Reverend Paul Flowers - Ex Co-Op Bank boss busted.
Discussion
tubbystu said:
carinaman said:
Dennis Mac Shane tweeted that history shows that there's always been a change of government after the Olympics? The chances of that happening next time could be reduced due to the relationship between the Co-op and the Labour party.
Or it helps the Tories abandon the Lib/Dems and win a working majority. Of course Mr MacShane is also in trouble, again.
BBC website yesterday said:
Ex-Labour minister and MP Denis MacShane pleads guilty to false accounting over claims for £12900 of parliamentary expenses.
crankedup said:
This latest scandal (Co-op) is way above politics, any politician seeking points on this issue will, IMO, be cut off from the knees.
The appointment was made on internal 'political' reasons only known by the co-op.The FSA failed to exclude this cretin (why?)
But its all 'politics' which lead to this chump being left in charge of something he had no clue of running.
There is something to be learned from this.
crankedup said:
This latest scandal (Co-op) is way above politics, any politician seeking points on this issue will, IMO, be cut off from the knees.
Oh no it isn't. And I note you never cut the Sir Freds of this world such slack. It was an entirely political appointment. He got the job due to his overt socialism and Labour links. He was a right on Rev, but it turned out he was big time pig time...
Andy Zarse said:
crankedup said:
This latest scandal (Co-op) is way above politics, any politician seeking points on this issue will, IMO, be cut off from the knees.
Oh no it isn't. And I note you never cut the Sir Freds of this world such slack. It was an entirely political appointment. He got the job due to his overt socialism and Labour links. He was a right on Rev, but it turned out he was big time pig time...
Fred the evil shred, now that has been an entirely different matter, unless the Co-op have asked for tax payers for a bailout - no they haven't.
crankedup said:
The Co-operative has its roots in Labour of course, and thats a good thing IMO. I mention politics as in National politics, politicians scoring points based exactly as you mention 'overt Socialism' and all the rest of it. My real concern is just what were the Regularity Authority doing giving the green light for this appointment. Cutting slack you say - as in where have I done this exactly?
Fred the evil shred, now that has been an entirely different matter, unless the Co-op have asked for tax payers for a bailout - no they haven't.
Oh they will have asked for a bail out. Except this time the answer was no...Fred the evil shred, now that has been an entirely different matter, unless the Co-op have asked for tax payers for a bailout - no they haven't.
As to the regulator, it was run by some very clever folk. Staggeringly clever, at least according to themselves. Unlike your comment about having roots in Labour. Surely anything to do with money needs to stay as far away from Labour as is physically possible?
Andy Zarse said:
Did you hear in those secret tapes made last week that Flowers referred to the assiduous Andrew Tyrie MP (Chairman of the Treasury Select Committee) as a "Tory 
"?
Nice choice of words even for a bank chairman, never mind a Methodist minister and trustee of a major charity. How in the name of Jesus H Christ off his tits on ketamine whilst cruising on Grindr did this muppet ever get into such a position of power.
My experience of religious types is that a good few of them use their faith as a justification for their dealings with non-believers - high-handed or underhand."? Nice choice of words even for a bank chairman, never mind a Methodist minister and trustee of a major charity. How in the name of Jesus H Christ off his tits on ketamine whilst cruising on Grindr did this muppet ever get into such a position of power.
Ali G said:
crankedup said:
This latest scandal (Co-op) is way above politics, any politician seeking points on this issue will, IMO, be cut off from the knees.
The appointment was made on internal 'political' reasons only known by the co-op.The FSA failed to exclude this cretin (why?)
But its all 'politics' which lead to this chump being left in charge of something he had no clue of running.
There is something to be learned from this.
For example, I happen to know of one ex-local authority head of pension fund that was a bit out of his depth. And anyone remember that LA that lost a load of cash in an ill-advised Icesave account?
crankedup said:
Yes that is the basis of their business ethics. Massive damage has been inflicted upon the Co-op, another absolutely fine established name is now being dragged through the mud, thanks to gross incompetency of the over-hyped and over-paid idiots.
I told you coop was screwed over two years ago when you were making them out to be the saviours of the retail banking world and pitching them with religious ferver. I told you to stop reading their mantra and look at the truth as to what was going on. Now you can do the same with their main business. Have a look at what is really going on there.
The building society movement, the Co-Op banking movement and the Credit Union movement all have their roots in the 19th Century and all were created to allow ordinary people to have access to reasonable financial services - something that was usually denied to them by the (then) more established financial institutions. Another element was the protection of people of lower means from the criminal activities of illegal loan sharks.
So, they always traditionally had a very strong moral aspect to their set up and to their motivation.
The problem is that in more recent decades, most of these bodies moved away from this ethos and decided they wanted to play in the same pond as "the big boys". This has led to the virtual wiping out of the building society (with the odd exception), the destruction of the Co Op bank and the struggling of some Credit Unions.
So, they always traditionally had a very strong moral aspect to their set up and to their motivation.
The problem is that in more recent decades, most of these bodies moved away from this ethos and decided they wanted to play in the same pond as "the big boys". This has led to the virtual wiping out of the building society (with the odd exception), the destruction of the Co Op bank and the struggling of some Credit Unions.
crankedup said:
....... my judgement has been wrong.......
And so, cranky (hello mate by the way) we see what happens when political interference in Banks is allowed to happen, and when "the people" with no experience of banking are put in the driving seat of such organisations instead of experienced people who know what they're doing.You spent ages on here some time ago banging your tambourine for the Co-Op as a shining beacon of all that is good and wholesome in banking. Now you say that their problems are caused by overpaid idiots.
No, their problems have been caused by inexperienced cronies of Millipede and Balls who were appointed for politicial reasons, comrade.
"Why do these fat cats earn so much money" scream the lefties on here, day in day out. "Anyone can run a bank, it's a piece of p155. I could do it"..... (c) crankedup 2010, 2011, 2012, 2013......
Well, this is what happens when you let "the people" sit on a bank board and make decisions about its management and who the boss should be. The Co-Op board who appointed Flowers to run the Co-Coperative Bank included....... and you'll enjoy this......... a plasterer and a horticulturalist
Great decision making there.
Financial Times said:
Midway through the Co-operative Group’s attempted purchase of 630 branches from Lloyds Banking Group last year, the financial regulator started raising alarm over a lack of expertise on the mutual’s banking board.
Rather than the typical make-up of company executives and non-executive directors, the Co-op Bank’s board included a plasterer, a nurse and horticulturalist, as well as the now disgraced Methodist minister and chairman, Reverend Paul Flowers.
The recent scandal that has engulfed the Co-op – first the near collapse of its banking business after the exposure of a £1.5bn capital hole and, in recent days, allegations that Rev Flowers bought illegal drugs – has shone a new light on the governance shortfalls.
The Financial Services Authority, which approved Rev Flowers’s appointment as a non-executive director of the Co-op Bank in 2009 and his promotion to chairman a year later, was never under any illusion that the minister was an experienced banker, according to people close to the former watchdog.
They believed his political experience – he was a local Labour politician and had close links to the Co-op movement – could help bring order to the bank’s large and dysfunctional board, however.
Rather than the typical make-up of company executives and non-executive directors, the Co-op Bank’s board included a plasterer, a nurse and horticulturalist, as well as the now disgraced Methodist minister and chairman, Reverend Paul Flowers.
The recent scandal that has engulfed the Co-op – first the near collapse of its banking business after the exposure of a £1.5bn capital hole and, in recent days, allegations that Rev Flowers bought illegal drugs – has shone a new light on the governance shortfalls.
The Financial Services Authority, which approved Rev Flowers’s appointment as a non-executive director of the Co-op Bank in 2009 and his promotion to chairman a year later, was never under any illusion that the minister was an experienced banker, according to people close to the former watchdog.
They believed his political experience – he was a local Labour politician and had close links to the Co-op movement – could help bring order to the bank’s large and dysfunctional board, however.
So the wholesome Co-Op Bank has a bunch of people on its Board (inclduing a drug taking sec offending crony of Balls and that student tw@t Millipede) with zero experience of running a bank. And surpirse suprise it's ended up with a £1,500,000,000 hole in its accounts.
Genius.
[b]Balls and Millipede, and their millionaire Primrose Hill champagne swigging socialist tw@t friends must be pooing their rompers.
There is a LOT more to come on this one. A lot more.
[/b]
Edited by RSoovy4 on Wednesday 20th November 09:58
Edited by RSoovy4 on Wednesday 20th November 09:59
Andy Zarse said:
crankedup said:
The Co-operative has its roots in Labour of course, and thats a good thing IMO. I mention politics as in National politics, politicians scoring points based exactly as you mention 'overt Socialism' and all the rest of it. My real concern is just what were the Regularity Authority doing giving the green light for this appointment. Cutting slack you say - as in where have I done this exactly?
Fred the evil shred, now that has been an entirely different matter, unless the Co-op have asked for tax payers for a bailout - no they haven't.
Oh they will have asked for a bail out. Except this time the answer was no...Fred the evil shred, now that has been an entirely different matter, unless the Co-op have asked for tax payers for a bailout - no they haven't.
As to the regulator, it was run by some very clever folk. Staggeringly clever, at least according to themselves. Unlike your comment about having roots in Labour. Surely anything to do with money needs to stay as far away from Labour as is physically possible?
crankedup said:
Andy Zarse said:
crankedup said:
The Co-operative has its roots in Labour of course, and thats a good thing IMO. I mention politics as in National politics, politicians scoring points based exactly as you mention 'overt Socialism' and all the rest of it. My real concern is just what were the Regularity Authority doing giving the green light for this appointment. Cutting slack you say - as in where have I done this exactly?
Fred the evil shred, now that has been an entirely different matter, unless the Co-op have asked for tax payers for a bailout - no they haven't.
Oh they will have asked for a bail out. Except this time the answer was no...Fred the evil shred, now that has been an entirely different matter, unless the Co-op have asked for tax payers for a bailout - no they haven't.
As to the regulator, it was run by some very clever folk. Staggeringly clever, at least according to themselves. Unlike your comment about having roots in Labour. Surely anything to do with money needs to stay as far away from Labour as is physically possible?
And not one single note about any of the crony Labour links on the BBC website...
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-25012909
Unlike our pals at the Mail, who properly stick the knife in, though I'm bitterly disappointed Soovy failed to link it...
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2510259/Ho...
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-25012909
Unlike our pals at the Mail, who properly stick the knife in, though I'm bitterly disappointed Soovy failed to link it...
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2510259/Ho...
DonkeyApple said:
crankedup said:
Yes that is the basis of their business ethics. Massive damage has been inflicted upon the Co-op, another absolutely fine established name is now being dragged through the mud, thanks to gross incompetency of the over-hyped and over-paid idiots.
I told you coop was screwed over two years ago when you were making them out to be the saviours of the retail banking world and pitching them with religious ferver. I told you to stop reading their mantra and look at the truth as to what was going on. Now you can do the same with their main business. Have a look at what is really going on there.
Yes they appointed an idiot into a powerful position, and for that are paying a heavy price in financial and reputation terms.
They are still a business that I support and look forward to a fresh start on the banking side. As for my making them out to be the saviours of the retail banking world, well you can guess just how disappointed I am I expect. Must have made your year to see the Co-op hit this trouble.
RSoovy4][b said:
Balls and Millipede, and their millionaire Primrose Hill champagne swigging socialist tw@t friends must be pooing their rompers.
There is a LOT more to come on this one. A lot more.
[/b]
As I've said a few posts back, anyone who wants to uncover further evidence of this type of cronyism - whether outright appointment of useful idiots, or simply the appointment of those who can simply be trusted not to rock the boat - the upper echeleons of PS will provide a rich seam to mine.There is a LOT more to come on this one. A lot more.
[/b]
This sort of thing does no one any good and, AFAIK, the sooner it is dragged out into the open and addressed the better.
crankedup said:
No bail out asked for or considered apparently.
They would say that wouldn't they. I simply do not believe it. Are you seriously stating, what with all the Co-op's political contacts, they didn't even consider the possibility of a bail-out ahead of falling into the slimy capitalist tentacles of the hated hedge funds? It defies belief, and even a horticulturalist can see it...TheHedge funds that will control the Coop Bank must be pissing themselves - how long until they renegotiate the deal in their favour?
The Cooperative Group has some decently profitable businesses, despite the rather amateur way that they are run these days.
At least they are undertaking a root and branch review of their corporate structure though, that will save them!
The Cooperative Group has some decently profitable businesses, despite the rather amateur way that they are run these days.
At least they are undertaking a root and branch review of their corporate structure though, that will save them!
Eric Mc said:
The building society movement, the Co-Op banking movement and the Credit Union movement all have their roots in the 19th Century and all were created to allow ordinary people to have access to reasonable financial services - something that was usually denied to them by the (then) more established financial institutions. Another element was the protection of people of lower means from the criminal activities of illegal loan sharks.
So, they always traditionally had a very strong moral aspect to their set up and to their motivation.
The problem is that in more recent decades, most of these bodies moved away from this ethos and decided they wanted to play in the same pond as "the big boys". This has led to the virtual wiping out of the building society (with the odd exception), the destruction of the Co Op bank and the struggling of some Credit Unions.
To be fair, almost all of them were hijacked and carpet bagged by their own members. These new, weak and uncompetitive banks were then snapped up by the Scottish banks trying to gain market share and size on their rivals and obviously then collapsed because of appalling risk management.So, they always traditionally had a very strong moral aspect to their set up and to their motivation.
The problem is that in more recent decades, most of these bodies moved away from this ethos and decided they wanted to play in the same pond as "the big boys". This has led to the virtual wiping out of the building society (with the odd exception), the destruction of the Co Op bank and the struggling of some Credit Unions.
At the same time, the surviving mutuals have faced ever higher running costs and inability to compete against the massive highstreet banks and stripped from the core by the legalising of loan sharking.
So, in short, the mutuals were destroyed by the very people who benefited directly from them but voted for a fast buck and a sell out. And further damaged by the increase in TCF/KYC regulation and the massive decrease in banking license regulation.
crankedup said:
DonkeyApple said:
crankedup said:
Yes that is the basis of their business ethics. Massive damage has been inflicted upon the Co-op, another absolutely fine established name is now being dragged through the mud, thanks to gross incompetency of the over-hyped and over-paid idiots.
I told you coop was screwed over two years ago when you were making them out to be the saviours of the retail banking world and pitching them with religious ferver. I told you to stop reading their mantra and look at the truth as to what was going on. Now you can do the same with their main business. Have a look at what is really going on there.
Yes they appointed an idiot into a powerful position, and for that are paying a heavy price in financial and reputation terms.
They are still a business that I support and look forward to a fresh start on the banking side. As for my making them out to be the saviours of the retail banking world, well you can guess just how disappointed I am I expect. Must have made your year to see the Co-op hit this trouble.
There is no pleasure at all from seeing this farce come to light. It was stated enough times that both mutuals and ethical banks cannot effectively compete and so either have to charge more and lose business or charge the same and take on higher risk. Nothing has changed in that regard.
And they didn't just appoint one idiot, there are a whole block of them in there.
DonkeyApple said:
Yes it is. It will be funding the hole it created in its banking arm.
There is no pleasure at all from seeing this farce come to light. It was stated enough times that both mutuals and ethical banks cannot effectively compete and so either have to charge more and lose business or charge the same and take on higher risk. Nothing has changed in that regard.
And they didn't just appoint one idiot, there are a whole block of them in there.
Do you know how the Society managed to finance all those new corner stores? If you look back over a two year period they must have opened literally hundreds of them. It was a massive expansion of the brand, and from a standing start in many areas, though some came from Somerfield I guess. How are all these new stores performing? Any info gratefully received...There is no pleasure at all from seeing this farce come to light. It was stated enough times that both mutuals and ethical banks cannot effectively compete and so either have to charge more and lose business or charge the same and take on higher risk. Nothing has changed in that regard.
And they didn't just appoint one idiot, there are a whole block of them in there.
Andy Zarse said:
Do you know how the Society managed to finance all those new corner stores? If you look back over a two year period they must have opened literally hundreds of them. It was a massive expansion of the brand, and from a standing start in many areas, though some came from Somerfield I guess. How are all these new stores performing? Any info gratefully received...
Well I had a letter from the Co-op this morning telling me they'd made a loss so I wasn't getting any return on my membership. Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff