Malaysian Airlines 777 down on Ukraine / Russia Border?

[Nikolai Petroff]

AreOut said:

Yanukovich was also democratically elected.

With massive voter fraud.

[scherzkeks]

Transmitter Man said:

I thought I was asking too much to expect a direct answer to a direct question anyways.

Nice diversion Sherks.

Phil

Ask a relevant question Phil.

Scherzkeks

[AreOut]

Nikolai Petroff said:

US shot down the Iranian airliner by mistake and it was a ship full of radars and operators. Russian army soldiers are not some supermen with 100% situational awareness etc. The know how to operate the BUK sistem and that's it. They saw a contact and were impatient to shoot it down and get a medal. Simple as that.

maybe, but out of thousands of rebels there certainly are few who served in SAM division in ukrainian army(that also uses BUK), why importing soldiers from Russia then and risking them getting caught?

[skyrover]

The same reason thousands of Russian soldiers have been serving across the Donbas?

Because there is not enough separatist fighters?

Because they are incompetent?

[AreOut]

I doubt there are regular russian soldiers there except special units, and you might be right about the number (maybe several thousand if so)

[Blaster72]

AreOut said:

I doubt there are regular russian soldiers there except special units, and you might be right about the number (maybe several thousand if so)

I don't know as I'm not there but reading various reports and watching various documentaries it seems there are a large number of Russian soldiers there, many of them have died.

http://america.aljazeera.com/articles/2015/5/12/ne...

I haven't really seen anything to suggest that they aren't there in some numbers.

[Nikolai Petroff]

AreOut said:

maybe, but out of thousands of rebels there certainly are few who served in SAM division in ukrainian army(that also uses BUK), why importing soldiers from Russia then and risking them getting caught?

Most of the rebels are rubble. Local alchis and freaks. The only battle worthy units are the ones with Russian volunteers or the Russian regular army units.

[EskimoArapaho]

AreOut said:

I doubt there are regular russian soldiers there except special units, and you might be right about the number (maybe several thousand if so)

Really? See here: https://news.vice.com/video/selfie-soldiers-russia...

[Cobnapint]

AreOut said:

I doubt there are regular russian soldiers there....

Do you work for RT or something. And are you nuts..?

[Mojocvh]

Cobnapint said:

AreOut said:

I doubt there are regular russian soldiers there....

Do you work for RT or something. And are you nuts..?

[Cobnapint]

Mojocvh said:

Cobnapint said:

AreOut said:

I doubt there are regular russian soldiers there....

Do you work for RT or something. And are you nuts..?

[AreOut]

only freaks and alcoholics? I wouldn't say so...

Blaster72 said:

I don't know as I'm not there but reading various reports and watching various documentaries it seems there are a large number of Russian soldiers there, many of them have died.

http://america.aljazeera.com/articles/2015/5/12/ne...

I haven't really seen anything to suggest that they aren't there in some numbers.

well several thousand IS a large number for this type of local conflict

[skyrover]

The Dutch Security Council has announced that the final report on the cause of the Malaysian Airlines flight MH 17 disaster in July 2014 will be presented on October 13th.

[vonuber]

Seems to be confirmed it was a missile:

http://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2015/oct/13/...

And one which is made in Russia, and generally operated by Russian armed forces.

Not surprising in the least I think.

[FourWheelDrift]

The Buk missile making (Russian government owned) company has released a press statement and video showing what their current missiles would do to a passenger jet showing a different style of damage, suggesting that the missile that did the damage was an older model and not one currently used by the Russian military.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8DmraSOdTYk

I don't think the truth will ever come out, too many arses to protect.

[AreOut]

rebels have confiscated couple of inoperative BUKs from ukrainian army, quite possible that russian military mechanics came from Russia to fix them and eventually install couple of new parts

[Puggit]

AreOut said:

rebels have confiscated couple of inoperative BUKs from ukrainian army, quite possible that russian military mechanics came from Russia to fix them and eventually install couple of new parts

Wasn't there video of BUKs crossing the border from Russia? I doubt the rebels had to recycle old Ukrainian ones.

[red_slr]

Sad but fascinating at the same time. How they can fly something so fast at something else flying quite fast and get it to explode so close.

[London424]

red_slr said:

Sad but fascinating at the same time. How they can fly something so fast at something else flying quite fast and get it to explode so close.

[Scuffers]

FourWheelDrift said:

The Buk missile making (Russian government owned) company has released a press statement and video showing what their current missiles would do to a passenger jet showing a different style of damage, suggesting that the missile that did the damage was an older model and not one currently used by the Russian military.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8DmraSOdTYk

I don't think the truth will ever come out, too many arses to protect.

what a joke, like they don't have any 'older' ones in their stockpile.

as an un-trained eye, damage looks pretty dam similar to me, (although the position of the warheads somewhat off compared to the actual plane)