London cabbies to protest over smartphone app.

[Campo]

Rovinghawk said:

You're giving me a red herring?

A slippery Eel would be more apt

[hairyben]

DonkeyApple said:

Not at all. They have a smartphone ap already. Hailo. Works really well.

It is down to the fact that fundamentally, TFL have breached their contract by issuing a license to a minicab firm to run on meters. TFL should never have done it and have caused this issue unecassarily.

And don't forget, Black Cabs do not run a cartel. TFL creates and runs the cartel. And it has just screwed over its members who pay the premium to be part of that cartel.

Out of interest how is a meter defined? The dictionary defines it as an "item of measurement" which means the human brain constitutes a meter, as does a map. Placing a scale rule on a map could certainly said to be metering.

For cab co's to be not legally allowed to charge in the most clearly fair and consistent manner but arbitrary conjured up charges are fine seems quite perverse.

[Zod]

Campo said:

Zod said:

Well, I took an Uber E Class home from a drinks party last night. Very pleasant and cost me about 70% of the black cab fare.

Having never used them , do you see what you're being charged as you drive along or do you just get something on your app at the end? Also, can you hop out early if you get stuck in traffic?

How much was the fare and how much is it normally when you get a black cab at the same time of day?

You get a quote range when you book. I paid £22 for a ride that would usually cost around £30. You can hop out whenever you like.Not sure whether you can view fare during the ride. I've only used it twice so far, once in Paris and once here.

[ic0n]

Also got myself a nice Uber Exec home last night. E Class.

To be honest I use Uber because the cars are generally nice even at Exec level. E Classes, 5 Series etc. Cabs are about as comfortable as a park bench!

Have used Lux in the past but rarely bother now.

[DonkeyApple]

hairyben said:

DonkeyApple said:

Not at all. They have a smartphone ap already. Hailo. Works really well.

It is down to the fact that fundamentally, TFL have breached their contract by issuing a license to a minicab firm to run on meters. TFL should never have done it and have caused this issue unecassarily.

And don't forget, Black Cabs do not run a cartel. TFL creates and runs the cartel. And it has just screwed over its members who pay the premium to be part of that cartel.

Out of interest how is a meter defined? The dictionary defines it as an "item of measurement" which means the human brain constitutes a meter, as does a map. Placing a scale rule on a map could certainly said to be metering.

For cab co's to be not legally allowed to charge in the most clearly fair and consistent manner but arbitrary conjured up charges are fine seems quite perverse.

And this is the nub that the courts will have to define.

TFL run a scheme based on meters that they levy a hefty premium on. At the same time they manage to influence all taxi rates as a result.

Now they have licensed another entity to use meters which is a contravention of what Black Cabs sign up to and invest a lot in.

If black cabs eventually go from London then most importantly so does the mechanism which defines how much a minicab can charge. It won't benefit anyone.

[kev1974]

hairyben said:

Out of interest how is a meter defined? The dictionary defines it as an "item of measurement" which means the human brain constitutes a meter, as does a map. Placing a scale rule on a map could certainly said to be metering.

It's not just a "meter" at stake it's specifically a "taximeter", and somewhere there is a legal definition of what that is, it involves some physically wired connection to the drive system to actually measure distance though.

[Campo]

Zod said:

Campo said:

Zod said:

Well, I took an Uber E Class home from a drinks party last night. Very pleasant and cost me about 70% of the black cab fare.

Having never used them , do you see what you're being charged as you drive along or do you just get something on your app at the end? Also, can you hop out early if you get stuck in traffic?

How much was the fare and how much is it normally when you get a black cab at the same time of day?

You get a quote range when you book. I paid £22 for a ride that would usually cost around £30. You can hop out whenever you like.Not sure whether you can view fare during the ride. I've only used it twice so far, once in Paris and once here.

Thanks Zod, do you know what happens to the fare if you hop out early? Do you have to pay the full fare to destination or just up to where you got out?

[eharding]

kev1974 said:

hairyben said:

Out of interest how is a meter defined? The dictionary defines it as an "item of measurement" which means the human brain constitutes a meter, as does a map. Placing a scale rule on a map could certainly said to be metering.

It's not just a "meter" at stake it's specifically a "taximeter", and somewhere there is a legal definition of what that is, it involves some physically wired connection to the drive system to actually measure distance though.

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2006/2304/made

The Measuring Instruments Taximeters Regulations 2006 said:

“taximeter” means a device that works together with a signal generator to make a measuring instrument; with the device measuring duration, calculating distance on the basis of a signal delivered by the distance signal generator; and calculating and displaying the fare to be paid for a trip on the basis of the calculated distance or the measured duration of the trip, or both

The legal bunfight may well revolve around what constitutes a 'distance signal generator', and the technical response from Uber et al may be to re-engineer (if they haven't already) the architecture such that the passenger's mobile device becomes the sole reference for calculating the total fare. Hence the vehicle isn't fitted with, not has any ownership or title associated with, the measurement device. Probably.

[Zod]

Campo said:

Zod said:

Campo said:

Zod said:

Well, I took an Uber E Class home from a drinks party last night. Very pleasant and cost me about 70% of the black cab fare.

Having never used them , do you see what you're being charged as you drive along or do you just get something on your app at the end? Also, can you hop out early if you get stuck in traffic?

How much was the fare and how much is it normally when you get a black cab at the same time of day?

You get a quote range when you book. I paid £22 for a ride that would usually cost around £30. You can hop out whenever you like.Not sure whether you can view fare during the ride. I've only used it twice so far, once in Paris and once here.

Thanks Zod, do you know what happens to the fare if you hop out early? Do you have to pay the full fare to destination or just up to where you got out?

Unclear from reading the Ts & Cs. Good question.

[Pints]

Own goal?


Uber sees 850% increase in UK sign-ups on strike day
Taxi hailing app Uber claims that UK sign-ups for the app increased by 850% on the day of strikes by black cable drivers in London, reports The Telegraph. Uber's UK and Ireland general manager, Jo Bertram, said that Wednesday 11 June was the biggest day of sign ups since Uber launched in London in 2012. Meanwhile, Uber announced that it has added black cabs to its UberX, EXEC and LUX cars, allowing users to select UberTAXI from the app's vehicle options.

[Mr_B]

Can you imagine if all satnavs crashed for a couple of hours ? Addison Lee taxis and and others going around in circles and gridlock.

[mcflurry]

Mr_B said:

Can you imagine if all satnavs crashed for a couple of hours ? Addison Lee taxis and and others going around in circles and gridlock.

Why?

I'm not a cab driver, but I know a decent number of directions and main streets after working in London, even without the TomTom on

[Kermit power]

Are there any advertising/PR people on here who could take an informed guess at how much Uber would've had to pay to generate the level of publicity that the Cabbies have given them for free?

I'd never heard of them before this story hit the news, but have now installed it. So long as I can still get a receipt - either in the cab or downloaded and printed later - for expense claims and they provide a decent service, I can't see myself using black cabs again.

[Mr_B]

mcflurry said:

Mr_B said:

Can you imagine if all satnavs crashed for a couple of hours ? Addison Lee taxis and and others going around in circles and gridlock.

Why?

I'm not a cab driver, but I know a decent number of directions and main streets after working in London, even without the TomTom on

I drive every day in London. Private taxis are much worse than black cabs and clueless idiots most of the time. Every single one has and needs a sat-nav. I followed one yesterday with one stuck right in front of him in the screen and a second one going at the same time on the side - dangerous idiots. Driving anywhere near these tts has them jumping on the brakes and diving all over the place as their sat-nav updates and they nearly miss a turning.
I used to dislike black cabs, but with the rise of the likes of Addison Lee, they make black cabs look superb. The driving standard and aggressiveness if far worse. Just for that reason alone I would prefer black cab dominance.

[kev1974]

Mr_B said:

Can you imagine if all satnavs crashed for a couple of hours ? Addison Lee taxis and and others going around in circles and gridlock.

If that happens, a few confused taxis will be the least of your problems, behind the confused lorries and private cars that will be littering the streets!

[DonkeyApple]

Kermit power said:

Are there any advertising/PR people on here who could take an informed guess at how much Uber would've had to pay to generate the level of publicity that the Cabbies have given them for free?

I'd never heard of them before this story hit the news, but have now installed it. So long as I can still get a receipt - either in the cab or downloaded and printed later - for expense claims and they provide a decent service, I can't see myself using black cabs again.

Out of interest, have you used Hailo? No one seems to actually know about this ap?

[Hackney]

mcflurry said:

Mr_B said:

Can you imagine if all satnavs crashed for a couple of hours ? Addison Lee taxis and and others going around in circles and gridlock.

Why?

I'm not a cab driver, but I know a decent number of directions and main streets after working in London, even without the TomTom on

But you're not at Addison Lee driver either. In all honesty I'd be amazed if anyone, ever, has seen an AL driver in the correct lane at a junction.
Of course their owner insisted they use bus lanes which were allowed for taxis recently, on the basis that they provided the same service. Again, without actually working to the same legislation as a black cab

[Hackney]

DonkeyApple said:

Have you tried Hailo?

A perfect ap for London and NY.

And for London it is far less rapey and deathtrappy.

The 8th and 9th dwarves who failed to make the final cut of Snow White.

[Kermit power]

DonkeyApple said:

Kermit power said:

Are there any advertising/PR people on here who could take an informed guess at how much Uber would've had to pay to generate the level of publicity that the Cabbies have given them for free?

I'd never heard of them before this story hit the news, but have now installed it. So long as I can still get a receipt - either in the cab or downloaded and printed later - for expense claims and they provide a decent service, I can't see myself using black cabs again.

Out of interest, have you used Hailo? No one seems to actually know about this ap?

I tried once at 2am in Leicester Square on a Thursday night in mid-December after a work Christmas piss-up. It didn't work, so I ended up with Addison Lee instead.

Having said that, if I can have an E class for less than the cost of a Black Cab, what's not to like?

[DonkeyApple]

Kermit power said:

DonkeyApple said:

Kermit power said:

Are there any advertising/PR people on here who could take an informed guess at how much Uber would've had to pay to generate the level of publicity that the Cabbies have given them for free?

I'd never heard of them before this story hit the news, but have now installed it. So long as I can still get a receipt - either in the cab or downloaded and printed later - for expense claims and they provide a decent service, I can't see myself using black cabs again.

Out of interest, have you used Hailo? No one seems to actually know about this ap?

I tried once at 2am in Leicester Square on a Thursday night in mid-December after a work Christmas piss-up. It didn't work, so I ended up with Addison Lee instead.

Having said that, if I can have an E class for less than the cost of a Black Cab, what's not to like?

If you can get a new car and it has all the expected assurances such as insurance etc then not a lot.

I'm yet to have an issue with Hailo. About 5 mins before I want to leave home I ping it and a cab arrives and I've never had an issue with it when coming home if I can't flag one off the street. Where it really excels is when you have to go somewhere touristy which is full of Friday Nighters and you don't have to play that irritating game of trying to find the right position to grab the first yellow light.