thing more nauseating than this claptrap is the reaction of the brain dead morons in the audience. Why does he alway mention that one steel mill in Indiana and never the mill in Kansas where he and Bain asset stripped and left 750 workers without jobs or health coverage? Or even the other Indiana companies that went under with huge job losses while Bain trousered millions?
davepoth said:
unrepentant said:
Just watching Romney. The guy is as fake as a nine bob note. The only thing more nauseating than this claptrap is the reaction of the brain dead morons in the audience. Why does he alway mention that one steel mill in Indiana and never the mill in Kansas where he and Bain asset stripped and left 750 workers without jobs or health coverage? Or even the other Indiana companies that went under with huge job losses while Bain trousered millions?
Even the reaction in the room was poor - mainly down to his pacing more than anything. The speech was badly written, and he fluffed most of the high points IMO, speaking when he should have waited for cheers, resting when he should have carried on. I'm intrigued to see how the debates shape up, but I get the impression that Romney might get taken to school. I was out to dinner tonight and missed Clunt Eastwood. Apparently he was enbarrassingly poor, I look forward to the repeat tomorrow.
Edited to say: Just saw Clunt. Very sad. Loved his acting and directing career. A shame to see him reduced to this stumbling, incoherent, frankly bonkers, embarrassing husk of what he was. Romney's are cringing and trying to distance themselves as, unfortunately, thay have to.
Edited by unrepentant on Friday 31st August 05:24
toppstuff said:
Trommel said:
I'm not sure they're in the fringes.
Fair point. A black, 57 year old academic woman who never married and has no children. I can see the focus groups not liking that. 
We all know what democrats think of Romney but what about his own people, republicans? Here's a few opinions from his GOP colleagues and supporters.
Newt Gingrich said:
“Most Republicans, probably 70% of them, know that they want someone other than Romney”.
Louie Gomert said:
“If you’re not sure about whether to support Mitt Romney, whether you’re liberal, or whether you’re very conservative, you ought to be excited, because he’s been on your side at one time or another.
John Mccain said:
"The truth is, Mitt Romney was a liberal governor of Massachusetts who raised taxes, imposed with Ted Kennedy a big government mandate health care plan that is now a quarter of a billion dollars in the red, and managed his state's economy incompetently, leaving Massachusetts with less job growth than 46 other states."…………"this is a wholesale deception of voters. On every one of the issues he has attacked us on, Mitt Romney was for it before he was against it."
Mick Huckabee said:
“He spent more time on the road to Damascus than a Syrian camel driver. And we thought nobody could fill John Kerry’s flip-flops! … [Romney's record was] “anything but conservative until he changed all the light bulbs in his chandelier in time to run for President.”
Bill Kristol said:
“He should release the tax returns tomorrow. It’s crazy. You’ve got to release six, eight, ten years back tax returns. Take the hit for a day or two. He has to give a big speech in defense of capitalism, and that will elevate, I think, this race above this tactical back and forth, which I do think he’s on the margin of losing.”
Dave Stockman OMB director for Ronald Reagan said:
“I don’t think that Mitt Romney can legitimately say that he learned anything about how to create jobs in the LBO (leveraged buyout) business. The LBO business is about how to strip cash out of old, long-in-the-tooth companies and how to make short-term profits. All the jobs that he talks about came from Staples. That was a very early venture stage deal. That, you know they got out of long before it got to its current size.”
Newt Gingrich said:
- “Here’s a guy who owns Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae stock,” “He owns a Goldman Sachs subsidiary, which is foreclosing on Floridians. And on that front he decides to lie about my career? There’s something about the hypocrisy that should make every American angry.”
Rick Perry said:
“It is important for Mitt to release his tax returns. The fact is we can’t fire our nominee in September.”
Rick Santorum said:
“We don’t need someone who had convenient conversion experiences on a whole host of issues.”
John Huntsman said:
- ‘’he is a perfectly lubricated weathervane."
Rudy Giuliani said:
“He changed his position on virtually everything. I’m a moderate Republican, that’s what I am, so I’d be inclined to support someone like Mitt Romney. But all those changes give me pause.”
Robert Bentley said:
If you have things to hide, then maybe you’re doing things wrong. I think you ought to be willing to release everything to the American people.“
Rick Santorum said:
- “Pick any other Republican in the country. He is the worst Republican in the country to put up against Barack Obama.”
Bryan Fischer American Family Association said:
“If Mitt Romney can be pushed around, intimidated, coerced, co-opted by a conservative radio talk show host in Middle America, then how is he going to stand up to the Chinese? How is he going to stand up to Putin? How is he going to stand up to North Korea if he can be pushed around by a yokel like me? I don’t think Romney is realizing the doubts that this begins to raise about his leadership.”
Rick Perry said:
“Now I have no doubt that Mitt Romney was worried about pink slips — whether he was going to have enough of them to hand out because his company Bain Capital with all the jobs that they killed, I’m sure he was worried that he’d run out of pink slips. There is something inherently wrong when getting rich off failure and sticking it to someone else is how you do your business and I happen to think that’s indefensible. If you’re a victim of Bain Capital’s downsizing, it’s the ultimate insult for Mitt Romney to come to South Carolina and tell you he feels your pain, because he caused it.”
Mike Huckabee said:
“I believe most Americans want their next President to remind them of the guy they work with, not the guy who laid them off.”
Rick Santorum said:
“He heroically bailed out the Salt Lake City Olympic games by heroically going to Congress and asking them for tens of millions of dollars to bail out the Salt Lake Olympic games, in an earmark. Does the word hypocrisy come to mind?”
Jon Huntsman said:
“The reality is Mitt Romney’s record on job creation was abysmal by every standard.”
Marco Rubio said:
“There are a lot of other people out there that some of us wish had run for President, but they didn’t.
Sheldon Aldeson said:
“He’s not a bold decision maker like Newt Gingrich is. Every time I talk to him, he says ‘well let me think about it.”
Rep Tom Davis said:
“He may not be Mr. Personality, uh, you know, this is a guy who gives a fireside chat and the fire goes out.”
Rick Perry said:
"I happen to think that companies like Bain Capital could have come in and helped these companies if they truly were venture capitalists, but they're not — they're vulture capitalists,"
Rick Santorum said:
“If the campaign is about issues, we win. If it’s about Mitt Romney’s record as a businessman, then we don’t win. If it’s about Mitt Romney’s tax returns, then we don’t win. If it’s about whether people like Mitt Romney more than Barack Obama, then we don’t win.
Gov Susana Martinez said:
“Self-deport? What the heck does that mean? I have no doubt Hispanics have been alienated during this campaign. But now there’s an opportunity for Gov. Romney to have a sincere conversation about what we can do and why. I absolutely advocate for comprehensive immigration reform. Republicans want to be tough and say, ‘Illegals, you’re gone.’ But the answer is a lot more complex than that.”
Rand Paul said:
“I do not yet know if I will find a Romney presidency more acceptable on foreign policy. But I do know that I must oppose the most recent statements made by Mitt Romney in which he says he, as president, could take us to war unilaterally with Iran, without any approval from Congress.”
George Will said:
“Romney, supposedly the Republican most electable next November, is a recidivist reviser of his principles who is not only becoming less electable; he might damage GOP chances of capturing the Senate… Republicans may have found their Michael Dukakis…”
Jeb Bush said:
“Don’t just talk about Hispanics and say immediately we must have controlled borders. It’s kind of insulting when you think about it. Change the tone would be the first thing. Second, on immigration, I think we need to have a broader approach.”
Newt Gingich said:
“Those of us who believe in free markets and those of us who believe that in fact the whole goal of investment is entrepreneurship and job creation, we find it pretty hard to justify rich people figuring out clever legal ways to loot a company, leaving behind 1,700 families without a job.”
Alan Keyes said:
He’s a crypto socialist.
davepoth said:
CommanderJameson said:
unrepentant said:
Alan Keyes said:
He’s a crypto socialist.
Louie Gomert said:
“If you’re not sure about whether to support Mitt Romney, whether you’re liberal, or whether you’re very conservative, you ought to be excited, because he’s been on your side at one time or another.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/09/01/mitt-romn...
He's in touch with the ordinary man is Mitt.
Doesn't say much for Jindal either.
He's in touch with the ordinary man is Mitt.
Doesn't say much for Jindal either.
Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff