What's Italian for 'kipper? Anti-migrant stunt goes awry.

[anonymous-user]

I can't remember whether it was on this thread or the other one that I offered to wager £100, payable to the registered charity of the winner's choice, that UKIP will win not a single seat in the 2015 UK General Election. No takers so far, unless I have missed one, in which case apols to whomever that is, and vive le sport. The wager remains open.

I had a shufty at the Times today. I am not a fan of Murdoch, and naturally assume that the Times may have a pro Tory anti Nige agenda, but the expenses story isn't lying down and dying just yet. Like all stories casting UKIP in any sort of negative light, it is classed by the faithful as a non story. Maybe it is a non story, but at present I'm not sure either way. It matters not, because - to paraphrase someone else - if Nige was caught on film bribing Robert Mugabe to kill cute puppies, invade Poland, shag the Queen, and key everyone's cars, we would still be told "it's just a smear story".

[Zod]

Guam][some pointless ramblings said:

As for Ukip making a difference, according to the polls they already did, according to CMD's half arsed attempt at a supposed referendum they already did, see I do live in the "real world" after all.

But, given you don't think Cameron will give us any such referendum, UKIP has made no difference at all there.

Guam said:

As for handing it to labour, nope sorry blame your illustrious leader for that, ps off enough of the electorate and what you reap is chaos, isn't it delicious?

This is it: we're unhappy with Cameron for not doing all the things we want, so we don't care what happens as a result of our voting UKIP. It's the attitude of a spoilt child.

[anonymous-user]

Guam, re the expenses hoo hah, I presently have no clue who is right or wrong on this one. It happens to be the lead story today in what used to be the newspaper of record. That might mean something, or it might not, but the shouty bluster how very dare you approach that Nige tends to adopt when these things come up doesn't seem to be working on this one. Maybe it will in the end.

Anyway, not very important because Nige could be proven to have shot JFK, caused the South Sea Bubble, bribed all those England penalty takers to miss, stolen Shergar and pissed on your chips and he would still be whiter than snow in the eyes of the Cultists.

Edited by anonymous-user on Wednesday 16th April 19:15

[WinstonWolf]

Breadvan72 said:

I can't remember whether it was on this thread or the other one that I offered to wager £100, payable to the registered charity of the winner's choice, that UKIP will win not a single seat in the 2015 UK General Election. No takers so far, unless I have missed one, in which case apols to whomever that is, and vive le sport. The wager remains open.

I had a shufty at the Times today. I am not a fan of Murdoch, and naturally assume that the Times may have a pro Tory anti Nige agenda, but the expenses story isn't lying down and dying just yet. Like all stories casting UKIP in any sort of negative light, it is classed by the faithful as a non story. Maybe it is a non story, but at present I'm not sure either way. It matters not, because - to paraphrase someone else - if Nige was caught on film bribing Robert Mugabe to kill cute puppies, invade Poland, shag the Queen, and key everyone's cars, we would still be told "it's just a smear story".

Your wager was accepted and upped to a grand for charity. Now if only people didn't keep starting UKIP threads we might be able to find it

[anonymous-user]

Accepted by whom? I have been naughtily neglecting NPE and (a) doing some work (not much work) and taking my wife to lunch; and (b) reading and posting in actual car threads (THE SHAME!), so I missed the picking up of the Gage.

[DonkeyApple]

Guam said:

DonkeyApple said:

Guam said:

So you will vote for a guy who represents exactly what you say you despise in what you feel UKIP may represent and dont see a problem with tat?

And we are accused of not getting it, so stick with the old tribal mantra and vote via inertia because you dont feel anyone else will be different to what you dislike?

I'm not voting for a guy but for a party.

I've not accused anyone of not getting it either. In fact, the exact opposite, I have stated time and again that I don't get UKIP and asked questions to which no one seems able to answer.

On the matter of the EU the only party with any ability to offer the British people a say are the Tories. No one has been able to explain just how UKIP which is really just a one man party could deliver. At the same time no one can explain just what it is they are doing in Europe.

And there you have it, you are choosing to vote for a party that will best represent your view (as you should) some of us are doing exactly the same for pretty much the same reason, I would not question your right to make that choice nor mock you for doing so, the same sadly is not the same for others on this thread

But it's not just about representing my view. In fact that is a lesser factor. That is very much for local elections. For a general election you want your vote to count. As UKIP can't form a government and aren't in a position to be part of a coalition then a vote for them would favour Labour as they are the only other party capable of forming a government.

[WinstonWolf]

Breadvan72 said:

Accepted by whom? I have been naughtily neglecting NPE and (a) doing some work (not much work) and taking my wife to lunch; and (b) reading and posting in actual car threads (THE SHAME!), so I missed the picking up of the Gage.

Dunno, there's so many bloomin UKIP threads I'm

Sorry, now back to the insults...

[DonkeyApple]

Guam said:

DonkeyApple said:

WinstonWolf said:

DonkeyApple said:

WinstonWolf said:

I voted for Dave against my better judgement last time, I won't make the same mistake again. I refuse to vote for a Green party. Join us voting UKIP, you know it is the only way to defeat Labour

As no one can really explain that UKIP isn't just another public school politician milking the system for personal gain and as they offer absolutely no chance of the British people having a say on the EU then I have no choice but to stick to the cowardly and unlike able Dave whose party is offering me a voice on the matter. UKIP seems like one big money scam. They have no 'cabinet' members, no chance of winning the election, no ability to take part in a coalition and seem to have the only political tactic of taking potential Tory voters who don't accept the 'middle ground' thus strengthening Labours chances of winning.

The fact that no UKIP supporter has been able to detail who their cabinet would be, how they could form a coalition or just what exactly it is they are doing in Europe and why seems to speak volumes. I think they are a scam and that those at the top are making a fortune while exploiting Britons.

Did Dave lay out his cabinet before the last election? If so how, because he didn't know who was going win which seat...

Vote UKIP you know it makes sense

The main parties have a depth of members that makes it possible to form a cabinet. This is the vital difference.

Can you list 20 UKIP members who would be capable of being put into ministerial positions? If the major parties struggle then how can a party with only one central figure manage it?

In fairness DA the same exact point used to be leveled at the liberals, parties have to start somewhere

Very true but 2015 is far too crucial a year for this. Some general elections are more important than others and during lesser ones then favouring new parties has credence but arguably 2015 will be a major one and I find it strange that people who want to leave the EU would risk letting Labour in by not supporting the only alternative to Labour and the only party that could deliver a referendum.

[10 Pence Short]

The 2015 election will be inportant, but not for the reasons UKIP fans will like.

After 7 years of hard times, people will be seeing a rosier future and improvements in their pockets. They will care less about immigration and Europe, as people naturally do when things are going ok.

People will not want to rock the applecart by voting for the unknown just when things have begun to improve.

The EU elections are a different kettle of fish and UKIP should thrive in those.

[Countdown]

Guam said:

I doubt even Osborne can make up the 30% fall in living standards (in real terms) over the last couple of decades,

Could you explain how your 30% is calculated?

[DonkeyApple]

Guam said:

DonkeyApple said:

Guam said:

DonkeyApple said:

WinstonWolf said:

DonkeyApple said:

WinstonWolf said:

I voted for Dave against my better judgement last time, I won't make the same mistake again. I refuse to vote for a Green party. Join us voting UKIP, you know it is the only way to defeat Labour

As no one can really explain that UKIP isn't just another public school politician milking the system for personal gain and as they offer absolutely no chance of the British people having a say on the EU then I have no choice but to stick to the cowardly and unlike able Dave whose party is offering me a voice on the matter. UKIP seems like one big money scam. They have no 'cabinet' members, no chance of winning the election, no ability to take part in a coalition and seem to have the only political tactic of taking potential Tory voters who don't accept the 'middle ground' thus strengthening Labours chances of winning.

The fact that no UKIP supporter has been able to detail who their cabinet would be, how they could form a coalition or just what exactly it is they are doing in Europe and why seems to speak volumes. I think they are a scam and that those at the top are making a fortune while exploiting Britons.

Did Dave lay out his cabinet before the last election? If so how, because he didn't know who was going win which seat...

Vote UKIP you know it makes sense

The main parties have a depth of members that makes it possible to form a cabinet. This is the vital difference.

Can you list 20 UKIP members who would be capable of being put into ministerial positions? If the major parties struggle then how can a party with only one central figure manage it?

In fairness DA the same exact point used to be leveled at the liberals, parties have to start somewhere

Very true but 2015 is far too crucial a year for this. Some general elections are more important than others and during lesser ones then favouring new parties has credence but arguably 2015 will be a major one and I find it strange that people who want to leave the EU would risk letting Labour in by not supporting the only alternative to Labour and the only party that could deliver a referendum.

But every year is crucial to one party or the other, it will never change, unless people take risks, the vote liberal get Tory, vote UKIP get labour canard is a busted flush, if the Tories want to hit UKIP then they have to win back those who have been disillusioned by them, it wont be down to me ( or those like me), if labour get in next time round, it will be down to the Conservatives, they created this mess, as have labour to a large extent, CMD has had every opportunity, his back benchers have been telling him long enough, fewer and fewer people vote with each passing year? Why does anyone suppose that is?

Castigating those of us who at the very least will still support the process by exercising our mandate, due to the choice we MAY make seems a strange way to garner support imho.

Who am I castigating? Why does everyone think they are a victim?

Every year may be crucial to a party but that isn't what is relevant about 2015. We have had the deepest recession in living memory due to excessive debt and insufficient regulation. The current party have barely got any side of this under control. The opposition are very clearly not going to continue but ramp up debt and spending again. The importance of this election is that more than most it is going to be one that has big implications as to how our children live the rest of their lives.

[10 Pence Short]

Guam said:

I doubt even Osborne can make up the 30% fall in living standards (in real terms) over the last couple of decades, wage inflation is only .01% ahead of general inflation, I doubt anyone in the street views that as a win!

The question is, do people trust the status quo that is delivering the improvement, or risk a totally unknown in every respect, just when things seem stable?

Do people hate the EU and immigrants enough to risk their own rising prosperity? I don't believe they do.

[steveT350C]

10 Pence Short said:

Guam said:

I doubt even Osborne can make up the 30% fall in living standards (in real terms) over the last couple of decades, wage inflation is only .01% ahead of general inflation, I doubt anyone in the street views that as a win!

The question is, do people trust the status quo that is delivering the improvement, or risk a totally unknown in every respect, just when things seem stable?

Do people hate the EU and immigrants enough to risk their own rising prosperity? I don't believe they do.

Who hates immigrants?

I want to exit the EU....

[10 Pence Short]

steveT350C said:

Who hates immigrants?

I predict, not enough people to establish a seat in Westminster for UKIP next year.

[WinstonWolf]

steveT350C said:

10 Pence Short said:

Guam said:

I doubt even Osborne can make up the 30% fall in living standards (in real terms) over the last couple of decades, wage inflation is only .01% ahead of general inflation, I doubt anyone in the street views that as a win!

The question is, do people trust the status quo that is delivering the improvement, or risk a totally unknown in every respect, just when things seem stable?

Do people hate the EU and immigrants enough to risk their own rising prosperity? I don't believe they do.

Who hates immigrants?

I want to exit the EU....

Me too. Link to a single poster here who hates immigrants or be damned...

[Einion Yrth]

What I particularly like about the whole "vote UKIP, get Labour" mantra is that it entirely fails to notice the bloody great pachyderm resting comfortably in the corner of the room ; it's not those voting UKIP that are the problem, it's those voting Labour.

[steveT350C]

10 Pence Short said:

steveT350C said:

Who hates immigrants?

I predict, not enough people to establish a seat in Westminster for UKIP next year.

Oh dear, no progress then. Same old आक्षेप

[10 Pence Short]

WinstonWolf said:

Me too. Link to a single poster here who hates immigrants or be damned...

I haven't suggested anyone on this thread hates immigrants. I suggest people who dislike immigrants are attracted to UKIP. The better people are doing in their lives, the less they feel the need to dislike things that become peripheral in their lives (such as the EU and immigrants).

In other words, the number of people moved to vote for UKIPs headline policies is bound to reduce as their personal fortunes improve.

[WinstonWolf]

10 Pence Short said:

WinstonWolf said:

Me too. Link to a single poster here who hates immigrants or be damned...

I haven't suggested anyone on this thread hates immigrants. I suggest people who dislike immigrants are attracted to UKIP. The better people are doing in their lives, the less they feel the need to dislike things that become peripheral in their lives (such as the EU and immigrants).

In other words, the number of people moved to vote for UKIPs headline policies is bound to reduce as their personal fortunes improve.

You are completely wrong, you're projecting your own prejudices on the wrong party. People who don't like darkies will obviously be more attracted to the BNP.

[don4l]

DonkeyApple said:

I'm not voting for a guy but for a party.

I've not accused anyone of not getting it either. In fact, the exact opposite, I have stated time and again that I don't get UKIP and asked questions to which no one seems able to answer.

On the matter of the EU the only party with any ability to offer the British people a say are the Tories. No one has been able to explain just how UKIP which is really just a one man party could deliver. At the same time no one can explain just what it is they are doing in Europe.

If you really believe that Dave Cameron will offer you a referendum on EU membership, then you're a little bit "special".

He told us this before, and some people were stupid enough to believe it.

I'm a bit gobsmacked that anybody would be stupid enough to fall for the same ste twice.