Spare room changes: 'I won't go quietly'

Spare room changes: 'I won't go quietly'

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User33678888

Original Poster:

1,142 posts

138 months

Wednesday 27th March 2013
quotequote all
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-219490...

Why on earth are my taxes subsidising this bints lifestyle?

TheHeretic

73,668 posts

256 months

Wednesday 27th March 2013
quotequote all
User33678888 said:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-219490...

Why on earth are my taxes subsidising this bints lifestyle?
It all seems like common sense stuff.

jjones

4,427 posts

194 months

Wednesday 27th March 2013
quotequote all
if you can't provide adequately for your planned family keep your cock in your pants.

and the woman should downsize, cut cloth accordingly.

Edited by jjones on Wednesday 27th March 15:05

Mr_B

10,480 posts

244 months

Wednesday 27th March 2013
quotequote all
One still having kids despite the his inability to house them as he thinks they should be and wanting someone else to pay for it. The other who thinks her 3 bed house should still be payed for by someone else. Both idiots who want something for nothing. probably the same people who don't want any cuts, want a free house and lots of benefits, moan about their tax, if they are paying any.

Happy82

15,077 posts

170 months

Wednesday 27th March 2013
quotequote all
A shame it is not possible to sterilise them in return for benefits, the benefits burden in the future is going to be astronomical with the way that the underclass are breeding frown

blugnu

1,523 posts

242 months

Wednesday 27th March 2013
quotequote all
My grandmother lived in a council house until she died. After the war she lived with my grandad, my dad and my aunt in a small flat while the government built a large council housing estate over the (then also new) road.

It was a three bedroom house. One for my grandparents, one for my dad, and one for my aunt. They raised their family there, and it was their home.

Obviously the kids grew up and moved out, so it was just my grandparents and two spare rooms. One was done as a 'kids' room for when the grandchildren came to stay, and one was an 'adult' room for when my grandparent's siblings came to stay, as they lived quite a long way away.

And so it came to pass that my grandad died and so, the house that was once home to a family of 4 was now home to one person, my nana, who lived there alone for over 20 years. It was still her home - the home she'd brought her kids up in, the home she had shared with her husband. The home she had cleaned and polished to within an inch of it's life for 50 years.

I find it absolutely appalling that this government would be telling my nana that she would have to choose between being unable to afford heating, or moving out of her home of 50 years.

ofcorsa

3,527 posts

244 months

Wednesday 27th March 2013
quotequote all
If they want the extra space they should be prepared to pay a premium for it. If you want to get sentimental about bricks and mortar, pay for them yourself.

TheHeretic

73,668 posts

256 months

Wednesday 27th March 2013
quotequote all
blugnu said:
My grandmother lived in a council house until she died. After the war she lived with my grandad, my dad and my aunt in a small flat while the government built a large council housing estate over the (then also new) road.

It was a three bedroom house. One for my grandparents, one for my dad, and one for my aunt. They raised their family there, and it was their home.

Obviously the kids grew up and moved out, so it was just my grandparents and two spare rooms. One was done as a 'kids' room for when the grandchildren came to stay, and one was an 'adult' room for when my grandparent's siblings came to stay, as they lived quite a long way away.

And so it came to pass that my grandad died and so, the house that was once home to a family of 4 was now home to one person, my nana, who lived there alone for over 20 years. It was still her home - the home she'd brought her kids up in, the home she had shared with her husband. The home she had cleaned and polished to within an inch of it's life for 50 years.

I find it absolutely appalling that this government would be telling my nana that she would have to choose between being unable to afford heating, or moving out of her home of 50 years.
Was it her house, or was it a council house?

ceebmoj

1,898 posts

262 months

Wednesday 27th March 2013
quotequote all
ofcorsa said:
If they want the extra space they should be prepared to pay a premium for it. If you want to get sentimental about bricks and mortar, pay for them yourself.
I was trying to think of a way of saying just this.



blugnu

1,523 posts

242 months

Wednesday 27th March 2013
quotequote all
TheHeretic said:
blugnu said:
My grandmother lived in a council house until she died. After the war she lived with my grandad, my dad and my aunt in a small flat while the government built a large council housing estate over the (then also new) road.

It was a three bedroom house. One for my grandparents, one for my dad, and one for my aunt. They raised their family there, and it was their home.

Obviously the kids grew up and moved out, so it was just my grandparents and two spare rooms. One was done as a 'kids' room for when the grandchildren came to stay, and one was an 'adult' room for when my grandparent's siblings came to stay, as they lived quite a long way away.

And so it came to pass that my grandad died and so, the house that was once home to a family of 4 was now home to one person, my nana, who lived there alone for over 20 years. It was still her home - the home she'd brought her kids up in, the home she had shared with her husband. The home she had cleaned and polished to within an inch of it's life for 50 years.

I find it absolutely appalling that this government would be telling my nana that she would have to choose between being unable to afford heating, or moving out of her home of 50 years.
Was it her house, or was it a council house?
It was her home. The house was owned by the council - she refused to buy it (although obviously she had the right to) as she was happy to rent it so that someone else could use it after she died. Judging by the changes made to the house since she died I think it may have been bought now.

This is the real issue - we had a housing stock and we sold it. I used to live in an ex-council house with four bedrooms with just my wife. We did quite well out of it, but probably not as well as the people who bought it off the council. Councils are left with the undesirable properties and all the decent family homes have been sold.

The house I once owned is now rented out. I wouldn't be at all surprised if it is to someone on benefits. So instead of the council owning the house and receiving rent, a private landlord makes money out of it - the benefits paid have to fund a profit instead of just providing a home.



Dimbo

1,681 posts

161 months

Wednesday 27th March 2013
quotequote all
blugnu said:
It was her home. The house was owned by the council - she refused to buy it (although obviously she had the right to) as she was happy to rent it so that someone else could use it after she died. Judging by the changes made to the house since she died I think it may have been bought now.

This is the real issue - we had a housing stock and we sold it. I used to live in an ex-council house with four bedrooms with just my wife. We did quite well out of it, but probably not as well as the people who bought it off the council. Councils are left with the undesirable properties and all the decent family homes have been sold.

The house I once owned is now rented out. I wouldn't be at all surprised if it is to someone on benefits. So instead of the council owning the house and receiving rent, a private landlord makes money out of it - the benefits paid have to fund a profit instead of just providing a home.
Did she think it would be knocked down after she died if she had bought it?

blinkythefish

972 posts

258 months

Wednesday 27th March 2013
quotequote all
TheHeretic said:
blugnu said:
My grandmother lived in a council house until she died. After the war she lived with my grandad, my dad and my aunt in a small flat while the government built a large council housing estate over the (then also new) road.

It was a three bedroom house. One for my grandparents, one for my dad, and one for my aunt. They raised their family there, and it was their home.

Obviously the kids grew up and moved out, so it was just my grandparents and two spare rooms. One was done as a 'kids' room for when the grandchildren came to stay, and one was an 'adult' room for when my grandparent's siblings came to stay, as they lived quite a long way away.

And so it came to pass that my grandad died and so, the house that was once home to a family of 4 was now home to one person, my nana, who lived there alone for over 20 years. It was still her home - the home she'd brought her kids up in, the home she had shared with her husband. The home she had cleaned and polished to within an inch of it's life for 50 years.

I find it absolutely appalling that this government would be telling my nana that she would have to choose between being unable to afford heating, or moving out of her home of 50 years.
Was it her house, or was it a council house?
Or, more pertinent to the "bedroom tax" debate, did she pay the rent on the place, or was that picked up by the taxpayer?

If they were paying the rent, then the new legislation wouldn't have affected them.

If the taxpayer was paying the rent, why should the taxpayer pay extra to provide others the luxury of an extra room, especially when a lot of taxpayers are not in a position to afford that themselves?

btsidi

246 posts

232 months

Wednesday 27th March 2013
quotequote all
ofcorsa said:
If they want the extra space they should be prepared to pay a premium for it. If you want to get sentimental about bricks and mortar, pay for them yourself.
+1

Why should society subsidise the premium?


oyster

12,609 posts

249 months

Wednesday 27th March 2013
quotequote all
blugnu said:
My grandmother lived in a council house until she died. After the war she lived with my grandad, my dad and my aunt in a small flat while the government built a large council housing estate over the (then also new) road.

It was a three bedroom house. One for my grandparents, one for my dad, and one for my aunt. They raised their family there, and it was their home.

Obviously the kids grew up and moved out, so it was just my grandparents and two spare rooms. One was done as a 'kids' room for when the grandchildren came to stay, and one was an 'adult' room for when my grandparent's siblings came to stay, as they lived quite a long way away.

And so it came to pass that my grandad died and so, the house that was once home to a family of 4 was now home to one person, my nana, who lived there alone for over 20 years. It was still her home - the home she'd brought her kids up in, the home she had shared with her husband. The home she had cleaned and polished to within an inch of it's life for 50 years.

I find it absolutely appalling that this government would be telling my nana that she would have to choose between being unable to afford heating, or moving out of her home of 50 years.
So the family with 2 kids that currently live in a 2 bed flat will go where exactly?

Surely your nan was given a council house in the first place on the basis of need. That need no longer exists and has passed to other people.

oyster

12,609 posts

249 months

Wednesday 27th March 2013
quotequote all
blugnu said:
My grandmother lived in a council house until she died. After the war she lived with my grandad, my dad and my aunt in a small flat while the government built a large council housing estate over the (then also new) road.

It was a three bedroom house. One for my grandparents, one for my dad, and one for my aunt. They raised their family there, and it was their home.

Obviously the kids grew up and moved out, so it was just my grandparents and two spare rooms. One was done as a 'kids' room for when the grandchildren came to stay, and one was an 'adult' room for when my grandparent's siblings came to stay, as they lived quite a long way away.

And so it came to pass that my grandad died and so, the house that was once home to a family of 4 was now home to one person, my nana, who lived there alone for over 20 years. It was still her home - the home she'd brought her kids up in, the home she had shared with her husband. The home she had cleaned and polished to within an inch of it's life for 50 years.

I find it absolutely appalling that this government would be telling my nana that she would have to choose between being unable to afford heating, or moving out of her home of 50 years.
So the family with 2 kids that currently live in a 2 bed flat will go where exactly?

Surely your nan was given a council house in the first place on the basis of need. That need no longer exists and has passed to other people.

blugnu

1,523 posts

242 months

Wednesday 27th March 2013
quotequote all
Dimbo said:
Did she think it would be knocked down after she died if she had bought it?
No. Being as she had lived through the depression in the 30's and been brought up in a stone house with no water, gas or electricity on the side of a hill in Shropshire, in which her father used to keep the animals at night for warmth she was rather taken with the post-war idea of the state using it's resources to redistribute wealth and provide affordable, comfortable modern homes for those that survived the war to live in - and she was intensely proud of hers. She viewed it as hers, as you would having lived there for over 50 years.

So I expect she rather hoped that her home would continue to be used in that manner. Sadly it looks like it has been bought since and so another family home has been lost to the stock that the council has to offer, so the shortages are worse.

It doesn't make sense to me.

Victor McDade

4,395 posts

183 months

Wednesday 27th March 2013
quotequote all
blugnu said:
I find it absolutely appalling that this government would be telling my nana that she would have to choose between being unable to afford heating, or moving out of her home of 50 years.
To be fair, if the state contributes fully or in part to someone's rent via housing benefit then they obviously have quite a large say in things.

If there is a smaller property available they are well within their rights to encourage people who have more bedrooms than they need to move.

Of course if people don't rely on housing benefit and are paying the market rate for rent themselves, even if it's a council house, they are well within their rights to tell anyone who asks them to move to f-off imo.



Edited by Victor McDade on Wednesday 27th March 15:59

Hoofy

76,403 posts

283 months

Wednesday 27th March 2013
quotequote all
First World problems?

Bluebarge

4,519 posts

179 months

Wednesday 27th March 2013
quotequote all
blugnu, I'm not having a go, but the whole point of council housing is to provide housing for those who cannot afford to pay a market rent. It's a subsidy funded by taxpayers. Like any other benefit, it has to be allocated to those most in need. There is a chronic shortage of housing and no shortage of people looking for a subsidised house. For every old lady rattling around in a massive house she can't afford to heat, there is a family with young kids living in a B&B or being put up in private accomodation at vast expense. That is nuts. It would make far more sense for the little old lady to move to smaller or sheltered accomodation and the family to move into the family accomodation. Whilst the old lady may be a bit sad about that, you've no god-given right to stay in the same house if you haven't paid for it. Because we are in a financial crisis and have a nice demographic crisis coming up, with an ageing population being supported by a smaller tax-base, these sorts of compromises have to be made.

The expectation that the Council will buy you a nice house which you have the right to stay in till the end of your days, belongs to 1960s socialism. The world has had to move on. Sorry.

blugnu

1,523 posts

242 months

Wednesday 27th March 2013
quotequote all
Bluebarge said:
blugnu, I'm not having a go, but the whole point of council housing is to provide housing for those who cannot afford to pay a market rent. It's a subsidy funded by taxpayers. Like any other benefit, it has to be allocated to those most in need. There is a chronic shortage of housing and no shortage of people looking for a subsidised house. For every old lady rattling around in a massive house she can't afford to heat, there is a family with young kids living in a B&B or being put up in private accomodation at vast expense. That is nuts. It would make far more sense for the little old lady to move to smaller or sheltered accomodation and the family to move into the family accomodation. Whilst the old lady may be a bit sad about that, you've no god-given right to stay in the same house if you haven't paid for it. Because we are in a financial crisis and have a nice demographic crisis coming up, with an ageing population being supported by a smaller tax-base, these sorts of compromises have to be made.

The expectation that the Council will buy you a nice house which you have the right to stay in till the end of your days, belongs to 1960s socialism. The world has had to move on. Sorry.
So why did we sell all the houses?

The council didn't "buy her a house" She rented the house off them. I have no idea what benefits she got - she worked all her life but I don't think she had a private pension, although I think she still got something from my grandad's pension, but not much.

We should never have sold the houses off. All it did was create a shortage of affordable homes whilst making some people rich, creating a huge bubble in the economy which has since burst. I'd rather the state still had affordable homes to offer people, personally.