Cuts when hasn't there been cuts
Discussion
fridaypassion said:
Hmm. Another way of viewing that would be that the local council funds one day a week when isolated pensioners get chance to go to a community center and get fed and socialise with people. Possibly the only time in the week they see anyone else.
But hey if these pensioners aren't wealthy enough to get a taxi to the local golf club screw em eh?
Another way of looking at it is that it's not the state's job to entertain people!But hey if these pensioners aren't wealthy enough to get a taxi to the local golf club screw em eh?
Murph7355 said:
We've been trying to spend ourselves out of a hole for 15yrs. If we keep doing that our debt will become unserviceable.
Unless we think we are in the middle of a global Mexican stand off, where our slate will just get wiped clean eventually, we need to MTFU and make real, hard cuts. Unfortunately these will hit the "needy" hardest. But if we think the needy will be helped more by going bankrupt, we are collectively insane.
Hard cuts are resulting in an increase in spending though? Everyone that was in the economy is now on the dole. The only real crisis we have in the economy is a crisis in confidence. If they was stability instead of indecision and uncertainty that will provide growth. Not just continual cuts.Unless we think we are in the middle of a global Mexican stand off, where our slate will just get wiped clean eventually, we need to MTFU and make real, hard cuts. Unfortunately these will hit the "needy" hardest. But if we think the needy will be helped more by going bankrupt, we are collectively insane.
fridaypassion said:
Hard cuts are resulting in an increase in spending though?
No - real cuts reduce spending. The private sector is growing to offset public sector employment reductions, but spending is still growing because of increases in benefits, NHS spending and overseas aid.fridaypassion said:
Everyone that was in the economy is now on the dole.
No - employment is growing.fridaypassion said:
The only real crisis we have in the economy is a crisis in confidence.
No - we are spending more than we earn, and need to balance the books. Balancing the books will increase confidence.fridaypassion said:
If they was stability instead of indecision and uncertainty that will provide growth.
Increased stability would help growth, yes.fridaypassion said:
Not just continual cuts.
Cuts are needed. We cannot avoid them. We cannot stick our fingers in our ears and pretend we can continue as we are. loafer123 said:
fridaypassion said:
Hard cuts are resulting in an increase in spending though?
No - real cuts reduce spending. The private sector is growing to offset public sector employment reductions, but spending is still growing because of increases in benefits, NHS spending and overseas aid.Spending is increasing because sacking Nurses and police officers and putting them on the dole still costs money. Private sector expanding? Really?
fridaypassion said:
Everyone that was in the economy is now on the dole.
No - employment is growing.Employment is "kind of" growing. We have an army of people working part time and not doing the hours they really need as well as people working short weeks etc. Its a credit to the flexibility of the workforce not the Government.
fridaypassion said:
The only real crisis we have in the economy is a crisis in confidence.
No - we are spending more than we earn, and need to balance the books. Balancing the books will increase confidence.Actually wrong if you are talking about personal finance. These days people are net paying off debts/saving against taking on new debt so the public are leading the way there.
fridaypassion said:
If they was stability instead of indecision and uncertainty that will provide growth.
Increased stability would help growth, yes.fridaypassion said:
Not just continual cuts.
Cuts are needed. We cannot avoid them. We cannot stick our fingers in our ears and pretend we can continue as we are. What it really comes down to is how s
t we want peoples lives to be. Theres a lot of talk of there been no difference between the main parties but from what I see now the distance is as wide as it was in 1997.Whats the suggestion when we continue with the cuts and there is still more and more debt? We still have a debt mountain, plus everyones lives are crap. What will that have achieved exactly? More profits for banks?
There is virtually no difference between what the Coalition is doing and what Labour has said it would do.
The simple fact is that everyone will have to follow the same path, it is just how they sell it to the population and the markets.
The only real difference is that Labour say they would get lots of revenue from a saving, or a tax increase or whatever it is this week and then tell you eight different ways in which they'll spend it to "promote growth". Opposition is always easier because you don't have to make the books balance in real life.
Regrettably, I suspect Labour will find out soon enough how tough it is to govern in this environment.
Fact of the matter is we as a sovrign country have a maximum credit limit.
Ideally as per Kensyian you would be spending during downturns which stimulates growth and then cut back during the boo
Times. Sadly the last govt chose to spend more during te boom times which has caused us significant issues as we now have a much smaller amount of £ to go before we hit our sovrign credit limit. So big spending isn't really an option - plus if this increase spending is purely giving cash to individuals and not investments in infrastructure for the future growth that makes no benefit to te country at all
Cuts so far are pitiful frankly should be much harder.
Honestly can anyone say things are austerity... Nope
Ideally as per Kensyian you would be spending during downturns which stimulates growth and then cut back during the boo
Times. Sadly the last govt chose to spend more during te boom times which has caused us significant issues as we now have a much smaller amount of £ to go before we hit our sovrign credit limit. So big spending isn't really an option - plus if this increase spending is purely giving cash to individuals and not investments in infrastructure for the future growth that makes no benefit to te country at all
Cuts so far are pitiful frankly should be much harder.
Honestly can anyone say things are austerity... Nope
JDRoest said:
thinfourth2 said:
I know you guys love having a moan about the Labour party
But this isn't a thread about the labour party
Its about the constant whining we hear in the press about there isn't enough money being spent and the constant moaning about cuts.
There is plenty of threads where you can moan about the labour party and fantasise about a tory government but this is meant to be about the press
I left the UK shortly after I heard some OAPs in the north complaining that their social days at a social centre would end because of the "Tory cuts". Like....they couldn't use one of their Mobility cars to round a few OAPs up and spend a few mornings together in their own homes of course....?? No, entertainment has to be supplied by the taxpayer.But this isn't a thread about the labour party
Its about the constant whining we hear in the press about there isn't enough money being spent and the constant moaning about cuts.
There is plenty of threads where you can moan about the labour party and fantasise about a tory government but this is meant to be about the press
I thought a lack of empathy was what usually identified thick people. Now I'm not sure as I had you down for being smarter than that.
Would Scottish independence be the answer?
As I understand it, the number of public sector employees per head of population is far higher in Scotland than in RUK, so if they get their independence, couldn't we just re-task some of the RUK public sector workers into anything critical that was being done in Scotland?
By doing this, we reduce the total burden of the public sector on RUK without actually putting anyone on the dole?
Obviously Scotland might struggle to deal with this, but fk 'em; why should we care if a foreign country has too burdensome a public sector to cope with?
As I understand it, the number of public sector employees per head of population is far higher in Scotland than in RUK, so if they get their independence, couldn't we just re-task some of the RUK public sector workers into anything critical that was being done in Scotland?
By doing this, we reduce the total burden of the public sector on RUK without actually putting anyone on the dole?
Obviously Scotland might struggle to deal with this, but f
k 'em; why should we care if a foreign country has too burdensome a public sector to cope with?Lol Scottish ref...
If the Scots left then we would be a Tory country
To get us out of the doldrums what we need is the solution to clean coal power generation once that is solved (pretty sure it already is) reopen all the coal mines in South Wales and northern England - which turn out to be the areas of high unemployment. We instantly have our self sufficiency of energy for centuries we solve unemployment in deprived areas we can lower energy costs for those in the UK, in addition benefits will be lowered through more employment and overall higher tax revenues.
A simple and quick solution - we can then begin the process of building nuclear powe stations which will take a number of decades to build (again construction employment).
Finally only allow British companies which will do the work in the UK for all Govt spending (military, navy etc )
If the Scots left then we would be a Tory country
To get us out of the doldrums what we need is the solution to clean coal power generation once that is solved (pretty sure it already is) reopen all the coal mines in South Wales and northern England - which turn out to be the areas of high unemployment. We instantly have our self sufficiency of energy for centuries we solve unemployment in deprived areas we can lower energy costs for those in the UK, in addition benefits will be lowered through more employment and overall higher tax revenues.
A simple and quick solution - we can then begin the process of building nuclear powe stations which will take a number of decades to build (again construction employment).
Finally only allow British companies which will do the work in the UK for all Govt spending (military, navy etc )
thinfourth2 said:
So i started the thread about the media constantly moaning about a lack of government spending and it is now because of Scotland
How was I supposed to know that? I only came in to the thread for the first time this morning, by which point you'd clearly thrown your toys out of your pram and changed your OP, so I haven't got a clue what you started the thread about.Gaz. said:
Kermit power said:
How was I supposed to know that? I only came in to the thread for the first time this morning, by which point you'd clearly thrown your toys out of your pram and changed your OP, so I haven't got a clue what you started the thread about.
Before he childishly changed his OP he actually made an interesting point: said:
All i hear in the main stream media is some person moaning about cuts
Now something has struck me
When hasn't there been some windbag moaning about cuts or lack of government money.
I remember when blair got in the first thing he did was cuts which included binning the royal yacht
So has there ever been a time when the media hasn't had a time when some wker hasn't been moaning about lack of government spending?
Now something has struck me
When hasn't there been some windbag moaning about cuts or lack of government money.
I remember when blair got in the first thing he did was cuts which included binning the royal yacht
So has there ever been a time when the media hasn't had a time when some w
ker hasn't been moaning about lack of government spending?Gaz. said:
Kermit power said:
How was I supposed to know that? I only came in to the thread for the first time this morning, by which point you'd clearly thrown your toys out of your pram and changed your OP, so I haven't got a clue what you started the thread about.
Before he childishly changed his OP he actually made an interesting point: said:
All i hear in the main stream media is some person moaning about cuts
Now something has struck me
When hasn't there been some windbag moaning about cuts or lack of government money.
I remember when blair got in the first thing he did was cuts which included binning the royal yacht
So has there ever been a time when the media hasn't had a time when some wker hasn't been moaning about lack of government spending?
Now something has struck me
When hasn't there been some windbag moaning about cuts or lack of government money.
I remember when blair got in the first thing he did was cuts which included binning the royal yacht
So has there ever been a time when the media hasn't had a time when some w
ker hasn't been moaning about lack of government spending?Kermit power said:
Indeed it is an interesting point. The typical Daily Wail view would be that this demonstrates the BBC's typical left-wing bias. Personally, I think it's more down to the fact that the unions pay PR people plenty of cash to help them keep feathering their own nests, and these PR people do a good job for their money.
Also the Daily Wail likes to keep screaming it is the end of the NHS as we know itfridaypassion said:
Means testing winter fuel allowance.
Please no.Means testing creates the poverty trap, reduces any incentive to save (or to take any kind of responsibility) and dramatically increases paperwork (nearly all the bureaucracy of the benefit system is entirely to feed the means assessments).
There are lots of ways to limit payouts that are arguably as fair, or more fair, than means testing.
thinfourth2 said:
Also the Daily Wail likes to keep screaming it is the end of the NHS as we know it
The hard facts are to make the necessary cuts required shaving a couple of billion off MOD just will not do it as such the only pot worth investigating is Wealfare budget. It's huge circa 7 times the MOD spend twice the NHS and 4 ish times the Education budget. It's also 7 times the interest on our debt budget 
. It would be good to see what the budgets of each dept was back in 1996 and see where we are getting real value for money. Currently there are no real cuts at all simply throttling back on how muh they are increasing. The press is doing a great job in making general populous think its real cuts
Welshbeef said:
thinfourth2 said:
Also the Daily Wail likes to keep screaming it is the end of the NHS as we know it
The hard facts are to make the necessary cuts required shaving a couple of billion off MOD just will not do it as such the only pot worth investigating is Wealfare budget. It's huge circa 7 times the MOD spend twice the NHS and 4 ish times the Education budget. It's also 7 times the interest on our debt budget . It would be good to see what the budgets of each dept was back in 1996 and see where we are getting real value for money. Currently there are no real cuts at all simply throttling back on how muh they are increasing. The press is doing a great job in making general populous think its real cuts
When has there ever been a time when the press haven't said this is the end of the NHS as we know it
The sole thing (through luck or his desire to be remembered ) was to not adopt the Euro during Blairs PM ship while he wanted the glory during his luckily it wasn't ever the right time.
Other good things?
Millennium dome it works luckily
Olympics 2012 being there for the Bid process
Um not sure what else.
Bad things...
Long list very long
Other good things?
Millennium dome it works luckily
Olympics 2012 being there for the Bid process
Um not sure what else.
Bad things...
Long list very long
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