Scottish Referendum / Independence - Vol 5
Discussion
Edinburger said:
So if this forum is to achieve anything, let's try to be more realistic.
The only way this forum is going to achieve something is if you postulate answers to the myriad of questions you have been ignoring until now. And if ( of course ) the simple answer is that you do not know the answer to the questions, that you do not know why there is no Plan B for currency or the EU, then simply SAY SO.
Perhaps you could then explain how a seemingly intelligent and eloquent person can therefore consider voting yes for something that has no fallback position.
If we can get past the simple FACT , and you accept that there is NO PLAN B for any of the really important things, then we can move on and achieve something in this forum.
I am sure we would all be interested to know what you think will happen if no formal currency union and no-quick membership of the EU can be achieved. If we can get to this stage, then we are getting somewhere.
Until you face this simple truths however and stare these problems in the face - you are wasting your time and everyone elses.
9 hours and no post... oh well - I'll do it.
The CBI has today aligned itself with the NO campaign.
2 companies have said they will leave the CBI as their founders/ CEO believe in the YES campaign.
Will be interesting to see what other CBI members publicly think.
The think tank for an independent Scotland "Business for Scotland" disagree with the CBI.
So... to kick things off over a relaxing Easter weekend....
The existing arguments of "what currency?", "pensions", "corporation tax?", "personal taxation?", "defence?", "in/out of EU?" are still not cast in stone.
With so much uncertainty - could the CBI go any other way?
If not? Why not?
The CBI has today aligned itself with the NO campaign.
2 companies have said they will leave the CBI as their founders/ CEO believe in the YES campaign.
Will be interesting to see what other CBI members publicly think.
The think tank for an independent Scotland "Business for Scotland" disagree with the CBI.
So... to kick things off over a relaxing Easter weekend....
The existing arguments of "what currency?", "pensions", "corporation tax?", "personal taxation?", "defence?", "in/out of EU?" are still not cast in stone.
With so much uncertainty - could the CBI go any other way?
If not? Why not?
Edinburger said:
I've just read posts from the last few days and one thing occurred to me - it's no wonder there are so few Yes supporters here.
Read them yourself. Do you really think the average Joe PHer knows answers to questions which haven't yet been answered in the public domain?
Do you really think cries of "selfish", "racist ", etc ., are conducive to an open, meaningful and productive debate?
How can I tell you what Plan B on currency is? How can I prove to you that this isn't a hatred of all thing English (note though that I don't often see that claim on other forums).
Without clear guidance and a plan on these massively important issues, how can you possibly vote 'yes'?Read them yourself. Do you really think the average Joe PHer knows answers to questions which haven't yet been answered in the public domain?
Do you really think cries of "selfish", "racist ", etc ., are conducive to an open, meaningful and productive debate?
How can I tell you what Plan B on currency is? How can I prove to you that this isn't a hatred of all thing English (note though that I don't often see that claim on other forums).
The parachute analogy is an excellent one.
Two Scottish commercial giants are resigning from the CBI because it has come out against independence. Balhousie Care Group with 21 care homes in Scotland (how much of their business is in the gift of Salmonds mob) and Aquamarine Power who employ over 45 people, who's business I also suspect depends on the Scottish Govt are outraged that the CBI had had the temerity of not toeing the SNP line. Why does the Guardian bother reporting what these business minnows think.
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/apr/18/cb...
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/apr/18/cb...
Edinburger said:
I've just read posts from the last few days and one thing occurred to me - it's no wonder there are so few Yes supporters here.
Read them yourself. Do you really think the average Joe PHer knows answers to questions which haven't yet been answered in the public domain?
Do you really think cries of "selfish", "racist ", etc ., are conducive to an open, meaningful and productive debate?
How can I tell you what Plan B on currency is? How can I prove to you that this isn't a hatred of all thing English (note though that I don't often see that claim on other forums).
Let them cry racist all they want. It's not as if members of the BNP or that ilk are flocking to join the ranks of the SNP is it now? Read them yourself. Do you really think the average Joe PHer knows answers to questions which haven't yet been answered in the public domain?
Do you really think cries of "selfish", "racist ", etc ., are conducive to an open, meaningful and productive debate?
How can I tell you what Plan B on currency is? How can I prove to you that this isn't a hatred of all thing English (note though that I don't often see that claim on other forums).
In fact I'd wager that many BNP members are actually fans of the unionist position and supporters of Better Together. So like I said - let them cry racist all they want, it just makes them look even sillier.
Chlamydia said:
Considering what the B stands for I think you win the "stating the bleeding obvious" award when saying they would be supporters of the Union. Have you got any other pearls of wisdom?
in my statement I also qualified "or that ilk" meaning other far right (racist) groups...Edinburger said:
I've just read posts from the last few days and one thing occurred to me - it's no wonder there are so few Yes supporters here.
Read them yourself. Do you really think the average Joe PHer knows answers to questions which haven't yet been answered in the public domain?
Do you really think cries of "selfish", "racist ", etc ., are conducive to an open, meaningful and productive debate?
How can I tell you what Plan B on currency is? How can I prove to you that this isn't a hatred of all thing English (note though that I don't often see that claim on other forums).
Ah, the "conciliatory approach" Read them yourself. Do you really think the average Joe PHer knows answers to questions which haven't yet been answered in the public domain?
Do you really think cries of "selfish", "racist ", etc ., are conducive to an open, meaningful and productive debate?
How can I tell you what Plan B on currency is? How can I prove to you that this isn't a hatred of all thing English (note though that I don't often see that claim on other forums).
b
ks to you, who do you think you are going to fool with that?As to the attitude you are whinging about (victim, much!) ...Its quite simple - you and the rest of the nationalist morons are trying your damndest to make a change that will have a massive impact (and cost) on all of us and you refuse to (and are seemingly unable to) articulate a single f
king good reason for it. Why would people not think you were selfish, ungrateful & greedy tts?There are less than 1.5M of you at best. There are 60M people living in the UK
In the absence of any sound & logical arguments for what you want to bring about, the only conclusions anyone can reasonably come to are therefore that
a) you think you are all going to get rich off the oil (and there has been plenty of nationalist bulls
t about how much better off you will all be)and
b) You all just hate anyone who isn't Scots ("Wastemonster", b
d Tories, 8.9% vs 9.3%, its all Thatchers fault etc etc"Instead of whinging about questions that havn't been answered, how about dealing with some that have & the impact thereof? Starting with the fact that there will NOT be a currency union.
The extent of the irony of Nationalists complaining about a lack of information and then decrying two key pieces of information you have been given (re currency union and EU membership) as "scaremongering" simply because the answers don't suit you would be funny if it wasn't so f
king risible.As before, you are as transparent as glass.
pcvdriver said:
Let them cry racist all they want. It's not as if members of the BNP or that ilk are flocking to join the ranks of the SNP is it now?
In fact I'd wager that many BNP members are actually fans of the unionist position and supporters of Better Together. So like I said - let them cry racist all they want, it just makes them look even sillier.
In fact I'd wager that many BNP members are actually fans of the unionist position and supporters of Better Together. So like I said - let them cry racist all they want, it just makes them look even sillier.
Yep no racism
pcvdriver said:
Edinburger said:
I've just read posts from the last few days and one thing occurred to me - it's no wonder there are so few Yes supporters here.
Read them yourself. Do you really think the average Joe PHer knows answers to questions which haven't yet been answered in the public domain?
Do you really think cries of "selfish", "racist ", etc ., are conducive to an open, meaningful and productive debate?
How can I tell you what Plan B on currency is? How can I prove to you that this isn't a hatred of all thing English (note though that I don't often see that claim on other forums).
Let them cry racist all they want. It's not as if members of the BNP or that ilk are flocking to join the ranks of the SNP is it now? Read them yourself. Do you really think the average Joe PHer knows answers to questions which haven't yet been answered in the public domain?
Do you really think cries of "selfish", "racist ", etc ., are conducive to an open, meaningful and productive debate?
How can I tell you what Plan B on currency is? How can I prove to you that this isn't a hatred of all thing English (note though that I don't often see that claim on other forums).
In fact I'd wager that many BNP members are actually fans of the unionist position and supporters of Better Together. So like I said - let them cry racist all they want, it just makes them look even sillier.
Meanwhile the vast majority of the 60m in the UK are not selfish separatist racists, and are largely unimpressed at what the SNP are trying to achieve. This is being sought through lies and corrosive negative anti-UK messages that are totally unwarranted. These include very selfish policies, including some that are racist by any definition of the word.
If you vote yes, you are voting to discriminate against the english. In what way is this not racist?
Edinburger said:
Do you really think the average Joe PHer knows answers to questions which haven't yet been answered in the public domain?
....
How can I tell you what Plan B on currency is? How can I prove to you that this isn't a hatred of all thing English (note though that I don't often see that claim on other forums).
But this is the thing that is so incredible about it. Are ScotNats unable to see that they are supporting people who haven't a clue what they would do if they won?....
How can I tell you what Plan B on currency is? How can I prove to you that this isn't a hatred of all thing English (note though that I don't often see that claim on other forums).
The SNP answer everything with 'negative', 'scaremongering', 'anti-Scottish' when anyone points out the unanswered questions. Yet people are still willing to support them even though they obviously have no idea how to move forwards.
It is quite scary that there are so many people there who seem unable to look at it and think, 'hang on a minute, this is barking'.
Borghetto said:
Two Scottish commercial giants are resigning from the CBI because it has come out against independence. Balhousie Care Group with 21 care homes in Scotland (how much of their business is in the gift of Salmonds mob) and Aquamarine Power who employ over 45 people, who's business I also suspect depends on the Scottish Govt are outraged that the CBI had had the temerity of not toeing the SNP line. Why does the Guardian bother reporting what these business minnows think.
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/apr/18/cb...
Aquamarine, best pals with.....http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/apr/18/cb...
http://www.aquamarinepower.com/about-us/our-story/
....I applaud their success so far and wish them well with the wave power thing. I wonder if they think the rUK subsidies will continue post Yes? Or perhaos they are not affected and Alex made them another promise/offer I wonder?
Welshbeef said:
That James chap tweet is eye opening the Noers keep on finding such posts YET not a single Yeser is able to find anything like it in reverse. If it sounds like a dog looks like a odd it probably is a dog - racism.
Actually that Facebook post is one of the rarer posts from the natshe didn't call them
sfill you boots with ones that do
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Nationalists-Say-Th...
pcvdriver said:
Let them cry racist all they want. It's not as if members of the BNP or that ilk are flocking to join the ranks of the SNP is it now?
In fact I'd wager that many BNP members are actually fans of the unionist position and supporters of Better Together. So like I said - let them cry racist all they want, it just makes them look even sillier.
How is the position on university fees anything other than racist?In fact I'd wager that many BNP members are actually fans of the unionist position and supporters of Better Together. So like I said - let them cry racist all they want, it just makes them look even sillier.
McWigglebum4th said:
Actually that Facebook post is one of the rarer posts from the nats
he didn't call thems
fill you boots with ones that do
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Nationalists-Say-Th...
It's nice to see the crowd that Edinburg, Fluff and PCV are aligned to and of course none of them are racist. I've followed dsome of the Scots Govt committees in action and I have to say the SNP members by and large are about the lowest quality I've ever watched. If poor Scotland ever ends up being run by this partisan crowd of eejits, I fear for its future.he didn't call them
sfill you boots with ones that do
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Nationalists-Say-Th...
///ajd said:
Aquamarine, best pals with.....
http://www.aquamarinepower.com/about-us/our-story/
....I applaud their success so far and wish them well with the wave power thing. I wonder if they think the rUK subsidies will continue post Yes? Or perhaos they are not affected and Alex made them another promise/offer I wonder?
Well when two of the five banner images on their site have Alex Salmond in them I think we can tell where they think their loyalties best lie.http://www.aquamarinepower.com/about-us/our-story/
....I applaud their success so far and wish them well with the wave power thing. I wonder if they think the rUK subsidies will continue post Yes? Or perhaos they are not affected and Alex made them another promise/offer I wonder?
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