Give us a fracking break!

[BlackLabel]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-york-north-y...

[motco]

hidetheelephants said:

The loonies are taking over the asylum. Last one out of UKplc please turn the lights off, consider the polar bears.

Lights? What lights?

[voyds9]

Evanivitch said:

Agreed. But so many "greens" are convinced that battery storage will be sufficient to replace gas in the renewables mix that they are willing to keep importing gas for the short term.

That's nice but where are the batteries coming from

Do they not have activists trying to stop us pulling these elements out the ground

[Du1point8]

voyds9 said:

Evanivitch said:

Agreed. But so many "greens" are convinced that battery storage will be sufficient to replace gas in the renewables mix that they are willing to keep importing gas for the short term.

That's nice but where are the batteries coming from

Do they not have activists trying to stop us pulling these elements out the ground

EV is good according to the loonies, except the fact the energy is created using biofuel (palm oil) and batteries are hideously toxic to make, in the end they create more pollution and climate change then keeping with ICE.

[AstonZagato]

Du1point8 said:

EV is good according to the loonies, except the fact the energy is created using biofuel (palm oil) and batteries are hideously toxic to make, in the end they create more pollution and climate change then keeping with ICE.

Source?
I don't think EVs are the only or complete answer. They cause some different and unpleasant pollution problems. But from the studies I've seen, the lifetime emissions are far lower than ICE cars. The studies that suggest they aren't better seem to try to take the worst possible assumptions for how the power EVs consume is generated and ignore carbon costs for the production of petrol. On balance, EVs are probably a bit better albeit with some different areas of pollution.

[andy_s]

AstonZagato said:

Du1point8 said:

EV is good according to the loonies, except the fact the energy is created using biofuel (palm oil) and batteries are hideously toxic to make, in the end they create more pollution and climate change then keeping with ICE.

Source?
I don't think EVs are the only or complete answer. They cause some different and unpleasant pollution problems. But from the studies I've seen, the lifetime emissions are far lower than ICE cars. The studies that suggest they aren't better seem to try to take the worst possible assumptions for how the power EVs consume is generated and ignore carbon costs for the production of petrol. On balance, EVs are probably a bit better albeit with some different areas of pollution.

That's my take on it, of course it may be with mass EV use and the installation of associated infrastructure we do end up causing a deal of damage that is only balanced out way further in the future than we may at first think.

[Evanivitch]

Du1point8 said:

voyds9 said:

Evanivitch said:

Agreed. But so many "greens" are convinced that battery storage will be sufficient to replace gas in the renewables mix that they are willing to keep importing gas for the short term.

That's nice but where are the batteries coming from

Do they not have activists trying to stop us pulling these elements out the ground

EV is good according to the loonies, except the fact the energy is created using biofuel (palm oil) and batteries are hideously toxic to make, in the end they create more pollution and climate change then keeping with ICE.

Let's be clear, I have nothing against batteries in general. But I'm also pragmatic enough to know that we would need 100s of GWh storage and huge over-generation to account for loss in production from renewables.

Batteries do not create more pollution than using an ICE. They're not created using palm oil. They do use lithium (which is not rare) and cobalt (which is mostly from a conflict region) but they are not tied to those materials for eternity.

Car manufacturing will always be resource intensive.