London = Awesome / Rest of UK = Rubbish... Discuss...

[Vocal Minority]

fair point, well made

[okgo]

Vocal Minority said:

fair point, well made

Its also the home of fashion in this country, and models have to be where the work is.

[Mosdef]

lukefreeman said:

You got me, I have rubbish cars, so apologise.

Granted Derby's not made either list, however London seeems to be a really happy place.

clicky

Funny, my g/f got offered a place in London office, and I could've moved to a Consultancy firm. We talked, and both said our quality of life would completely vanish. Swap a nice house and garden and cars, for a rented flat in London? Nahhhhhhhhhhhhhh

Go round some of London's nicer areas (admittedly it says West London in the survey but I think it really means zones, 3,4 etc as opposed to Notting Hill, Kensington, South Ken etc) and people seem very happy, what's more they have some pretty good cars. A decent 'consulting' job would possibly let you have a great lifestyle and offer strong career prospects but if you're not ambitious and willing to compromise on life quality when you're young, London is probably not for you.

[lamboman100]

Outer London now getting a £200bn orbital railway encircling the entire capital from east to west and north to south:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2711686/Pl...

[Fittster]

lamboman100 said:

Outer London now getting a £200bn orbital railway encircling the entire capital from east to west and north to south:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2711686/Pl...

A Boris has the funding for this (just like his airport)?

[NightDriver]

I like London as a place to visit and to work a couple of days a week, but couldn't live in the place any more. Early 20s I loved it, but now the things that I thought were cool to start with just annoy me.

I work with a lot of 'creative' company's and the bulls**t they come up with to try and outdo each other.... started off a few years back with foosball/table tennis in the middle of the office, then for some god-forsaken reason the chairs were removed from the canteen (sorry, chill out zone) as apparently standing is cooler, now there's no meeting rooms instead there's a pile of bean bags in each corner of the main office... By comparison, a company I work with doing identical things but based in the Surrey Hills has a lovely landscaped garden out the back, a nice local pub next door and a lovely village high street just around the corner. Oh, and I can turn up without having to have gone anywhere near a sweaty train! They've even got real chairs! And funnily enough the best, most innovative work comes out the place in Surrey. I find a lot of the 'cooler' companies central London offices have disappeared so far up there own arses there starting to see daylight again.

But I guess London is a lot of different things to a lot of different people. Originally to me it was freedom and excitement, these days it's just hassle and inconvenience. But that's because of what I do when I'm there. I'm sure many millions disagree and see London for all the positives it has to offer, which it undoubtedly does.

London is definitely not the only place to be successful though. With drive and ambition you can make a career/business for yourself anywhere in this country, people who think you have to go to London to do so are either incredibly naive or just arrogant about the place.

[Thankyou4calling]

Hackney said:

Not sure its been answered but I'll do it anyway. The 51,000 premature deaths figure is absolute baloney, there is no way to measure whether a death is premature or not. There is no way to know when someone should die so how do you figure out if their actual death is premature or not. So the whole question is redundant.
No-one's arguing that there is no pollution but allocating a number of deaths to it is impossible and what Boris has done is pointless.... unless you want to raise money on the back of it.

Absolutely correct. Rather like when people say "Ohh 5 minutes more and he would've died " or "He was saved from certain death" the thing about death and it cannot be disputed, is that nobody knows when someone is going to die, it's not like a TV programme with a published end time. People are certain to die, and yet they miraculously live, others will go on of years, then next thing they've popped their clogs.

[Bill]

There's a difference between "not easy" and "not possible".

The better way to rubbish the 51,000 deaths due to pollution in London figure is to point out that would be more than 10% of the total annual deaths for the whole of England and Wales...

[turbobloke]

Bill said:

There's a difference between "not easy" and "not possible".

How many grains of sand are there on Cleethorpes beach?

At any one time, there is a number. It's so 'not easy' to obtain the precise number at any one time that it's impossible.

Bill said:

The better way to rubbish the 51,000 deaths due to pollution in London figure is to point out that would be more than 10% of the total annual deaths for the whole of England and Wales...

Given that these types of report are repeatedly cited, it does remain important to show that the numbers they come up with are nonsense, and why, by dissecting and dismantling the approach used.

The methodology used in reports such as those quoted by The Independent and then parroted by Boris et al is so extremely weak (that's being kind) it cannot do what's claimed, it's rubbish any which way you look at it.

[Bill]

turbobloke said:

How many grains of sand are there on Cleethorpes beach?

At any one time, there is a number. It's so 'not easy' to obtain the precise number at any one time that it's impossible.

A precise number? No. But a range is possible. Discounting all population studies because some are rubbish does a disservice to plenty of good science.

[kingston12]

Fittster said:

lamboman100 said:

Outer London now getting a £200bn orbital railway encircling the entire capital from east to west and north to south:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2711686/Pl...

A Boris has the funding for this (just like his airport)?

I very much doubt it!

I think it would be a good idea if they really do want to get business working in the suburbs. Living in zone 6, I can only really look at jobs in the centre of London or in a very small area locally.

For me that is fine, as I prefer to work in the centre, but I am sure a lot of people would be happy working more locally.

Sutton is probably half the distance from where I live that the City is, but I reckon it would take me twice as long to get there (either driving or going into central London and back out again on the train.)

Edited by kingston12 on Friday 1st August 11:47

[turbobloke]

Bill said:

turbobloke said:

How many grains of sand are there on Cleethorpes beach?

At any one time, there is a number. It's so 'not easy' to obtain the precise number at any one time that it's impossible.

A precise number? No. But a range is possible. Discounting all population studies because some are rubbish does a disservice to plenty of good science.

Nobody has discounted 'all' in an absolute sense just 'all that have been seen and read so far' in which there is a distinct lack of good science.

If you can find a similar study with robust methodology please post a link. In tens of years of looking at this issue I haven't been able to find one, but you may succeed.

[fido]

kingston12 said:

Sutton is probably half the distance from where I live that the City is, but I reckon it would take me twice as long to get there (either driving or going into central London and back out again on the train.

A240 is a headache - it's practically chav highway hell. Brings back memories though - reminds me why I moved to Merton (great bus links to everywhere). Actually, back to topic, I propose a new definition of 'London' - Q. If you get stuck in a traffic jam could you just get out of your car and onto public transport?

Edited by fido on Friday 1st August 11:34

[SPS]

duckers26 said:

Rome is fine if you want to be in bed by 11pm and you only want pasta to eat. Once you get over the history thought it was very dull and "local"

Do you mean Rome Georgia USA?????
Remember - when in Rome (Italia) do as they do, the city has pace, style, culture, great shopping, food, wine women and - well you should get the picture by now.
I have been to a number of venues that stayed open until the small hours and the music, food, company was bella!!!!
You obviously don't know much about Italian food or just maybe had too much Chianti lol!

[kingston12]

fido said:

kingston12 said:

Sutton is probably half the distance from where I live that the City is, but I reckon it would take me twice as long to get there (either driving or going into central London and back out again on the train.

A240 is a headache - it's practically chav highway hell. Brings back memories though - reminds me why I moved to Merton (great bus links to everywhere).

Edited by fido on Friday 1st August 11:34

The thing is that all major roads in and around London are a nightmare. When I get on a train at Surbiton in the morning, we pass under a bridge that takes the road over the tracks just before Clapham Junction station.

We get there less than 10 minutes after pulling out of Surbiton station. If I tried to drive there at 8.30am, it would probably take over an hour. Even if when I drive there late at night, it is 25 minutes.

Driving in and around London doesn't make sense and that is why I am in favour of any investment that is made in public transport infrastructure. I don't think that they are always as well though out as they could be (Crossrail 2), but if they enable me to get to more parts of London more easily without using my car, then I still support them.

[fido]

kingston12 said:

Driving in and around London doesn't make sense and that is why I am in favour of any investment that is made in public transport infrastructure. I don't think that they are always as well though out as they could be (Crossrail 2), but if they enable me to get to more parts of London more easily without using my car, then I still support them.

Any you can do it - if you live near enough. Despite the never-ending fare increases - it's amazing how far the transport system has evolved - Zone 4 is practically 24/7. I used to drive into London from Kingston and dump my Nissan Sh8tbox as soon as I hit a traffic jam, usually somewhere around Battersea (that was a few years ago). Now I live in Zone 3/4 there is a permanent traffic jam but absolutely no need for a car.

[kingston12]

fido said:

Any you can do it - if you live near enough. Despite the never-ending fare increases - it's amazing how far the transport system has evolved - Zone 4 is practically 24/7. I used to drive into London from Kingston and dump my Nissan Sh8tbox as soon as I hit a traffic jam, usually somewhere around Battersea (that was a few years ago). Now I live in Zone 3/4 there is a permanent traffic jam but absolutely no need for a car.

Indeed, but car travel has gone backwards. I doubt you'd get far past Kingston Hill before hitting a jam these days, and even then there would be nowhere to dump the car any more that wasn't a red route or residents parking etc.

Zone 6 transport isn't as good as a bit further in, but still good enough that I never need to use my car. It gets a bit of a run out from time to time, but that is just for a nice drive and is usually further out of London than further in. Essentially just a (nice) waste of money!

[Hackney]

Timing of public transport really does depend on where you live. Surbiton to Waterloo is excellent by fast train (used to live between Surbiton and Kingston and always walked to Surbiton for the train)

However where I live in N1 to where I work in SW11 takes the following...

Car - minimum 40 minutes. Usual (peak) time, 1 hour.
Alternatives on public transport, of which there are many and I realise I'm lucky to have such choice.

Walk / Tube / Train / Walk - an hour
Walk / Overland / Walk - an hour
Bus / Train / Walk - an hour

If it was significantly quicker or more convenient I'd use public transport more.
I'd still need to use the car as I regularly have to transport stuff which would be too difficult to carry / ride the bike with

[kingston12]

Hackney said:

Timing of public transport really does depend on where you live. Surbiton to Waterloo is excellent by fast train (used to live between Surbiton and Kingston and always walked to Surbiton for the train)

However where I live in N1 to where I work in SW11 takes the following...

Car - minimum 40 minutes. Usual (peak) time, 1 hour.
Alternatives on public transport, of which there are many and I realise I'm lucky to have such choice.

Walk / Tube / Train / Walk - an hour
Walk / Overland / Walk - an hour
Bus / Train / Walk - an hour

If it was significantly quicker or more convenient I'd use public transport more.
I'd still need to use the car as I regularly have to transport stuff which would be too difficult to carry / ride the bike with

When it is working, the Surbiton to Waterloo service is excellent, when it is not you begin to remember just how many miles the journey really is! The problem is that there is just no alternative to SWT. If they are not running you are either faced with a 2 hour commute or working from home that day.

It is interesting that commuting within London can actually be better by car, but I guess it is fine if you know the right routes. I am still scarred by the memory of the last time I drove into work. It was fine on the way in (about an hour as I went in late), but I was meeting someone in Mayfair after work. At 6pm, 3 miles took almost 2 hours!

That was obviously unlucky, but I still often see the Embankment solid from Blackfriars to Charing Cross on a weeknight and wonder how long that must take.

[FiF]

This is part of the problem, theoretical vs realistic journey times.

One London journey I know, in theory it's possible to get to the offices in 55 minutes. When the first three trains go through bang full with no possibility of getting near to finding any space that theory goes straight out of the window.

On the other hand hillbilly land in Worcestershire, a regular 5 mile journey from home, 10 minutes is possible. 15 minutes if I go round the lanes the long way and have a quick look at the river. When the tourists are in, on a good day takes 10 minutes to do the first half mile, on a bank holiday you just don't go out by choice.