War with Russia
Discussion
Bluebarge said:
QuantumTokoloshi said:
The evidence speaks otherwise.
No. It really doesn't. Please stop peddling this tripe.Any UK willy-waving that's happened since the UK became a functioning democracy has been instigated by politicians. If you think that the UK is run by its military perhaps you could explain why our armed forces have shrunk so much.
Really, you are making yourself look foolish.
My point is simple, the military and NATO are looking after themselves, having a big scary Putin bear, forces the politicians to open those tight wallets and spend,spend,spend. The gold braid does not pay for itself you know. The military were not shy to get stuck in to Iraq and Afghanistan, it let them play soldier.
How much did the play session in Afghanistan and Iraq cost the UK? In blood and treasure.
The problem was they were not great at playing soldiers, especially against medieval AK, RPG and IED wielding middle eastern types. No great victory parade, a hurried quick pack of the toy box and scurry off.
What was needed was an enemy who looked big and scary, but is unlikely to actually do anything, Enter Russia. et voila.
Edited by QuantumTokoloshi on Thursday 16th July 20:49
But only 2 nato countries will meet the 2% of GDP target this year and the UK's contribution is expected to fall to 1.88% by next year.
The sabre rattling has been going on for some time now and nato's budget is falling. The conclusion seems to be that Russia is being fooled into spending vast sums they don't have on weapons yet again.
The sabre rattling has been going on for some time now and nato's budget is falling. The conclusion seems to be that Russia is being fooled into spending vast sums they don't have on weapons yet again.
barryrs said:
But only 2 nato countries will meet the 2% of GDP target this year and the UK's contribution is expected to fall to 1.88% by next year.
The sabre rattling has been going on for some time now and nato's budget is falling. The conclusion seems to be that Russia is being fooled into spending vast sums they don't have on weapons yet again.
I can see the logic of that, there may be some method in the madness after all. I find it hard to credit the current crop of Western politicians with the insight to pull that off though.The sabre rattling has been going on for some time now and nato's budget is falling. The conclusion seems to be that Russia is being fooled into spending vast sums they don't have on weapons yet again.
The question is why ?
I suspect it is partly Putin and partly the Western nations, but everybody loses in this case. An unstable Russia is no good to anyone. Is it an attempt at government change in Russia? possibly.
Russia would not be the first recipient of that type of attention. Overtly is not possible, too much to lose in relation to energy for Europe, and a nuclear armed country falling apart is not a great idea. If it is done internally, economic assisted suicide with another fall of the Soviet Union implosion, will allow a grab of those resources and the installation of another Yeltsin character would be the preferred outcome.
Interesting times we are living in.
Edited by QuantumTokoloshi on Thursday 16th July 21:24
QuantumTokoloshi said:
Cobnapint said:
I'm sure NATO would much prefer irrelevant status, rather than having to sit there constantly studying satellite photos, radar screens and intelligence reports.
This isn't about budget size and employment, it's about living a quiet life, without fear of some land grabbing lunatic carrying out military exercises with little green men just over your border.
Let's disagree on this,...This isn't about budget size and employment, it's about living a quiet life, without fear of some land grabbing lunatic carrying out military exercises with little green men just over your border.
http://fortune.com/2015/07/14/oil-prices-slide-as-...
Just read this piece and thought that he could of speculated about such oil production's effects on Russia.
Surely if American oil and gas will suffer, then surely Russian producers will too?
Could such an event force even worse conditions between Russia and the West?
Just read this piece and thought that he could of speculated about such oil production's effects on Russia.
Surely if American oil and gas will suffer, then surely Russian producers will too?
Could such an event force even worse conditions between Russia and the West?
Bluebarge said:
No. It really doesn't. Please stop peddling this tripe.
5 billion. "Yats is our man!" 
State needs you; I think Jen is getting tired. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=frO1T3vZNrA
Edited by scherzkeks on Friday 17th July 13:40
What was needed was an enemy who looked big and scary, but is unlikely to actually do anything, Enter Russia. et voila.
Edited by QuantumTokoloshi on Thursday 16th July 20:49
[/quote]
Unfortunately for those Ukrainians living in the East of their country it has not quite worked out that way.
skyrover said:
That effectively means that Georgia is just Russian military 'exercise' away from being chopped completely in half.One pallet of Russian Army issue barbed wire should be enough, once Putin decides that Russian speakers are being intimidated.
Oh those Russians......
Transmitter Man said:
QuantumTokoloshi said:
What was needed was an enemy who looked big and scary, but is unlikely to actually do anything, Enter Russia. et voila.
Unfortunately for those Ukrainians living in the East of their country it has not quite worked out that way.Proxy wars are ideal, no UK or NATO deaths on TV and someone else does your fighting for you.
The only problems is the generalissimo do not get to play soldier, but on recent form that might be a good thing.
Edited by QuantumTokoloshi on Friday 17th July 08:54
Cobnapint said:
skyrover said:
That effectively means that Georgia is just Russian military 'exercise' away from being chopped completely in half.One pallet of Russian Army issue barbed wire should be enough, once Putin decides that Russian speakers are being intimidated.
Oh those Russians......
When you look at the economic warfare the EU has unleashed on Greece, a fellow EU, Eurozone and NATO member, for daring to want to leave the club. A carpet bombing campaign by Russia looks almost humanitarian in comparison.
If they are prepared to do that to a friend and ally, what are they prepared to do to a perceived enemy ?
Edited by QuantumTokoloshi on Friday 17th July 09:27
QuantumTokoloshi said:
Cobnapint said:
skyrover said:
That effectively means that Georgia is just Russian military 'exercise' away from being chopped completely in half.One pallet of Russian Army issue barbed wire should be enough, once Putin decides that Russian speakers are being intimidated.
Oh those Russians......
When you look at the economic warfare the EU has unleashed on Greece, for daring to want to leave the club, a carpet bombing campaign by Russia looks almost humanitarian.
Edited by QuantumTokoloshi on Friday 17th July 09:22
And you are comparing Russian military aggression, to the banks that are lending the tax-avoiding Greeks billions of Euro's wanting some form of guarantee that they'll get their money back.....
New name for you sunshine...QuantumTwisted
Cobnapint said:
QuantumTokoloshi said:
Cobnapint said:
skyrover said:
That effectively means that Georgia is just Russian military 'exercise' away from being chopped completely in half.One pallet of Russian Army issue barbed wire should be enough, once Putin decides that Russian speakers are being intimidated.
Oh those Russians......
When you look at the economic warfare the EU has unleashed on Greece, for daring to want to leave the club, a carpet bombing campaign by Russia looks almost humanitarian.
Edited by QuantumTokoloshi on Friday 17th July 09:22
And you are comparing Russian military aggression, to the banks that are lending the tax-avoiding Greeks billions of Euro's wanting some form of guarantee that they'll get their money back.....
New name for you sunshine...QuantumTwisted
Kosovo; people yearning for democracy and freedom from an oppressive government.
South Ossetia and Eastern Ukraine; Warmongering secessionist terrorists defying the will of our chosen puppet government.
The door swings both ways.
Edited by QuantumTokoloshi on Friday 17th July 09:57
scherzkeks said:
A good article, providing a alternative narrative to the good guy, bad guy meme we are being indoctrinated with.Another good piece on the propaganda war that fell off the radar earlier.
http://www.thenation.com/article/neo-mccarthyism-a...
http://www.thenation.com/article/neo-mccarthyism-a...
Mojocvh said:
AreOut said:
those Bears are 60 years old on average so that's kinda expected, it's good the crew has ejected safely
eject?No RIP from me.
It's time people forget the glasnost gig, under Putins direction, they have reverted to what they were before, our enemy.
Mojocvh said:
Mojocvh said:
AreOut said:
those Bears are 60 years old on average so that's kinda expected, it's good the crew has ejected safely
eject?No RIP from me.
It's time people forget the glasnost gig, under Putins direction, they have reverted to what they were before, our enemy.
The absolute unwavering belief that Saddam had to be removed because he posed such a threat to the UK. All 45 minutes of it, WMD, his "to" to Al Qaeda and 9/11. +500 000 people, men, woman and children have died, the country is still a chaotic warzone, with a whole new brand of ISIS crazies, their very existence is owed to our invasion.
The extermination of villages in Afghanistan, 1000s of deaths under the "oops, sorry, we bombed in the wrong place" excuse. This got so bad, even our own installed puppet government told the coalition to stop it!
We accepted the killing of innocents are "the cost of war" perpetrated in our name. A war predicated on lies.
Likewise, the "bombing for peace" campaign in Libya, the manufactured threat Gaddafi posed to his own people, the tenuous justification from a previous UN resolution. The deaths of civilians is just "collateral damage", We need kill them to free them it seems.
You might have noticed the refugees in the Mediterranean? The attacks in Tunisia by crazies trained by our previous "allies" in Libya. The destabilisation of Mali and surrounding countries including the rise of Boko Haram in Nigeria.
If you were on the other side of the fence, seeing this over the last 15 years, what would you do?
John Pilger: Fascism and a new holocaust beckon if we remain silent
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