Discussion
TheRealFingers99 said:
Rather OTT response, don't you think? 
Still waiting for your DNA "research" sources, BTW........
But:
However, a better analogy would be the French resistance attacking Germany during WW2. Both in terms of the likely outcome, and the status of the parties involved.
I notice that you resort to the "troll" jibe (an alternative to the argument by meme) whenever you're made to look like a Grade A buffoon. Did that work in the Army?
Still avoiding it I see. So again I ask: If a foreign power fired a rocket at a city in the UK your honest reply would be to ignore it? REALLY?Still waiting for your DNA "research" sources, BTW........
But:
Grumfutock said:
The France comparison remains extant because that is still a valid comparison isn't it? IF a nation fired a missile or rocket at Britain what would our response be? So still valid then muppet!
I think I answered you. Our response would not be to blow up a housing estate in Paris. However, a better analogy would be the French resistance attacking Germany during WW2. Both in terms of the likely outcome, and the status of the parties involved.
I notice that you resort to the "troll" jibe (an alternative to the argument by meme) whenever you're made to look like a Grade A buffoon. Did that work in the Army?
Edited by TheRealFingers99 on Saturday 20th December 21:03
Edited by TheRealFingers99 on Saturday 20th December 21:08
What has a foreign power to do with Hamas?
It's a disturbingly inept analogy.
As I say, a much better analogy would be an attack by the French Resistance on Nazi Germany. (Occupying power attacked by occupied.)
I know what the Nazis would do. Oh, wait, Israel's response wouldn't be that different!
Emergency Appeal for Sinjar and Rojava
It's a disturbingly inept analogy.
As I say, a much better analogy would be an attack by the French Resistance on Nazi Germany. (Occupying power attacked by occupied.)
I know what the Nazis would do. Oh, wait, Israel's response wouldn't be that different!
Emergency Appeal for Sinjar and Rojava
TheRealFingers99 said:
What has a foreign power to do with Hamas?
It's a disturbingly inept analogy.
OK lets make this simple for you then:It's a disturbingly inept analogy.
Are Hamas Israeli? No? So that makes them FOREIGN!
Did they fire a rocket? Yes? So they are a POWER then!
I really fail to understand why you are struggling with this. How the elected representatives of a group that you claim to be the rightful owners of Palestine, a people who are seeking recognition from the UN as a nation, might not be a foreign power. Or are you just being your usual argumentative idiotic self?
Oh and yes I have ignored the stupid attempt to compare Israel with Nazism, as it is a cheap shot that all Arabs who still deny the holocaust like to make. Silly, irrelevant and somewhat crass. Certainly in very poor taste/border line reportable.
Grumfutock said:
OK lets make this simple for you then:
Are Hamas Israeli? No? So that makes them FOREIGN!
Did they fire a rocket? Yes? So they are a POWER then!
I really fail to understand why you are struggling with this. How the elected representatives of a group that you claim to be the rightful owners of Palestine, a people who are seeking recognition from the UN as a nation, might not be a foreign power. Or are you just being your usual argumentative idiotic self?
Oh and yes I have ignored the stupid attempt to compare Israel with Nazism, as it is a cheap shot that all Arabs who still deny the holocaust like to make. Silly, irrelevant and somewhat crass. Certainly in very poor taste/border line reportable.
If you want to make such an analogy using such a simple thought process, I take it you are ok with the Taliban/AQ trying to attack the USA? (After all the USA - being a FOREIGN power - has attacked the Taliban/AQ in the past - doesn't matter who is right or who started it) and it's only right that Taliban/AQ retaliate. You see your analogy would fall apart here as I'm sure you will agree that AQ are not right in furthering attacking the USA/West.Are Hamas Israeli? No? So that makes them FOREIGN!
Did they fire a rocket? Yes? So they are a POWER then!
I really fail to understand why you are struggling with this. How the elected representatives of a group that you claim to be the rightful owners of Palestine, a people who are seeking recognition from the UN as a nation, might not be a foreign power. Or are you just being your usual argumentative idiotic self?
Oh and yes I have ignored the stupid attempt to compare Israel with Nazism, as it is a cheap shot that all Arabs who still deny the holocaust like to make. Silly, irrelevant and somewhat crass. Certainly in very poor taste/border line reportable.
Throughout this topic you have showed a clear lack of understanding for the concept of context. Now if you want to muddy the waters with such a simple and flawed analogy - fair enough, but don't expect others to fall for it because you should the loudest. If you **swap over the terms "Israel" and "Palestine" in your analogy; it still holds. You are basically saying that as (Israel/Palestine) is a foreign power then if it has a rocket fired at it by another foreign power (Palestine or Israel) then it has the right to retaliate. How on Earth does this move the discussion forward? Your analogy is one that both sides can use!
Unless of course you are saying "only Israel" should be allowed to retaliate, but Palestinians should not be allowed to...
- I'm sure you'll now say that you didn't use the terms Israel and Palestine in your terminology, but rather the UK and France. Swap them around then.
You don't like the Nazi analogy. You forget (how very quaint of you!) that it was made by Shin Bet's favourite son, Avram Shalom.
"On the other hand, it's a brutal occupation force, similar to the Germans in World War ll. Similar, not identical. And I'm not talking about their behaviour toward the Jews. That was exceptional, with its own particular characteristics. I mean how they acted to the Poles, the Belgians, the Dutch... To all of them... The Czechs. It's a very negative trait that we acquired, to be... I'm afraid to say it, so I won't. We've become cruel,to ourselves as well, but mainly to the occupied population, using the excuse of the war against terror."
The French Resistance, as you know very, very, well, had faff all to do with the Shoah or the Parajmos. It was all to do with the occupation of French soil.
If there's a denier on here, it's you: denier of the Nakba.
As I've said: if a French terrorist group attacked Dover, we'd not launch an attack on Paris (and certainly not on a heavily populated area), we'd ask the French to sort it out.
"On the other hand, it's a brutal occupation force, similar to the Germans in World War ll. Similar, not identical. And I'm not talking about their behaviour toward the Jews. That was exceptional, with its own particular characteristics. I mean how they acted to the Poles, the Belgians, the Dutch... To all of them... The Czechs. It's a very negative trait that we acquired, to be... I'm afraid to say it, so I won't. We've become cruel,to ourselves as well, but mainly to the occupied population, using the excuse of the war against terror."
The French Resistance, as you know very, very, well, had faff all to do with the Shoah or the Parajmos. It was all to do with the occupation of French soil.
If there's a denier on here, it's you: denier of the Nakba.
As I've said: if a French terrorist group attacked Dover, we'd not launch an attack on Paris (and certainly not on a heavily populated area), we'd ask the French to sort it out.
Except of course in that analogy, France isn't being run by a group of murderous terrorists who's main aim is to wipe your country off the face of the map. So we wouldn't ask them "to sort it out" because that would be a moronic, weak and pointless response that would just provoke further attacks. We'd act to defend ourselves and our civilians in whatever way necessary. Though I know how it grieves you that Israel does just that.
zuby84 said:
Grumfutock said:
OK lets make this simple for you then:
Are Hamas Israeli? No? So that makes them FOREIGN!
Did they fire a rocket? Yes? So they are a POWER then!
I really fail to understand why you are struggling with this. How the elected representatives of a group that you claim to be the rightful owners of Palestine, a people who are seeking recognition from the UN as a nation, might not be a foreign power. Or are you just being your usual argumentative idiotic self?
Oh and yes I have ignored the stupid attempt to compare Israel with Nazism, as it is a cheap shot that all Arabs who still deny the holocaust like to make. Silly, irrelevant and somewhat crass. Certainly in very poor taste/border line reportable.
If you want to make such an analogy using such a simple thought process, I take it you are ok with the Taliban/AQ trying to attack the USA? (After all the USA - being a FOREIGN power - has attacked the Taliban/AQ in the past - doesn't matter who is right or who started it) and it's only right that Taliban/AQ retaliate. You see your analogy would fall apart here as I'm sure you will agree that AQ are not right in furthering attacking the USA/West.Are Hamas Israeli? No? So that makes them FOREIGN!
Did they fire a rocket? Yes? So they are a POWER then!
I really fail to understand why you are struggling with this. How the elected representatives of a group that you claim to be the rightful owners of Palestine, a people who are seeking recognition from the UN as a nation, might not be a foreign power. Or are you just being your usual argumentative idiotic self?
Oh and yes I have ignored the stupid attempt to compare Israel with Nazism, as it is a cheap shot that all Arabs who still deny the holocaust like to make. Silly, irrelevant and somewhat crass. Certainly in very poor taste/border line reportable.
Throughout this topic you have showed a clear lack of understanding for the concept of context. Now if you want to muddy the waters with such a simple and flawed analogy - fair enough, but don't expect others to fall for it because you should the loudest. If you **swap over the terms "Israel" and "Palestine" in your analogy; it still holds. You are basically saying that as (Israel/Palestine) is a foreign power then if it has a rocket fired at it by another foreign power (Palestine or Israel) then it has the right to retaliate. How on Earth does this move the discussion forward? Your analogy is one that both sides can use!
Unless of course you are saying "only Israel" should be allowed to retaliate, but Palestinians should not be allowed to...
- I'm sure you'll now say that you didn't use the terms Israel and Palestine in your terminology, but rather the UK and France. Swap them around then.
TheRealFingers99 said:
You don't like the Nazi analogy. You forget (how very quaint of you!) that it was made by Shin Bet's favourite son, Avram Shalom.
"On the other hand, it's a brutal occupation force, similar to the Germans in World War ll. Similar, not identical. And I'm not talking about their behaviour toward the Jews. That was exceptional, with its own particular characteristics. I mean how they acted to the Poles, the Belgians, the Dutch... To all of them... The Czechs. It's a very negative trait that we acquired, to be... I'm afraid to say it, so I won't. We've become cruel,to ourselves as well, but mainly to the occupied population, using the excuse of the war against terror."
The French Resistance, as you know very, very, well, had faff all to do with the Shoah or the Parajmos. It was all to do with the occupation of French soil.
If there's a denier on here, it's you: denier of the Nakba.
As I've said: if a French terrorist group attacked Dover, we'd not launch an attack on Paris (and certainly not on a heavily populated area), we'd ask the French to sort it out.
So is that yes Hamas are a foreign power or no Hamas are not a foreign power?"On the other hand, it's a brutal occupation force, similar to the Germans in World War ll. Similar, not identical. And I'm not talking about their behaviour toward the Jews. That was exceptional, with its own particular characteristics. I mean how they acted to the Poles, the Belgians, the Dutch... To all of them... The Czechs. It's a very negative trait that we acquired, to be... I'm afraid to say it, so I won't. We've become cruel,to ourselves as well, but mainly to the occupied population, using the excuse of the war against terror."
The French Resistance, as you know very, very, well, had faff all to do with the Shoah or the Parajmos. It was all to do with the occupation of French soil.
If there's a denier on here, it's you: denier of the Nakba.
As I've said: if a French terrorist group attacked Dover, we'd not launch an attack on Paris (and certainly not on a heavily populated area), we'd ask the French to sort it out.
Very simple really!
easytiger123 said:
Except of course in that analogy, France isn't being run by a group of murderous terrorists who's main aim is to wipe your country off the face of the map. So we wouldn't ask them "to sort it out" because that would be a moronic, weak and pointless response that would just provoke further attacks. We'd act to defend ourselves and our civilians in whatever way necessary. Though I know how it grieves you that Israel does just that.
You talking about Palestine or Israel here?easytiger123 said:
Except of course in that analogy, France isn't being run by a group of murderous terrorists who's main aim is to wipe your country off the face of the map. So we wouldn't ask them "to sort it out" because that would be a moronic, weak and pointless response that would just provoke further attacks. We'd act to defend ourselves and our civilians in whatever way necessary. Though I know how it grieves you that Israel does just that.
Is Gaza run entirely by Hamas? I think not. You could equally argue that, historically, the Zionist mission has been to remove all Palestinians (by any means possible) from the "Holy Land".
The attack on Dover was a daft analogy. Even the muppets of Mosad couldn't come up with anything so cretinous.
TheRealFingers99 said:
Is Gaza run entirely by Hamas? I think not.
You could equally argue that, historically, the Zionist mission has been to remove all Palestinians (by any means possible) from the "Holy Land".
The attack on Dover was a daft analogy. Even the muppets of Mosad couldn't come up with anything so cretinous.
Really? So who is in charge then? Who are the elected party?You could equally argue that, historically, the Zionist mission has been to remove all Palestinians (by any means possible) from the "Holy Land".
The attack on Dover was a daft analogy. Even the muppets of Mosad couldn't come up with anything so cretinous.
And once again for the terminally dim, Zionist is not Jewish. Are all Muslims terrorists?
The Dover example was purely to highlight the stupidity of your "Israel should ignore the rockets" statement. As in would England ignore a French attack.
Grumfutock said:
So is that yes Hamas are a foreign power or no Hamas are not a foreign power?
Very simple really!
Only if your mind is! Both are foreign to each other. Israel is a power (in the sense of an occupying power, a nation state), Hamas is not. At this point your analogy falls flat on its arse. Very simple really!
TheRealFingers99 said:
Grumfutock said:
So is that yes Hamas are a foreign power or no Hamas are not a foreign power?
Very simple really!
Only if your mind is! Both are foreign to each other. Israel is a power (in the sense of an occupying power, a nation state), Hamas is not. At this point your analogy falls flat on its arse. Very simple really!
2. They are not seeking world recognition as a nation then?
3. Are there Israeli military forces occupying Gaza?
You see as usual, fake finger, you twist reality habibi.
zuby84 said:
easytiger123 said:
Except of course in that analogy, France isn't being run by a group of murderous terrorists who's main aim is to wipe your country off the face of the map. So we wouldn't ask them "to sort it out" because that would be a moronic, weak and pointless response that would just provoke further attacks. We'd act to defend ourselves and our civilians in whatever way necessary. Though I know how it grieves you that Israel does just that.
You talking about Palestine or Israel here?Grumfutock said:
1. So Hamas are not an elected body then?
2. They are not seeking world recognition as a nation then?
3. Are there Israeli military forces occupying Gaza?
You see as usual, fake finger, you twist reality habibi.
I twist reality? 2. They are not seeking world recognition as a nation then?
3. Are there Israeli military forces occupying Gaza?
You see as usual, fake finger, you twist reality habibi.
1. Hamas are an elected party.
2. Palestine, under FATAH, are requesting recognition as a nation.
3. Israel are occupying parts of that nation.
Seems a lot of fuss to make about a small rocket making a small hole in someone's potato patch, Julie,
especially after the mess Israel made of Lebanon's coastline. http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-eas... UN bias! Not fair! Poor little Israel (sob, sob).
If, perchance, your real question (and I know you have issues with reality, with time scales, and etc.) is what would happen if someone attacked Israel from Gaza after a settlement, I think both history and my post about three pages back give you an answer.
TheRealFingers99 said:
Grumfutock said:
1. So Hamas are not an elected body then?
2. They are not seeking world recognition as a nation then?
3. Are there Israeli military forces occupying Gaza?
You see as usual, fake finger, you twist reality habibi.
I twist reality? 2. They are not seeking world recognition as a nation then?
3. Are there Israeli military forces occupying Gaza?
You see as usual, fake finger, you twist reality habibi.
1. Hamas are an elected party.
2. Palestine, under FATAH, are requesting recognition as a nation.
3. Israel are occupying parts of that nation.
Seems a lot of fuss to make about a small rocket making a small hole in someone's potato patch, Julie,
especially after the mess Israel made of Lebanon's coastline. http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-eas... UN bias! Not fair! Poor little Israel (sob, sob).
If, perchance, your real question (and I know you have issues with reality, with time scales, and etc.) is what would happen if someone attacked Israel from Gaza after a settlement, I think both history and my post about three pages back give you an answer.
Again I ask the question: What else could Israel do when a rocket is fired, in direct breech of the cease fire agreement, but fire back?
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