UKIP - The Future - Volume 2
Discussion
Guam said:
longblackcoat said:
Let me get this right.
You're stating that UKIP were going to win this seat, which is why a Foreign Office minister has resigned, based on the results of the Euro elections?
That's a staggering level of delusion.
Firstly its clearly a speculation not a belief, I know you know the difference so I can presume you just saw an opportunity for a handy little insult.You're stating that UKIP were going to win this seat, which is why a Foreign Office minister has resigned, based on the results of the Euro elections?
That's a staggering level of delusion.
I expect better of you, you are usually relatively restrained in your argument (unlike others).
Instead, you said "so I think they took a tactical decision once he recognised that he wouldn't win come 2015". 'I think' being the operative words, in this sense being synonymous with "I believe".
Tell me again where it's clear that your statement was purely speculation.
longblackcoat said:
Right, let's make it £50 , shall we? Loser pays to a charitry of their choice. And if I'm wrong, which clearly I don't think I am, I'll even wear a purple tie for a day as penance.
I'm in, but forget the charity. I give my time to a local charity and that's enough for me 
Guam said:
HonestIago said:
It really isn't. I'd put money on UKIP winning Boston & Skegness in the GE, especially after this.
Indeed, my point was pretty clear I thought, given the high probability he was going to lose and his clear dissatisfaction with continuing as an MP and minister, it became all about how to package it. As we have seen from the articles he hasn't suffered fiscally in any real sense, indeed I would imagine most would be happy to have the state help them make those levels of capital growth?It does seem a trait of this thread that even otherwise reasonable posters instantly descend into firing off little anti UKIP barbs. And then comment about cyber-kippers.
The point is well made that it shows they've known about this and had time to prepare, yet still the reasons can be unravelled and shown to be built on sand in very short order. Even a quick slob around on rightmove one can find lots of places to rent that would be quite acceptable to me on that budget given his desire to have somewhere the kids could stay and not have a ridiculous commute even on public transport. There would still be sufficient from the budget to cover all the bills too.
Yet these people expect the citizens, regardless of origin, who keep the wheels of the city and the country turning to survive on an average wage not so far different from this clown's expenses.
A comment made so often during the recent times. They STILL don't get it. Well perhaps they have no intention of getting it.
HonestIago said:
longblackcoat said:
Right, let's make it £50 , shall we? Loser pays to a charitry of their choice. And if I'm wrong, which clearly I don't think I am, I'll even wear a purple tie for a day as penance.
I'm in, but forget the charity. I give my time to a local charity and that's enough for me Deal?
longblackcoat said:
HonestIago said:
longblackcoat said:
Right, let's make it £50 , shall we? Loser pays to a charitry of their choice. And if I'm wrong, which clearly I don't think I am, I'll even wear a purple tie for a day as penance.
I'm in, but forget the charity. I give my time to a local charity and that's enough for me Deal?
I'll make a note of this thread and page number just now
HonestIago said:
longblackcoat said:
HonestIago said:
longblackcoat said:
Right, let's make it £50 , shall we? Loser pays to a charitry of their choice. And if I'm wrong, which clearly I don't think I am, I'll even wear a purple tie for a day as penance.
I'm in, but forget the charity. I give my time to a local charity and that's enough for me Deal?
I'll make a note of this thread and page number just now
longblackcoat said:
Excellent. Either way a worthy organisation gets £50, and one of us gets to crow at the other for a few hours.
My initial objection to charity was the prospect of paying out to some multinational enterprise paying its directors six figure salaries. I personally know the treasurer of the charity that'll receive either of our's donation and it will be put to good use! Right, back to UKIP-related bickering! Guam said:
Ok so when you are typing on your phone in a car you use extensive prose, seriously you must have some monster SKILLZ dude
I don't type on my phone. And the last time my wife drove me anywhere was a couple of years ago.My assumption is that anything I post has to be clear to even the dumbest rock, so I try to avoid complexity, as it leads to ambiguity. That's not me denigrating the reader, just that these posts are often skim-read, and subtlety and nuance are usually missed. So if I'm speculating, I say that I'm speculating. If it's a strongly-held belief, I'll make sure people understand this.
And anyway, the only thing I try to have monster skillzzzzz at is DH mountain biking. I'm not claiming that I succeed, just that I keep on trying.
EU ENERGY POLICY HELPS PUT 1.5 MILLION UK JOBS AT RISK AND WILL COST THE ECONOMY UP TO £93.2BN
http://businessforbritain.org/2014/08/13/eu-energy...
http://businessforbritain.org/2014/08/13/eu-energy...
Looking at the latest ukip news...
http://www.ukip.org/ukip_were_right_in_romania_and...
What i find sad is the level of abuse they got in January over this...
http://www.ukip.org/ukip_were_right_in_romania_and...
What i find sad is the level of abuse they got in January over this...
Holy cow! Who does their poofleading?
From the UKIP "article" cited above:
"The Government may be bragging today about reducing unemployment by 132,000 jobs. Given that in the same period 178,000 Eastern European migrants have UK unemployment rates significantly by managing inward migration of foreign workers. Of course, this cannot be done while a member of the EU."
Wonder what they were trying to say?
From the UKIP "article" cited above:
"The Government may be bragging today about reducing unemployment by 132,000 jobs. Given that in the same period 178,000 Eastern European migrants have UK unemployment rates significantly by managing inward migration of foreign workers. Of course, this cannot be done while a member of the EU."
Wonder what they were trying to say?
Guam said:
Meanwhile back on track, UKIP donations have exceeded the lib Dems for the first time ever, clearly they are getting serious funding in place now, that has to have an effect on their prospects.
Yeah but no but yeah but no but:-If you look at the size of the various party war chests they are way behind even the LibDems.
Labour got about 6 million of public money last year as they are the official opposition party.
F
TheRealFingers99 said:
Holy cow! Who does their poofleading?
From the UKIP "article" cited above:
"The Government may be bragging today about reducing unemployment by 132,000 jobs. Given that in the same period 178,000 Eastern European migrants have UK unemployment rates significantly by managing inward migration of foreign workers. Of course, this cannot be done while a member of the EU."
Wonder what they were trying to say?
Looks like an entire sentence is missing, From the UKIP "article" cited above:
"The Government may be bragging today about reducing unemployment by 132,000 jobs. Given that in the same period 178,000 Eastern European migrants have UK unemployment rates significantly by managing inward migration of foreign workers. Of course, this cannot be done while a member of the EU."
Wonder what they were trying to say?
Have emailed relevant parties, thanks for the heads up
TheRealFingers99 said:
Holy cow! Who does their poofleading?
From the UKIP "article" cited above:
"The Government may be bragging today about reducing unemployment by 132,000 jobs. Given that in the same period 178,000 Eastern European migrants have UK unemployment rates significantly by managing inward migration of foreign workers. Of course, this cannot be done while a member of the EU."
Wonder what they were trying to say?
They is truying to sey dat they is very educatauted, juist loik intended audince. n immigrants. n bankers. n eu. n msm. n victim card.From the UKIP "article" cited above:
"The Government may be bragging today about reducing unemployment by 132,000 jobs. Given that in the same period 178,000 Eastern European migrants have UK unemployment rates significantly by managing inward migration of foreign workers. Of course, this cannot be done while a member of the EU."
Wonder what they were trying to say?
league67 said:
They is truying to sey dat they is very educatauted, juist loik intended audince. n immigrants. n bankers. n eu. n msm. n victim card.
They did pretty well beating all major parties at the last national elections with minimal resource. UKIP have a tiny fraction of the resource of the main parties - it's a shame you can't review them on their policy.
Well done for your post above!
0a said:
league67 said:
They is truying to sey dat they is very educatauted, juist loik intended audince. n immigrants. n bankers. n eu. n msm. n victim card.
They did pretty well beating all major parties at the last national elections with minimal resource. UKIP have a tiny fraction of the resource of the main parties - it's a shame you can't review them on their policy.
Well done for your post above!
My remarks stand. You have a party which has someone like Helmer pretty high up. Less stupid of kippers were saying that party was distancing from him, I don't see that. I see Helmer as an integral part and 'magnet' for majority (c2-e demo-class) of kippers. Membership and sympathisers are mostly blind, or practically illiterate so it doesn't really matter much what is said.
Take, for an example, article quoted by steve. He did quote article either without reading it, or without understanding it. And yet he's someone who's so invested that he'll contact people. But, for the average kipper (imagine how many of them have 'read' that article and didn't alert 'the people in charge') after saying 'oh we were right, immigrants are coming in huge numbers and will take everyfing', the rest of the article doesn't matter.
I believe that Farage is a very skilled showman. He knows his audience. His 'man down the pub with a pint' episodes are honed to perfection. If you are low paid manual worker, whose life didn't turn out as well as hoped, you need someone who is to blame for your 'misfortune'. Message about bad EU didn't get any traction for years, until Farage stumbled upon immigration, and hey presto, the 'left-behinders' have finally a baddie to take blame for their failures.
Hope that helps!
league67 said:
Thank you!
My remarks stand. You have a party which has someone like Helmer pretty high up. Less stupid of kippers were saying that party was distancing from him, I don't see that. I see Helmer as an integral part and 'magnet' for majority (c2-e demo-class) of kippers. Membership and sympathisers are mostly blind, or practically illiterate so it doesn't really matter much what is said.
Take, for an example, article quoted by steve. He did quote article either without reading it, or without understanding it. And yet he's someone who's so invested that he'll contact people. But, for the average kipper (imagine how many of them have 'read' that article and didn't alert 'the people in charge') after saying 'oh we were right, immigrants are coming in huge numbers and will take everyfing', the rest of the article doesn't matter.
I believe that Farage is a very skilled showman. He knows his audience. His 'man down the pub with a pint' episodes are honed to perfection. If you are low paid manual worker, whose life didn't turn out as well as hoped, you need someone who is to blame for your 'misfortune'. Message about bad EU didn't get any traction for years, until Farage stumbled upon immigration, and hey presto, the 'left-behinders' have finally a baddie to take blame for their failures.
Hope that helps!
I'd say it's more a case of said "left-behinders" finally cottoning on to the fact that Labour screwed them completely. Immigrants are not the focus of direct blame, rather the politicians that facilitated mass uncontrolled immigration. Low-skilled working classes make up a large contingent of the population and have felt the effects of said immigration more than most. What would you suggest they do instead of voting UKIP? What is in their interests? You seem to suggest they are being duped by Farage/UKIP which I'd say is pretty inaccurate. Voting UKIP is a rational decision for them and many others. The problem is the many others just haven't realised it yet! My remarks stand. You have a party which has someone like Helmer pretty high up. Less stupid of kippers were saying that party was distancing from him, I don't see that. I see Helmer as an integral part and 'magnet' for majority (c2-e demo-class) of kippers. Membership and sympathisers are mostly blind, or practically illiterate so it doesn't really matter much what is said.
Take, for an example, article quoted by steve. He did quote article either without reading it, or without understanding it. And yet he's someone who's so invested that he'll contact people. But, for the average kipper (imagine how many of them have 'read' that article and didn't alert 'the people in charge') after saying 'oh we were right, immigrants are coming in huge numbers and will take everyfing', the rest of the article doesn't matter.
I believe that Farage is a very skilled showman. He knows his audience. His 'man down the pub with a pint' episodes are honed to perfection. If you are low paid manual worker, whose life didn't turn out as well as hoped, you need someone who is to blame for your 'misfortune'. Message about bad EU didn't get any traction for years, until Farage stumbled upon immigration, and hey presto, the 'left-behinders' have finally a baddie to take blame for their failures.
Hope that helps!
HonestIago said:
I'd say it's more a case of said "left-behinders" finally cottoning on to the fact that Labour screwed them completely. Immigrants are not the focus of direct blame, rather the politicians that facilitated mass uncontrolled immigration. Low-skilled working classes make up a large contingent of the population and have felt the effects of said immigration more than most. What would you suggest they do instead of voting UKIP? What is in their interests? You seem to suggest they are being duped by Farage/UKIP which I'd say is pretty inaccurate. Voting UKIP is a rational decision for them and many others. The problem is the many others just haven't realised it yet!
Good post. Left-behinders are duped by Farage that he is 'THE bloke-down-the-pub', 'one-of-the-people'. As for immigration, Farage just offered convenient scapegoat. Suddenly, left-behinders can believe and say loudly; 'I failed at life because of them immigrants, it's nothing to do with lack of education, drive, taking responsibilities for my own life'. 'It's all them immigrants, pox on their houses'. Voting UKIP will be temporary relief, before they are replaced by either technology or outsourcing. What I'd suggest is for them to try to better themselves. To differentiate themselves from the immigrants. They have starting advantage of speaking English as a primary language. They know how the system works.
When you say that many others 'haven't realised it yet', are you actually saying that those 'many others' are even slower than left-behinders? What a scary thought. I'm not saying that you are wrong.
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