B.O.E. gets tougher on bankers

[legzr1]

mug81 said:

Are you being sarcastic with this comment..?.

Have a guess.

You have a 50/50 chance (which is better odds than most of the big banks had come bail out time).

[anonymous-user]

DeltonaS said:

It seems to me that this thread is about carpentry or beer making.......

If you know what a barrel looks like then you know more about both of those than you financial markets.

[Randy Winkman]

legzr1 said:

turbobloke said:

As long as it doesn't do harm anywhere, boosting other sectors is fine if it works well as intended.

Making the finance sector take a hit as part of the unthinking scapegoating exercise begun by Incapability Brown would be stupid.

We'll need to await the next Labour government, hopefully no time soon, to get back to really stupid economics.

So, in summary, you agree it's a good thing to move away from over-reliance on the banking sector as long as you can add yet another barbed, anti-Labour quip?

Tell me, did a Labour councillor rape your Labrador or something?

It's the usual emotive hype that he tells other people off for coming out with.

[toppstuff]

Randy Winkman said:

legzr1 said:

turbobloke said:

As long as it doesn't do harm anywhere, boosting other sectors is fine if it works well as intended.

Making the finance sector take a hit as part of the unthinking scapegoating exercise begun by Incapability Brown would be stupid.

We'll need to await the next Labour government, hopefully no time soon, to get back to really stupid economics.

So, in summary, you agree it's a good thing to move away from over-reliance on the banking sector as long as you can add yet another barbed, anti-Labour quip?

Tell me, did a Labour councillor rape your Labrador or something?

It's the usual emotive hype that he tells other people off for coming out with.

The woeful performance of labour over more than a decade when it comes to the economy and regulation is clear and demonstrable, not emotive hype. This mess was created on labours watch and through their policies.

Labour deserve all the contempt possible and more.

I simply refuse to listen to anything Labour have to say while anyone from the previous government remains in the labour shadow cabinet. A pox on all their houses.

[turbobloke]

Randy Winkman said:

It's the usual emotive hype that he tells other people off for coming out with.

Emotive hype - where? You must be referring to the type of PHer who baselessly uses the term 'social cleansing'.

Labour's incompetence and disastrous performance over the last 50 years is a matter of record, it's emotive in the sense that it could have been avoided but people were foolish enough to vote Labour on the basis of emotion rather than reason.

Banker scapegoating is another manifestation of the same emotive but empty vessels making lots of noise.

[crankedup]

otolith said:

crankedup said:

otolith said:

We need to diversify our business to spread our risk - great, let's start by sabotaging the successful part of it...

Those naughty boys and girls within the finance industry have only themselves to blame. How can any Government fail to act upon the revelations of wrongdoing other than to crackdown with regulation and policy changes. It was always going to happen and likely plenty more in the pipeline.

I don't care whether they have themselves, the regulators or Gordon Brown himself to blame. Making policy which impacts negatively on this country's economy is stupid. People should look at a big bonus and think "great, the tax man has had 45% of that, that's a bit less tax needed from me" instead of "rich bd, I'd drive him to the airport". Just moronic.

Its was the 'big bonus' which has helped create the the problem currently being addressed. Nobody can deny the wrong-doing by some in the industry, criminal activities in order to cheat into receiving a 'big bonus' has been the major problem, this is the other side of the coin to the system. The 'envy' excuse is no longer valid.

[crankedup]

May I recommend that posters still in partial denial, or others just interested in the facts regarding the Global Bank crash of 2008 look back at STORYVILLE - INSIDE JOB. This television program offers an forensic detailed insight into the culpability of banks in causing a financial crash costing tens of millions of people to lose their jobs and homes.

[Randy Winkman]

crankedup said:

May I recommend that posters still in partial denial, or others just interested in the facts regarding the Global Bank crash of 2008 look back at STORYVILLE - INSIDE JOB. This television program offers an forensic detailed insight into the culpability of banks in causing a financial crash costing tens of millions of people to lose their jobs and homes.

But we mustn't stop them doing it all again or they'll all go somewhere else. I think we should give it a try.

[turbobloke]

Also read the Clinton era documentation "The National Homeownership Strategy: Partners in the American Dream" and note the explicit HUD targets for subprime ninja mortgage lending which were ramped up year on year alongside actions by Clinton's enforcer, Achtenberg which ensured over many years that mortgages were given to people who would never be able to afford the payments. These products were repackaged and sold around the world including the UK within Brown's ineffective tripartite regulatory system. Ratings agencies and bank governance were at fault also but egalitarian delusion was the starting gun for the crunch and crash.

[crankedup]

turbobloke said:

Also read the Clinton era documentation "The National Homeownership Strategy: Partners in the American Dream" and note the explicit HUD targets for subprime ninja mortgage lending which were ramped up year on year alongside actions by Clinton's enforcer, Achtenberg which ensured over many years that mortgages were given to people who would never be able to afford the payments. These products were repackaged and sold around the world including the UK within Brown's ineffective tripartite regulatory system. Ratings agencies and bank governance were at fault also but egalitarian delusion was the starting gun for the crunch and crash.

All part of the incisive STORYVILLE, I agree regulation was a joke, hence the need to ramp up those regulations. Decades working under such lack of supervisory regulation brought the World's finance to its knees, I wouldn't imagine anyone wants to re-visit that scenario. Stupid Politicians combined with greedy employees in the finance industry - no wonder it all hit the fan.

[otolith]

crankedup said:

Its was the 'big bonus' which has helped create the the problem currently being addressed. Nobody can deny the wrong-doing by some in the industry, criminal activities in order to cheat into receiving a 'big bonus' has been the major problem, this is the other side of the coin to the system. The 'envy' excuse is no longer valid.

That's a very simplistic view of what happened, based largely on a desire to believe in a morality tale.

[turbobloke]

otolith said:

crankedup said:

Its was the 'big bonus' which has helped create the the problem currently being addressed. Nobody can deny the wrong-doing by some in the industry, criminal activities in order to cheat into receiving a 'big bonus' has been the major problem, this is the other side of the coin to the system. The 'envy' excuse is no longer valid.

That's a very simplistic view of what happened, based largely on a desire to believe in a morality tale.

Which can be dangerous in itself (CoOp).

[Qwert1e]

Seven years?

That should be their prison sentence, not the bonus waiting period.

[turbobloke]

Qwert1e said:

Seven years?

That should be their prison sentence, not the bonus waiting period.

[legzr1]

crankedup said:

All part of the incisive STORYVILLE, I agree regulation was a joke, hence the need to ramp up those regulations. Decades working under such lack of supervisory regulation brought the World's finance to its knees, I wouldn't imagine anyone wants to re-visit that scenario. Stupid Politicians combined with greedy employees in the finance industry - no wonder it all hit the fan.

Seen it - good bit of TV.

No doubt it will be ignored by the banking apologists yelling the same old blinkered hyperbole. (Actually, I see that's happening already)

[turbobloke]

legzr1 said:

crankedup said:

All part of the incisive STORYVILLE, I agree regulation was a joke, hence the need to ramp up those regulations. Decades working under such lack of supervisory regulation brought the World's finance to its knees, I wouldn't imagine anyone wants to re-visit that scenario. Stupid Politicians combined with greedy employees in the finance industry - no wonder it all hit the fan.

Seen it - good bit of TV.

No doubt it will be ignored by the banking apologists yelling the same old blinkered hyperbole. (Actually, I see that's happening already)

Where are these banking apologists? There aren't any visible in this thread at the moment. As you read posts so assiduously you'll have noticed mention of bank governance issues in my recent post.

The relevant people in the relevant banks are rightly criticised. However, scapegoating which places the blame for the crash and crunch with 'bankers' is juvenile, and a different matter. Usually the worst offenders are blinkered deluded leftists to one degree or another, pushing anachronistic class warfare rhetoric.

[Randy Winkman]

legzr1 said:

No doubt it will be ignored by the banking apologists yelling the same old blinkered hyperbole. (Actually, I see that's happening already)

And also being selective about the political blame so they can point the finger at the party they don't like. The political blame in the UK always seems to fall at the feet of the incumbent party, but in the US it goes back years.

[turbobloke]

Randy Winkman said:

legzr1 said:

No doubt it will be ignored by the banking apologists yelling the same old blinkered hyperbole. (Actually, I see that's happening already)

And also being selective about the political blame so they can point the finger at the party they don't like.

No selectivity here, what was indicated was the origin which remains Clinton's egalitarian delusion and mandated ninja mortgage lending.

In my post, beyond the initial Clinton failure, I mentioned ratings agencies, regulatory failure and banking governance issues. That isn't being selective.

Randy Winkman said:

The political blame in the UK always seems to fall at the feet of the incumbent party, but in the US it goes back years.

In terms of the origin, it goes back to its origins which is appropriate, and the origins are political.

Gordon Brown's inadequate tripartite regulatory system gets a mention later on as part of the problem, not the origin of it.

[toppstuff]

turbobloke said:

In terms of the origin, it goes back to its origins which is appropriate, and the origins are political.

Gordon Brown's inadequate tripartite regulatory system gets a mention later on as part of the problem, not the origin of it.

Indeed.

It must also be noted that the instruments created by the banks ( such as credit derivatives, CDO's, CDS etc) came into being because the idea was to take the risk implicit in Clinton's compulsory bad-credit lending, break it down and then spread it around. This therefore reduced the prospect of risk being overly concentrated.

A core failure of the "system" was from regulators and ratings agencies. The regulators because they had a golden opportunity when the CDO / CDS markets were evolving to properly regulate them and the ratings agencies because of the obvious conflict inherent in their business model ( that of being paid to rate debt instruments by the same banks that were issuing them). The regulators clearly did not understand what they were doing. Politicans understood even less.

Banks ( being banks ! ) could see that trading these instruments could make vast profits. And that is what they did. And how the politicians praised them for the tax and revenue they generated !!

But it is strange that neither the regulators nor the politicians (nor indeed, the ratings agencies) attract the same righteous anger that the banks do - even though they were an equal part of the equation. I wonder why this is?

[legzr1]

turbobloke said:

Where are these banking apologists?

Really?

turbobloke said:

Usually the worst offenders are blinkered deluded leftists to one degree or another, pushing anachronistic class warfare rhetoric.

The King of hyperbole.

Come Sir, accept your crown.

Randy Winkman said:

And also being selective about the political blame so they can point the finger at the party they don't like.

No!

That doesn't happen does it?

Someone having a pop at a poster for political bias then ending in a tirade of anti-Labour, anti-Brown and anti-anything left of centre at every available opportunity (then will probably claim to know the meaning of hypocrisy whilst missing the meaning of irony...).

Tell me you're joking



Nine months or so until May 2015 - perhaps this is the reason for the tension