Saint Nigel with his nose in the trough
Discussion
Guam said:
You really need to research this topic, the two positions are not mutually exclusive, if you are going to argue on how the mechanics work in Strasbourg at least spend a couple of days researching it.
Really."There is no point attending the EU because it decides nothing"
is compatible with
"70% of our laws come from the EU"
Really?
Not really.
It's poppycock. Poppycock you want to believe and won't hear against because of it.
Now.
Where were we?
Oh yes.
Name one thing UKIP have done in support of their purported aims.
Anyone have any actual examples yet?
loose cannon said:
Just listening to the same old lies and drone is enough to make me vote ukip
Let alone there sensible take on Europe, tell us something that cameron hasnt lied u turned or conveniently forgot about . Same old same old if ukip don't turn out to be what they say then we can vote with our feet just like we will be doing with the usual lot this election !
+1. Been pretty impressed by Cameron and Gideon lately, but as the establishment attacks ramp up after the Clegg/Farage debate, I'm put off the Cons (big C) once more.Let alone there sensible take on Europe, tell us something that cameron hasnt lied u turned or conveniently forgot about . Same old same old if ukip don't turn out to be what they say then we can vote with our feet just like we will be doing with the usual lot this election !
10 Pence Short said:
Really.
"There is no point attending the EU because it decides nothing"
is compatible with
"70% of our laws come from the EU"
Really?
Not really.
It's poppycock. Poppycock you want to believe and won't hear against because of it.
Now.
Where were we?
Oh yes.
Name one thing UKIP have done in support of their purported aims.
Anyone have any actual examples yet?
You have been given examples, the most telling being the increase in popularity."There is no point attending the EU because it decides nothing"
is compatible with
"70% of our laws come from the EU"
Really?
Not really.
It's poppycock. Poppycock you want to believe and won't hear against because of it.
Now.
Where were we?
Oh yes.
Name one thing UKIP have done in support of their purported aims.
Anyone have any actual examples yet?
And do as suggested and check where decisions are made in the EU. Hint the parliament is not the only body in the EU.
I can understand people may not like UKIP. I can understand they may not vote UKIP.
However, what I cannot understand is anyone who does not see they are an agent for change within both UK and EU politics. What I do not follow is why people are not happy the status quo is being questioned and challenged, unless they feel there is no need to do so, in which case I am really lost, because the one thing I simply can't accept is that any rational, logical person would look at the present manifestation of the EU and think it is all fine.
And so the perpetual sniping and yapping about UKIP becomes pretty tiresome. It will be very interesting to see the outcome of the upcoming polls.
However, what I cannot understand is anyone who does not see they are an agent for change within both UK and EU politics. What I do not follow is why people are not happy the status quo is being questioned and challenged, unless they feel there is no need to do so, in which case I am really lost, because the one thing I simply can't accept is that any rational, logical person would look at the present manifestation of the EU and think it is all fine.
And so the perpetual sniping and yapping about UKIP becomes pretty tiresome. It will be very interesting to see the outcome of the upcoming polls.
Guam,
On one hand you claim that a large percentage of laws are made and implemented from the EU.
On the other, you appear to say that the best way to influence the formation of those laws is to avoid being involved in their formation at all.
And then, thirdly, you claim we should support UKIP, as they've done such a fantastic job, yet you haven't managed to give one solitary example of anything UKIP have achieved. Not a jotter.
On one hand you claim that a large percentage of laws are made and implemented from the EU.
On the other, you appear to say that the best way to influence the formation of those laws is to avoid being involved in their formation at all.
And then, thirdly, you claim we should support UKIP, as they've done such a fantastic job, yet you haven't managed to give one solitary example of anything UKIP have achieved. Not a jotter.
10 Pence Short said:
Really.
"There is no point attending the EU because it decides nothing"
is compatible with
"70% of our laws come from the EU"
Really?
Not really.
It's poppycock. Poppycock you want to believe and won't hear against because of it.
Now.
Where were we?
Oh yes.
Name one thing UKIP have done in support of their purported aims.
Anyone have any actual examples yet?
Firstly, do you have the slightest understanding of how EU laws are made? It sounds like you really don't have a clue."There is no point attending the EU because it decides nothing"
is compatible with
"70% of our laws come from the EU"
Really?
Not really.
It's poppycock. Poppycock you want to believe and won't hear against because of it.
Now.
Where were we?
Oh yes.
Name one thing UKIP have done in support of their purported aims.
Anyone have any actual examples yet?
Secondly, I've already given you a long list of other parties who equally cannot prove that they have done anything in support of their purported aims - because they are not governing. You appear to have ignored this yet continue shouting your mantra. Odd.
10 Pence Short said:
Guam,
On one hand you claim that a large percentage of laws are made and implemented from the EU.
On the other, you appear to say that the best way to influence the formation of those laws is to avoid being involved in their formation at all.
And then, thirdly, you claim we should support UKIP, as they've done such a fantastic job, yet you haven't managed to give one solitary example of anything UKIP have achieved. Not a jotter.
10P. An old saying comes to mind. There's none so blind who will not seeOn one hand you claim that a large percentage of laws are made and implemented from the EU.
On the other, you appear to say that the best way to influence the formation of those laws is to avoid being involved in their formation at all.
And then, thirdly, you claim we should support UKIP, as they've done such a fantastic job, yet you haven't managed to give one solitary example of anything UKIP have achieved. Not a jotter.
10 Pence Short said:
Guam said:
You really need to research this topic, the two positions are not mutually exclusive, if you are going to argue on how the mechanics work in Strasbourg at least spend a couple of days researching it.
Really."There is no point attending the EU because it decides nothing"
is compatible with
"70% of our laws come from the EU"
Really?
Not really.
It's poppycock. Poppycock you want to believe and won't hear against because of it.
Now.
Where were we?
Oh yes.
Name one thing UKIP have done in support of their purported aims.
Anyone have any actual examples yet?
They've forced the issue of an in/out referendum. Not bad for a party with no MP's. Imagine what they will do when they've got a few
10 Pence Short said:
This tactic comes up rather a lot. There is a criticism of something and, rather than address it directly, a comparison is made to someone else who may also be doing something wrong.
It would make a refreshing change if people either defended the action, admitted it was wrong or provided some other explanation as to why it is ok, instead of simply saying "Oi! Look over there instead"!
They already did this on page one - it is an allowance, not an expense, no receitps are required and so it seems to be a misguided story.It would make a refreshing change if people either defended the action, admitted it was wrong or provided some other explanation as to why it is ok, instead of simply saying "Oi! Look over there instead"!
However, when that was said, you mentioned something about live tv, porn etc.
What precisely do you want?
10 Pence Short said:
Nope. Still nothing. No examples.
Lots of heat, no light.
Due to their increased support they were invited to take part in 2 televised debates with the deputy PM over UK's future within the EU. Which has dramatically raised the profile of the issue in the media and wider public. Lots of column inches written, posts on forums, discussions down the pub. It's put it firmly on the political agenda. None of which would have happened if UKIP did not exist and probably not if NF was not their leader.Lots of heat, no light.
On the basis that the sole aim of the party is UK's exit from the EU, I'd suggest that they've made huge strides in their of their purported aims?
What do you think?
fblm said:
10 Pence Short said:
Nope. Still nothing. No examples.
Lots of heat, no light.
PROMISE OF A REFERENDUM BY THE PM IMO a huge achievement for a party with not a single MP.Lots of heat, no light.
I'm out, 10PS you're painful...
fblm said:
I'm out, 10PS you're painful...
I can assure you I'm considerably less painful than the realisation that you've been supporting a shyster selling snake oil for the price of some trough snuffling at the EU's (and therefore our) expense.As has been said on this thread, none so blind as those who won't see.
10 Pence Short said:
fblm said:
I'm out, 10PS you're painful...
I can assure you I'm considerably less painful than the realisation that you've been supporting a shyster seeling snake oil for the price of some trough snuffling at the EUs (and therefore our) expense.As has been said on this thread, none so blind as those who won't see.
Scuffers said:
you do understand that the EU parliment is nothing like the UK one, in that it cannot instigate legislation or the like?
10 Pence Short said:
Really.
"There is no point attending the EU because it decides nothing"
is compatible with
"70% of our laws come from the EU"
I see a man...a man made entirely of straw."There is no point attending the EU because it decides nothing"
is compatible with
"70% of our laws come from the EU"
10 Pence Short said:
fblm said:
I'm out, 10PS you're painful...
I can assure you I'm considerably less painful than the realisation that you've been supporting a shyster selling snake oil for the price of some trough snuffling at the EU's (and therefore our) expense.As has been said on this thread, none so blind as those who won't see.
Client of mine had bbc radio 4 on this morning and farage was trying to explain the difference between allowances and expenses to the imbecile presenting/interviewing/attacking him. Seems to me those doing Farage the most credit are those trying to discredit him, but it's a moot point when so many seem to celebrate ignorance and chose/defend their brand of political party like it were their football team. Farage actually seems to enjoy being challenged and having to argue; I think few today evan understand the importance of this.
For balance
And just to piss 10PenceShort off, over on the UKIP thread I asked the following.
Let's not talk about the Govt who didn't get elected on the basis of giving voters the right of recall, then wrote it into the coalition agreement and have been unable to even deliver that.
EU, Cons, Lib Dems, and spendaholics Labour, all spot the difference politicians and all holding busted flushes. The electorate, or at least those with brains, are beginning to see through the b-s.
I have no idea if UKIP will make the breakthrough and become the first national party to make that hurdle in a generation. It's clear the established players are pooping their britches and it will get dirtier down in the gutter.
And just to piss 10PenceShort off, over on the UKIP thread I asked the following.
FiF said:
May I ask how many occasions over the years have LibLabCon had to return party donations when it turned out there was something dodgy about them. Quite a few I can say.
Also how many times have they been caught using spads paid for by taxpayer's money for purely party political purposes. Clegg is under such an investigation as we speak.
People in glass houses and all that.
Of course I don't really expect an answer, just as I asked the question on the debate thread about those who wanted us in the EU but reforms what reforms they wanted, and what was the line in the sand. No replies except from one person with some largely meaningless fanny about EU MP's who didn't attend on sufficient days should be recalled. That's from the EU parliament that has no effective powers by the way.Also how many times have they been caught using spads paid for by taxpayer's money for purely party political purposes. Clegg is under such an investigation as we speak.
People in glass houses and all that.
Let's not talk about the Govt who didn't get elected on the basis of giving voters the right of recall, then wrote it into the coalition agreement and have been unable to even deliver that.
EU, Cons, Lib Dems, and spendaholics Labour, all spot the difference politicians and all holding busted flushes. The electorate, or at least those with brains, are beginning to see through the b-s.
I have no idea if UKIP will make the breakthrough and become the first national party to make that hurdle in a generation. It's clear the established players are pooping their britches and it will get dirtier down in the gutter.
10 Pence Short said:
I can assure you I'm considerably less painful than the realisation that you've been supporting a shyster selling snake oil for the price of some trough snuffling at the EU's (and therefore our) expense.
As has been said on this thread, none so blind as those who won't see.
Oh, the irony.As has been said on this thread, none so blind as those who won't see.
Do you understand the difference between an allowance and an expense claim?
Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff