Israeli

[easytiger123]

This place has turned into Stormfront.org recently. And apparently is entirely unmoderated.

[Grumfutock]

QuantumTokoloshi said:

Come on. I disagree strongly with Grum and Co. regarding Israel and do not support the actions of the Israeli state in Gaza or the West bank, but you need to step back and read what you have written. It is now getting ridiculous.

I think that is his sole intention.

[franki68]

AndStilliRise said:

You can have race defining attributes.

For instance, most Africans I have met are dark brown in colour.

Most jewish people i have met also have large noses.

you're not real are you ? some cartoon or something.

[Grumfutock]

AndStilliRise said:

You can have race defining attributes.

For instance, most Africans I have met are dark brown in colour.

Most jewish people i have met also have large noses.

Do you have blond hair and blue eyes?

[zuby84]

easytiger123 said:

This place has turned into Stormfront.org recently. And apparently is entirely unmoderated.

It has for a good few years...

[br d]

Some sterling efforts to get the thread closed down this afternoon.

[JensenA]

QuantumTokoloshi said:

AndStilliRise said:

You can have race defining attributes.

For instance, most Africans I have met are dark brown in colour.

Most jewish people i have met also have large noses.

Come on. I disagree strongly with Grum and Co. regarding Israel and do not support the actions of the Israeli state in Gaza or the West bank, but you need to step back and read what you have written. It is now getting ridiculous.

+1.

The conflict between Israel and the Palestinians is nothing to do with race. For anyone to bring into the discussion the notion of racism, simply shows, in my opinion, that person to be racist himself.
This thread is just going round and round in circles, and there are a few people on here - from both sides of the argument - who express views and opinions that exactly mirror those of the opposing factions themselves, and that is why the actual conflict itself carries on.

[TheRealFingers99]

AndStilliRise said:

You can have race defining attributes.

For instance, most Africans I have met are dark brown in colour.

Most jewish people i have met also have large noses.

There are plenty of Arabs in Africa. One Algerian friend has passed himself off for years as an Italian. Algeria is in Africa.

But I doubt that Jews have bigger noses than Arabs.

While there are racial attributes -- skin colour, eye colour, hair colour, appearance -- I don't see them extend to behaviour.

[Bill]

He won't be replying.

[TheRealFingers99]

Where were we?

Grum was suggesting that peace was impossible. Some of us replied in the positive. Waiting for Grum to get back.

Emergency Appeal for Sinjar and Rojava

Yezidi (Kurd) girl in Sinjar. Note eye and hair colour. She needs a blanket. £5 will do it.

[anonymous-user]

Bill said:

He won't be replying.

While I do not support some of the things that PHer posted I do hope what is preventing them from replying will also be preventing those who have been equally derogatory about Muslims on PH from replying too.
All in the spirit of treating all faiths and all of no faith with equal respect of course.

[Grumfutock]

TheRealFingers99 said:

Where were we?

Grum was suggesting that peace was impossible. Some of us replied in the positive. Waiting for Grum to get back.

Emergency Appeal for Sinjar and Rojava

Yezidi (Kurd) girl in Sinjar. Note eye and hair colour. She needs a blanket. £5 will do it.

No, As I remember I had ask 4 questions and you had evaded answering them.

[TheRealFingers99]

Grumfutock said:

No, As I remember I had ask 4 questions and you had evaded answering them.

I think I pretty much answered them all:

TheRealFingers99 said:

Grumfutock said:

Which bit didn't you answer? Errrrrr ALL OF IT!!!!

Once again then and I will change it to numbers to make it easier for you:

1. Do you honestly think that once that has been done that Hamas, Fatah and the local Arab countries would just give up violence?
2. They will all accept Israel's right to exist?
3. Everyone will just get on?
4. Why?

1. Fatah will be part of the peace process. Hamas will either wilt or (more likely) be zapped. Again, if this is such an extreme worry to Israel, call in the UN from the start. There is no viable external threat. You are no.1 in the ME. Accept it and rejoice! You have the Golan as a buffer zone, and should S.Lebanon pose an issue, Hezbollah will cheerfully take on Nusra and ISIS.

2. Fatah already have, surely? Syria doesn't exist. PYD/YPG/YPJ will accept Israel (and set up an embassy) as soon as Israel allows. FSA are your chums. Iraqi Kurdistan sells you oil. Lebanon already has, I think, as have Egypt and Jordan. The external situation can only be improved by the internal one. Hamas will wilt. Most of this "not recognise Israel's right to exist" stuff is just tired old rhetoric anyway. ISIS and Nusra remain an external threat, but one that everyone in the ME shares, including Fatah, Hamas and Hezbollah. External threats can also unite.

3. I don't see why not. It may be rocky at first, but nutty settlers aside I can't see any reason why it shouldn't immediately be better than it is.

4. ? Not entirely sure what you mean? But as soon as the Palestinians have something to loose (and I think they'd have more to loose in a one state solution, but, hey) why not? Once you stop seeing people as your jailers, you tend to stop hating them.

Now, heval, they're not the answers you want, but I think I've answered all your questions. Maybe Isaac Herzog or Ilan Pappe can fill in any gaps?


Emergency Appeal for Sinjar and Rojava

Does anyone else think I've failed to answer Grumfutock's questions?

Let me pose another: why does a prominent Israeli politician, living in Israel, agree with me?

And another. Why are the surviving heads of Shin Bet peaceniks compared to Grumfutock?

Edited by TheRealFingers99 on Tuesday 16th December 20:07

Edited by TheRealFingers99 on Tuesday 16th December 20:12

[Grumfutock]

TheRealFingers99 said:

Grumfutock said:

No, As I remember I had ask 4 questions and you had evaded answering them.

I think I pretty much answered them all:

TheRealFingers99 said:

Grumfutock said:

Which bit didn't you answer? Errrrrr ALL OF IT!!!!

Once again then and I will change it to numbers to make it easier for you:

1. Do you honestly think that once that has been done that Hamas, Fatah and the local Arab countries would just give up violence?
2. They will all accept Israel's right to exist?
3. Everyone will just get on?
4. Why?

1. Fatah will be part of the peace process. Hamas will either wilt or (more likely) be zapped. Again, if this is such an extreme worry to Israel, call in the UN from the start. There is no viable external threat. You are no.1 in the ME. Accept it and rejoice! You have the Golan as a buffer zone, and should S.Lebanon pose an issue, Hezbollah will cheerfully take on Nusra and ISIS.

2. Fatah already have, surely? Syria doesn't exist. PYD/YPG/YPJ will accept Israel (and set up an embassy) as soon as Israel allows. FSA are your chums. Iraqi Kurdistan sells you oil. Lebanon already has, I think, as have Egypt and Jordan. The external situation can only be improved by the internal one. Hamas will wilt. Most of this "not recognise Israel's right to exist" stuff is just tired old rhetoric anyway. ISIS and Nusra remain an external threat, but one that everyone in the ME shares, including Fatah, Hamas and Hezbollah. External threats can also unite.

3. I don't see why not. It may be rocky at first, but nutty settlers aside I can't see any reason why it shouldn't immediately be better than it is.

4. ? Not entirely sure what you mean? But as soon as the Palestinians have something to loose (and I think they'd have more to loose in a one state solution, but, hey) why not? Once you stop seeing people as your jailers, you tend to stop hating them.

Now, heval, they're not the answers you want, but I think I've answered all your questions. Maybe Isaac Herzog or Ilan Pappe can fill in any gaps?


Emergency Appeal for Sinjar and Rojava

1. Is that a yes they will give up violence or no they wont? You don't answer it!
2. So will Hamas or not? Iran? Fatah have made no such commitment and senior members continue to call for a Palestine "from the river to the sea." What of Hezbollah? You see that bit is can of important!
3. OK you answered that one.
4. Well sort of an answer but no really backed up with much.

Edited by Grumfutock on Tuesday 16th December 20:16

[TheRealFingers99]

Grumfutock said:

1. Is that a yes they will give up violence or no they wont? You don't answer it!
2. So will Hamas or not? Iran? Fatah have made no such commitment and senior members continue to call for a Palestine "from the river to the sea." What of Hezbollah? You see that bit is can of important!
3. OK you answered that one.
4. Well sort of an answer but no really backed up with much.

Edited by Grumfutock on Tuesday 16th December 20:16

1. Yes. Fatah by the very act of signing the process. Hamas would be screwed, either by failing support, zapping by Fatah, or as I suggest, a UN force in the WB and Gaza in the interim.

2. Have you not noticed what a pickle Hezbollah are in at the moment? To the extent that Hezbollah pose a threat, it's not going to change for the worse through a peace settlement. An internal peace makes Iran's position weaker, not stronger! They have no effective air force, have been well fubared by sanctions and are very busy in Iraq.

4. With a UN peacekeeping force inside Gaza and the West Bank (effectively 2 sets of borders) the threat diminishes, rather than increases. Be good to the Druze and the rest of the Arab Israelis (God only knows, they deserve it) and they'll prove to be a useful resource both on the Golan and generally (the Druze outperform Israeli Jews in general education).

The main threat I see is the settlers. Racist nutjobs!

[Grumfutock]

TheRealFingers99 said:

4. With a UN peacekeeping force inside Gaza and the West Bank (effectively 2 sets of borders) the threat diminishes, rather than increases. Be good to the Druze and the rest of the Arab Israelis (God only knows, they deserve it) and they'll prove to be a useful resource both on the Golan and generally (the Druze outperform Israeli Jews in general education).

The main threat I see is the settlers. Racist nutjobs!

So you want UN troops in Palestine! Yea because last time they put troops in that part of the world it ended well didn't it! Never going to happen.

[franki68]

TheRealFingers99 said:

1. Yes. Fatah by the very act of signing the process. Hamas would be screwed, either by failing support, zapping by Fatah, or as I suggest, a UN force in the WB and Gaza in the interim.

2. Have you not noticed what a pickle Hezbollah are in at the moment? To the extent that Hezbollah pose a threat, it's not going to change for the worse through a peace settlement. An internal peace makes Iran's position weaker, not stronger! They have no effective air force, have been well fubared by sanctions and are very busy in Iraq.

4. With a UN peacekeeping force inside Gaza and the West Bank (effectively 2 sets of borders) the threat diminishes, rather than increases. Be good to the Druze and the rest of the Arab Israelis (God only knows, they deserve it) and they'll prove to be a useful resource both on the Golan and generally (the Druze outperform Israeli Jews in general education).

The main threat I see is the settlers. Racist nutjobs!

You cannot seriously suggest the UN as a peace keeping force ? Do you have no idea how they behaved/performed when they last had that role in that area? One of the most corrupt organizations around .I knew many UN officers and they were quite open about how they behaved,they took bribes to turn a blind eye to the weapon smuggling and everything else .

[Grumfutock]

franki68 said:

You cannot seriously suggest the UN as a peace keeping force ? Do you have no idea how they behaved/performed when they last had that role in that area? One of the most corrupt organizations around .I knew many UN officers and they were quite open about how they behaved,they took bribes to turn a blind eye to the weapon smuggling and everything else .

I have served in and worked for the UN. A toothless waste of money as a military force! A good charity but that's where it ends.

[anonymous-user]

franki68 said:

...... .I knew many UN officers and they were quite open about how they behaved,they took bribes to turn a blind eye to the weapon smuggling and everything else .

Yeah, sure you did.

[Grumfutock]

And another dumb and short sighted decision by the liberal tree huggers!


http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-305115...