Israeli

[allnighter]

avinalarf said:

allnighter said:

ndeed, something in the article reminded me exactly of what's going with the Pro-Israel contributors who won't hesitate to tell lies on here just like Israel's propaganda machine to divert attention from the real issues associated with the conflict.

“Hajo knows that Israel has a long history of abusing the tragic history of the Holocaust in order to suppress legitimate criticism of its own crimes.

“Especially since Gaza, people are no longer taken in by their claim that anyone that criticises Israel is anti-Semitic.”

I was always the one to jump on anyone who displayed a slight tendency to anti-Semitism on here and I did that on at least three occasion in this thread IIRC, and obviously that was deliberately ignored by one poster on here who was allegedly "sure" that I will be happy so long as most Jews are dead.

If these are the kind of punching below the belt debating techniques that are being utilised on here by the likes of Mrr T to obfuscate any criticism directed at Israel, then this proves they are uneasy with the truth and more at ease in their imaginary comfort zone that Israel is the caring mother of all democracies, and the IDF are the little cupids of love and tenderness.

A rather patronising comment.
That you are not anti Semitic is neither here or there.
I can assure you anti semitism is alive and well and does not require your verification.
Just as prejudice against blacks is stll thriving,and therefore when they comment on their history of slavery,which was abolished many years before the holocaust,do you feel justified to dismiss that history in such a cavalier fashion ?

If all black people went to Narnia and kicked out most of its population utilising terror then formed a government based on an ideology which favoured blacks over Narnians, and blacks started treating Narnians like second class citizens, then if I criticise their government for being unfair and racist and they start invoking their history of slavery as an excuse to obfuscate my legitimate gripe with their prejudice against Narnians, then yes I will dismiss that history as irrelevant.

[enioldjoe]

league67 said:

enioldjoe said:

Why do you continue to bang this particularly one sided drum when both Fatah and the Palestinian people today don't really want a two state solution either ?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W1Qmr3_IrVE&li...

http://palwatch.org/main.aspx?fi=157&doc_id=10...

"These statements coming from Abbas Zaki are significant because he is a senior Palestinian official and a very close associate of Mahmoud Abbas. He was sent to Syria as Mahmoud Abbas' personal representative a few months ago and has spoken at public events representing Fatah."


Also:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2pznF4HYhXA


A recent Poll:
Only 27.3% of those polled supported a two state solution. Two thirds want all of historic Palestine back under Arab control. Only 10.1% overall believe it should be made into a democratic state where everyone enjoys equal rights.
http://www.washingtoninstitute.org/policy-analysis...

Do you even check your sources for bias?

Palwatch.org?
Itamar Marcus - Director
Mr. Marcus was appointed by the Israel Government [in 1999] to represent Israel in negotiations with the Palestinian Authority on Incitement.
Regularly gives analysis for FoxNews.

"Washington Institute" board of directors;

Richard S. Abramson

Chairman
Martin J. Gross

Chairman Emeritus
Howard P. Berkowitz

Founding President and Chairman Emerita
Barbi Weinberg

Senior Vice Presidents
Bernard Leventhal
Peter Lowy
James Schreiber

Hope that helps.

And UN is biased and unreliable source. You just couldn't make this up.

So any of that changes what came out of the mouths of the Fatah representatives on the clips then? Maybe show that they were actors with scripts ( along with all the other recorded instances ) and you might have a point. The staged takeover of the whole land a basic truth for anyone with eyes to see. Sorry but I don't know what else to say!

Regarding the UN, yes it's rotten to the core with anti - Israel sentiment. Arab-Soviet/Third World Alliance anyone?? Here's some 'blunt' but clear thinking from someone who's general biases I do not share! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GpXMe_R2BZk

[allnighter]

Mrr T said:

allnighter said:

Mrr T said:

allnighter said:

forced expulsion and ethnic cleansing of 750,000 Palestinians who ended up as refugees are historical facts and well documented and have nothing to do with genocide, how stupid can you get? Are you really that thick?

Edited by allnighter on Monday 25th August 09:30

I would have said "forced expulsion and ethnic cleaning" would be clearly defined as genocide by Articles 2 of Convention on the Prevention and Punishment of the Crime of Genocide.

The more you post crap the more you look stupid.


Article II: In the present Convention, genocide means any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such:

(a) Killing members of the group;
(b) Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group;
(c) Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part;
(d) Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group;
(e) Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group.

Now where did I accuse Israel of "Genocide" when I was talking about the ethnic cleansing of 750,000 Palestinian Arabs from their land who ended up as refugees and were never allowed back to their valleys and farms?

Now are you going to continue to make yourself stupid, or are you going to provide evidence of:

1. Me accusing Israel of "Genocide".

2. Me being happy that all or most Jews were dead.

Give us something with a bit of meat on, or hang your head in shame.

You do realise if you post information in support of your arguement it should actually support your point not mine.

GENOCIDE: The deliberate killing of a large group of people, especially those of a particular nation or ethnic group. Now kindly direct me to a post where a/I accused Israel of genocide (not the ethnic cleansing of 750.000 Palestinians in favour of immigrants to shift the demographics as mentioned previously, you do realise they were not killed don't you, you do realised they ended up as refugees don't you? so that's hardly genocide per se), and b/ expressed a wish or a desire to see most Jews dead. I am a patient man Mrr T and I won't let this rest till you either provide evidence for (a) and (b) or admit you were wrong and apologise, or admit you are an imbecile for suggesting (a) and (b) if apologising is not your thing.

Edited by allnighter on Monday 25th August 15:18

[enioldjoe]

allnighter said:

Alpinestars said:

Joffery666 said:

Holocaust survivors and their descendants accuse ISRAEL/ZIONISTS of â??genocideâ??

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-eas...

You'd have thought these people were better placed than most of us "debating" on this forum to make an assessment of what Israel is doing.

Many of the current supporters of Israel know better than someone who's lived through the holocaust and the current Israeli regime. They ignore the comments made by their leaders who created Israel who clearly knew they were displacing people from their land.

This survivor caused outrage when he compared Israel to the Nazi tactics. He says “It may be that Israel is not the most cruel country in the world … but one thing I know for sure is that Israel is the world champion in pretending to be civilised and cultured.”

http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/politics/auschw...

So the supporters of Israel actually feel they know more than the holocaust survivors, the Israeli leadership when it was created and ex IDF soldiers breaking the silence?

Indeed, something in the article reminded me exactly of what's going with the Pro-Israel contributors who won't hesitate to tell lies on here just like Israel's propaganda machine to divert attention from the real issues associated with the conflict.

“Hajo knows that Israel has a long history of abusing the tragic history of the Holocaust in order to suppress legitimate criticism of its own crimes.

“Especially since Gaza, people are no longer taken in by their claim that anyone that criticises Israel is anti-Semitic.”

I was always the one to jump on anyone who displayed a slight tendency to anti-Semitism on here and I did that on at least three occasion in this thread IIRC, and obviously that was deliberately ignored by one poster on here who was allegedly "sure" that I will be happy so long as most Jews are dead.

If these are the kind of punching below the belt debating techniques that are being utilised on here by the likes of Mrr T to obfuscate any criticism directed at Israel, then this proves they are uneasy with the truth and more at ease in their imaginary comfort zone that Israel is the caring mother of all democracies, and the IDF are the little cupids of love and tenderness.

That's rather ironic considering it was you who diverted attention away from the real issue behind the conflict as raised by 'fesuvious' on page 53 of this thread!

[league67]

avinalarf said:

Your sources are always completely unbiased .

Equivalent of above posts would be to quote Hamas' PR arm on anything that Israel government does. Show me a post where I've done that. I'll help you out;
Washington Post, BBC, UN, Lancet, two professors responding to Jon Woight's rant; credible sources. Palwatch, thomaswictor, freepalestine; not so much.

avinalarf said:

It must be wonderful to live in your World,absolute certainty on who are the good guys.

Who are the good guys, tell me what I think. I'll remind you once again of my stance 'Hamas are murderous twunt and terrorists, IDF are no better'. Do I think this will stop you from making things up? Not a chance.

avinalarf said:

Certainly the UN is not a source,nowadays, I would accept as not being unbiased.

Do you want to rethink that one?

avinalarf said:

There are few organisations nowadays that do not have an agenda or bias of some sort.

I know, those murderous doctors and publishers of Lancet, very biased anti-Israeli organization.

avinalarf said:

Many posts supporting Israel have admitted mistakes have been made,over the past 60 years,and that the present government is taking a hard line in trying to defeat Hamas,and in so doing civilian Palestinians have been killed.
Any life lost is one too many.
Quoting sources and statistics will not end this tragic state of affairs.
Indeed it only entrenches opinions of those who try to cast blame, in preference to those who wish to bring about a credible peace.

You are right, some posts are very helpful, along the lines of 'only kidding'.

[Alpinestars]

Grumfutock said:

And again with the misrepresentation.

Just because Herr Meyer survived 10 months in a concentration camp, a very harsh experience I am sure, doesn't make him an expert on Israel-Palestine. Indeed it would appear, upon a little research, that he isn't JUST a poor old survivor who has chosen to speak out is he? I cant even find anything to suggest that he has ever been to Israel or Palestine.

His appearance was organised by Mick Napier of the Scottish Palestine ­Solidarity Campaign chairman. A sort of aging hippie that campaigned against the Vietnam war and has just kept going.

From his Wiki page:

"In recent years, Meyer had been politically active, including as director of A Different Jewish Voice. He also wrote the book Het einde van het Jodendom (The End of Judaism) in 2003, which accuses Israel of abusing the Holocaust to justify crimes against the Palestinians. He was a member of the International Jewish Anti-Zionist Network. He participated in the 2011 "Never Again - For Anyone" tour. Meyer also claimed that Zionism predates fascism, that Zionists and fascists had a history of cooperation, and that Israel wants to create anti-Semitism in the world to encourage more Jews to migrate to Israel.[3] He had spoken in favor of Boycott, Divestment and Sanctions against Israel.[4] Hajo Meyer was a member of the Dutch GreenLeft."

Edited by Grumfutock on Monday 25th August 14:15

And what about all the statements made by Ben Gurion posted earlier and all the hundreds of people who have served in the IDF who have criticised Israel and its terrorist means? Are they to be ignored as well?

What is your definition of terrorism? What if any source would ever make you say something against Israel?

[allnighter]

enioldjoe said:

allnighter said:

Alpinestars said:

Joffery666 said:

Holocaust survivors and their descendants accuse ISRAEL/ZIONISTS of â??genocideâ??

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-eas...

You'd have thought these people were better placed than most of us "debating" on this forum to make an assessment of what Israel is doing.

Many of the current supporters of Israel know better than someone who's lived through the holocaust and the current Israeli regime. They ignore the comments made by their leaders who created Israel who clearly knew they were displacing people from their land.

This survivor caused outrage when he compared Israel to the Nazi tactics. He says “It may be that Israel is not the most cruel country in the world … but one thing I know for sure is that Israel is the world champion in pretending to be civilised and cultured.”

http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/politics/auschw...

So the supporters of Israel actually feel they know more than the holocaust survivors, the Israeli leadership when it was created and ex IDF soldiers breaking the silence?

Indeed, something in the article reminded me exactly of what's going with the Pro-Israel contributors who won't hesitate to tell lies on here just like Israel's propaganda machine to divert attention from the real issues associated with the conflict.

“Hajo knows that Israel has a long history of abusing the tragic history of the Holocaust in order to suppress legitimate criticism of its own crimes.

“Especially since Gaza, people are no longer taken in by their claim that anyone that criticises Israel is anti-Semitic.”

I was always the one to jump on anyone who displayed a slight tendency to anti-Semitism on here and I did that on at least three occasion in this thread IIRC, and obviously that was deliberately ignored by one poster on here who was allegedly "sure" that I will be happy so long as most Jews are dead.

If these are the kind of punching below the belt debating techniques that are being utilised on here by the likes of Mrr T to obfuscate any criticism directed at Israel, then this proves they are uneasy with the truth and more at ease in their imaginary comfort zone that Israel is the caring mother of all democracies, and the IDF are the little cupids of love and tenderness.

That's rather ironic considering it was you who diverted attention away from the real issue behind the conflict as raised by 'fesuvious' on page 53 of this thread!

All I stated was that Islam bashing should be done in another thread. The conflict is not about religion. Religion is just an identifier and people are tribal by nature and will fight over any excuse. In this case it's about land.

[league67]

enioldjoe said:

So any of that changes what came out of the mouths of the Fatah representatives on the clips then? Maybe show that they were actors with scripts ( along with all the other recorded instances ) and you might have a point. The staged takeover of the whole land a basic truth for anyone with eyes to see. Sorry but I don't know what else to say!

Regarding the UN, yes it's rotten to the core with anti - Israel sentiment. Arab-Soviet/Third World Alliance anyone?? Here's some 'blunt' but clear thinking from someone who's general biases I do not share! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GpXMe_R2BZk

Ah the good old victim card, world, represented by UN hates Israel. It has nothing to do with breaking international law. The whole world is one big anti-Semitic oyster, isn't it.
As for your 'Washington Institute' this is the background on it;

couple of academics said:

John Mearsheimer, a University of Chicago political science professor, and Stephen Walt, academic dean at Harvard University's Kennedy School of Government, describe Washington Institute as "part of the core" of the Israel lobby in the United States.

So yes, when dean of HU's school of Government says that someone is 'part of the core' of Israeli lobby, I'd say that's pretty on the money. Will that stop you from waving victim card? Not a chance.

Tell me that you didn't just post Pat Condell's rant as a clear thinking. Are you a kipper? LOL. Is that the same dumbass who posted this http://www.patcondell.net/why-i-support-israel ? Once again, completely relevant unbiased post. Apologies for trying sensible reply to your previous post.

As for random youtube videos spouting hate, I'll leave you with Knesset deputy speaker;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mD-zOV1MDAc

'Arab-Soviet-Third-World'? Once again, you just couldn't make it up.

[Countdown]

Kinky said:

STOP!

A polite notice to please keep things civil.

If you can't be polite, then don't bother posting.

One and only warning.

Am I the only one who thinks certain posters would prefer this thread to locked to stop discussions of Israel's behaviour?

[Grumfutock]

Alpinestars said:

And what about all the statements made by Ben Gurion posted earlier and all the hundreds of people who have served in the IDF who have criticised Israel and its terrorist means? Are they to be ignored as well?

What is your definition of terrorism? What if any source would ever make you say something against Israel?

Hundreds of ex IDF you say? Really? No, REALLY? HUNDREDS?????

As for Israel, I have repeatedly said, that they are not perfect. The problem is that you are so wrapped up in you tirade against some on here that you don't read the posts or at best suffer from selective memory. But just to be clear and 100% transparent.

Israel have made mistakes. Israel have killed civilians. OK? That do it for you? Clear enough?

The whole point, and this is something that Scuffers and I have been trying to get across to you, is that it is impossible to carry out a bombing campaign/war without people getting hurt. Somewhat magnified when in an urban area.

OK I answered your question. Your turn to answer mine.

How would you of done it? Be so kind as to educate us all on how you would of dealt with suicide bombings? With the tunnels? With the kidnapping and murders? How, exactly, would you of reacted to 3,000 missiles being shot at your country? Pray enlighten us!

[allnighter]

Countdown said:

Am I the only one who thinks certain posters would prefer this thread to locked to stop discussions of Israel's behaviour?

I suspect one troll is desperate definitely!

[zuby84]

Grumfutock said:

The whole point, and this is something that Scuffers and I have been trying to get across to you, is that it is impossible to carry out a bombing campaign/war without people getting hurt. Somewhat magnified when in an urban area.

The Hamas version of Grumfutock would be making the same mundane excuses as you trying to justify Hamas's atrocities...


"The whole point, and this is something that pro-Hamas version of Scuffers and I have been trying to get across to you, is that it is impossible to carry out terrorism without people getting hurt. Somewhat magnified when in an urban area."

What a weak point.

[Alpinestars]

Grumfutock said:

Hundreds of ex IDF you say? Really? No, REALLY? HUNDREDS?????

As for Israel, I have repeatedly said, that they are not perfect. The problem is that you are so wrapped up in you tirade against some on here that you don't read the posts or at best suffer from selective memory. But just to be clear and 100% transparent.

Israel have made mistakes. Israel have killed civilians. OK? That do it for you? Clear enough?

The whole point, and this is something that Scuffers and I have been trying to get across to you, is that it is impossible to carry out a bombing campaign/war without people getting hurt. Somewhat magnified when in an urban area.

OK I answered your question. Your turn to answer mine.

How would you of done it? Be so kind as to educate us all on how you would of dealt with suicide bombings? With the tunnels? With the kidnapping and murders? How, exactly, would you of reacted to 3,000 missiles being shot at your country? Pray enlighten us!

First things first, can I suggest you lose the attitude. I offered an olive branch as you called it yesterday and all of a sudden I (capitals) appear to be the one who is refuting everything you and Scuffers say. You and him have man other critics, ao please don't make me feel special.

You've not answered the question anyway. Do you ignore Ben Gurion's comments? And yes, 100s of ex IDF have testified. Nearly 1000 testimonies according to their website. Or is that propaganda as well?

Re the solution, I don't have one, other than treating the people from who land was stolen and who were terrorised in doing so and continue to be on a daily basis to be given the same rights as you and I might like to be afforded to us. A 2 state solution might be it.

Now, would you like to address the question of "breaking the silence" are they a credible source?

What do you make of Ben Gurion's statements?

[avinalarf]

allnighter said:

avinalarf said:

allnighter said:

ndeed, something in the article reminded me exactly of what's going with the Pro-Israel contributors who won't hesitate to tell lies on here just like Israel's propaganda machine to divert attention from the real issues associated with the conflict.

“Hajo knows that Israel has a long history of abusing the tragic history of the Holocaust in order to suppress legitimate criticism of its own crimes.

“Especially since Gaza, people are no longer taken in by their claim that anyone that criticises Israel is anti-Semitic.”

I was always the one to jump on anyone who displayed a slight tendency to anti-Semitism on here and I did that on at least three occasion in this thread IIRC, and obviously that was deliberately ignored by one poster on here who was allegedly "sure" that I will be happy so long as most Jews are dead.

If these are the kind of punching below the belt debating techniques that are being utilised on here by the likes of Mrr T to obfuscate any criticism directed at Israel, then this proves they are uneasy with the truth and more at ease in their imaginary comfort zone that Israel is the caring mother of all democracies, and the IDF are the little cupids of love and tenderness.

A rather patronising comment.
That you are not anti Semitic is neither here or there.
I can assure you anti semitism is alive and well and does not require your verification.
Just as prejudice against blacks is stll thriving,and therefore when they comment on their history of slavery,which was abolished many years before the holocaust,do you feel justified to dismiss that history in such a cavalier fashion ?

If all black people went to Narnia and kicked out most of its population utilising terror then formed a government based on an ideology which favoured blacks over Narnians, and blacks started treating Narnians like second class citizens, then if I criticise their government for being unfair and racist and they start invoking their history of slavery as an excuse to obfuscate my legitimate gripe with their prejudice against Narnians, then yes I will dismiss that history as irrelevant.

Extrapolating your last comment it leads one to form the questions....
A) Israel has no right whatsoever to exist as the Israelis are living on confiscated Palestinian land.
B) Israel has a right to exist and thus has a right to defend itself against attack by it's enemies.
Point (a) closes down the debate.
Point (b) leads to a discussion on the amount of force used and whether it is appropriate.
As regards your comment on slavery,one could argue that as Africans and Arabs indulged themselves in selling Africans into slavery that was an excuse for Europeans to act accordingly.
Not an argument I would use but an example of the twisted logic and bias you display.
Once again you choose to ignore the many historical and recent examples where invading forces have removed and/or confiscated land from those already living on it,many in far more savage ways than Israel has employed.

Edited by avinalarf on Monday 25th August 16:42

[Chlamydia]

Countdown said:

Am I the only one who thinks certain posters would prefer this thread to locked to stop discussions of Israel's behaviour?

league67 said:

• sado, who spent 20 years of his pathetic life being a cannon fodder because obvious lack of education and lack of any sign of intellect forced his career choice

With statements like the one made by League67, above, I'd say that goes for both sides of the argument. Just for your information, League67, some people see serving in the UK Armed Forces as a privilege and it doesn't follow that only people with a "lack of any sign of intellect" enlist. How about you stop with the personal insults?

[Grumfutock]

Nope, I have tried until I am blue in the face. People complain at every turn and demand answers but don't have any themselves. The think a war can be fought with out casualties. They think a nation should just accept incoming fire and "turn the other cheek". Well good luck with it.

[Grumfutock]

Alpinestars said:

First things first, can I suggest you lose the attitude. I offered an olive branch as you called it yesterday and all of a sudden I (capitals) appear to be the one who is refuting everything you and Scuffers say. You and him have man other critics, ao please don't make me feel special.

Your mistaking attitude for amazement and disbelief.

[avinalarf]

league67 said:

avinalarf said:

Your sources are always completely unbiased .

Equivalent of above posts would be to quote Hamas' PR arm on anything that Israel government does. Show me a post where I've done that. I'll help you out;
Washington Post, BBC, UN, Lancet, two professors responding to Jon Woight's rant; credible sources. Palwatch, thomaswictor, freepalestine; not so much.

avinalarf said:

It must be wonderful to live in your World,absolute certainty on who are the good guys.

Who are the good guys, tell me what I think. I'll remind you once again of my stance 'Hamas are murderous twunt and terrorists, IDF are no better'. Do I think this will stop you from making things up? Not a chance.

avinalarf said:

Certainly the UN is not a source,nowadays, I would accept as not being unbiased.

Do you want to rethink that one?

avinalarf said:

There are few organisations nowadays that do not have an agenda or bias of some sort.

I know, those murderous doctors and publishers of Lancet, very biased anti-Israeli organization.

avinalarf said:

Many posts supporting Israel have admitted mistakes have been made,over the past 60 years,and that the present government is taking a hard line in trying to defeat Hamas,and in so doing civilian Palestinians have been killed.
Any life lost is one too many.
Quoting sources and statistics will not end this tragic state of affairs.
Indeed it only entrenches opinions of those who try to cast blame, in preference to those who wish to bring about a credible peace.

You are right, some posts are very helpful, along the lines of 'only kidding'.

So you equate the IDF ,the army of Israel,defending it's country and attacking the enemy,equal to Hamas an organisation that denies Israel's right to exist.

[TheRealFingers99]

zuby84 said:

The Hamas version of Grumfutock would be making the same mundane excuses as you trying to justify Hamas's atrocities...


"The whole point, and this is something that pro-Hamas version of Scuffers and I have been trying to get across to you, is that it is impossible to carry out terrorism without people getting hurt. Somewhat magnified when in an urban area."

What a weak point.

To take it further (but here, a Palestinian version of Grumfutock, not necessarily Hamasfutock):

How would you of done it? Be so kind as to educate us all on how you would of dealt with ethnic cleansing? With the disinfranchisement? With the landgrab? With the kidnapping and murders? How, exactly, would you of reacted to the illegal occupation of your country? Pray enlighten us!

[Mrr T]

allnighter said:

Mrr T said:

allnighter said:

Mrr T said:

allnighter said:

forced expulsion and ethnic cleansing of 750,000 Palestinians who ended up as refugees are historical facts and well documented and have nothing to do with genocide, how stupid can you get? Are you really that thick?

Edited by allnighter on Monday 25th August 09:30

I would have said "forced expulsion and ethnic cleaning" would be clearly defined as genocide by Articles 2 of Convention on the Prevention and Punishment of the Crime of Genocide.

The more you post crap the more you look stupid.


Article II: In the present Convention, genocide means any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such:

(a) Killing members of the group;
(b) Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group;
(c) Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part;
(d) Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group;
(e) Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group.

Now where did I accuse Israel of "Genocide" when I was talking about the ethnic cleansing of 750,000 Palestinian Arabs from their land who ended up as refugees and were never allowed back to their valleys and farms?

Now are you going to continue to make yourself stupid, or are you going to provide evidence of:

1. Me accusing Israel of "Genocide".

2. Me being happy that all or most Jews were dead.

Give us something with a bit of meat on, or hang your head in shame.

You do realise if you post information in support of your arguement it should actually support your point not mine.

GENOCIDE: The deliberate killing of a large group of people, especially those of a particular nation or ethnic group. Now kindly direct me to a post where a/I accused Israel of genocide (not the ethnic cleansing of 750.000 Palestinians in favour of immigrants to shift the demographics as mentioned previously, you do realise they were not killed don't you, you do realised they ended up as refugees don't you? so that's hardly genocide per se), and b/ expressed a wish or a desire to see most Jews dead. I am a patient man Mrr T and I won't let this rest till you either provide evidence for (a) and (b) or admit you were wrong and apologise, or admit you are an imbecile for suggesting (a) and (b) if apologising is not your thing.

Edited by allnighter on Monday 25th August 15:18

So you have now proved you did not read what you posted. The Convention on Genoside, which you copied into your post, clearly does not require you to kill any one to commit genocide.