US journalist beheaded by ISIS...

[Four Litre]

zygalski said:

Four Litre said:

zygalski said:

Four Litre said:

zygalski said:

Four Litre said:

Its becoming more apparent that with Islam on a deeper level, your either with it or against it. When push comes to shove your the Kaffur/ Infidel 'insert derogitory term'. Its amazing how many people are too scared to say anything about it for fear of being called racist. Most only reaslise that Islam isnt a race but a religeon when told.

Its one of the biggest problems we face in the western world and sadly will need a leader of real courage and stature to deal with it (something we dont have). Sadly I think the only way to sort it out is to break a few eggs on UK soil and it wont be pretty.

Wow! How incredibly ignorant and/or naive.
Look up yer history pal. We in the West have in almost equal measure supported & attacked various Muslim extremist groups over the years....

Actually neither Zygalski. I was brought up knowing what was right and wrong, and not to believe in fairies.

So presumably at the moment you're busy protesting our support of the so-called Iranian extremist "Rebels" (AKA insurgents ) and have also protested all the other times in recent history that Western governments have supported & armed Muslim extremist regimes & groups?

Nope -I ve got a lot better things to do like work, raising my children and generally enjoying my life. I dont feel the need to take to the streets to state my beliefs, as mentioned earlier the majority know right from wrong.

You don't see any hypocrisy in the West supporting Muslim extremist groups when "the need arises"?

Of course I do - however I'm not the one in running the show! If I had my way we would be cutting down on Mosques in the UK, policing them to ensure what they teach is harmless fun. As has been said before, Islam hasnt really done a good job with PR to date.

I dont believe it has a place in modern society, as I do all religions. I dont feel the need for moral guidance, additional control, the end of my knob to be chopped off or my steak to be told a story, or least of all kill people because people dont share my views.

[s1962a]

rich1231 said:

s1962a said:

You are right about that - no idea how they got indoctrinated. Especially as mainstream mosques have their sermons monitored - these people must be getting their ideology from other sources. ISIS seem well funded and well equipped, and money could buy a lot of people willing to indoctrinate these impressionable minds.

Loads of the funding comes from communities in the UK, and other nations.

Any evidence for this?

[lord trumpton]

I remember watching the video of Ken Bigley being beheaded years ago. I churned my stomach and made me sick to the very core. I would never watch anything like it again. I honestly cannot think about a more barbaric way to die.

My his soul rest in peace. He was a brave man

[rich1231]

s1962a said:

Any evidence for this?

Vast proliferation of workers remittance services all other the world with a flow of monies to "warm" entities. Large numbers of interesting characters appearing on sanctions and watch lists for financial transactions hence the proliferation of the services to are so easy to circumvent any checks on.

Are you going to claim it doesn't happen?

For every person that has travelled, there are lots that cannot quite make the trip and instead support in other ways.

[s1962a]

rich1231 said:

s1962a said:

Any evidence for this?

Vast proliferation of workers remittance services all other the world with a flow of monies to "warm" entities. Large numbers of interesting characters appearing on sanctions and watch lists for financial transactions hence the proliferation of the services to are so easy to circumvent any checks on.

Are you going to claim it doesn't happen?

For every person that has travelled, there are lots that cannot quite make the trip and instead support in other ways.

I didn't see any evidence in your post. Just a bunch of words

Provide links - something to back up what you're saying.

[paranoid airbag]

FTR - this statement was released by the Muslim Council of Britain:

Muslim Council of Britain said:

The Muslim Council of Britain once again condemned the actions of the so called “Islamic State in Syria and the Levant”, ISIS. Today we express once again our rebuke of this reprehensible organisation. We are horrified at the abhorrent murder of James Foley, a reporter who initially went to the region to expose the human rights abuses of the Syrian regime. ISIS has murdered this man for no reason at all.

Each day ISIS seeks to carry out an act more barbarous than the day before, craving the oxygen of publicity to give credibility to their heinous acts. We condemn unreservedly their psychopathic violence, whether it is on minorities, on civilians, or on fellow Muslims.

The MCB expressed the British Muslim community’s common censure of the group as early as June, and called for joint action to ensure the poison of extremism and sectarianism is not injected into our communities.

ISIS does not speak for Islam, and has been repudiated by all Muslims. Their message only appeals to those who are easily duped by their twisted message purporting to be Islam. They seek to glamorise their violence, and unfortunately, the media has a part to play in adding to that glamour.

We urge the media in refraining from giving them any further undue exposure beyond conventional reporting. And we urge Muslim communities to re-double their efforts in coming together, condemning the barbarity of ISIS and persuading those gullible enough to take in their message that they are on a path to futility.

[s1962a]

Four Litre said:

If I had my way we would be cutting down on Mosques in the UK, policing them to ensure what they teach is harmless fun. As has been said before, Islam hasnt really done a good job with PR to date.

I dont believe it has a place in modern society, as I do all religions. I dont feel the need for moral guidance, additional control, the end of my knob to be chopped off or my steak to be told a story, or least of all kill people because people dont share my views.

This is part of the problem. You are not differentiating Islam from what this extremist ideology is doing. These people don't go to normal mosques, or hang around with muslims - they just stick with their own twisted ideology folk.

[s1962a]

Guam said:

rich1231 said:

Vast proliferation of workers remittance services all other the world with a flow of monies to "warm" entities. Large numbers of interesting characters appearing on sanctions and watch lists for financial transactions hence the proliferation of the services to are so easy to circumvent any checks on.

Are you going to claim it doesn't happen?

For every person that has travelled, there are lots that cannot quite make the trip and instead support in other ways.

Well there was that Girl caught with 20K in her knickers en route to Syria, I doubt that was Saudi money somehow.

So thats one example - keep em coming

Who indoctrinated her? How did she become radicalised? Thats what we need to focus on.

[rich1231]

s1962a said:

I didn't see any evidence in your post. Just a bunch of words

Provide links - something to back up what you're saying.

Rather like yours.

The last 20 years I have spent designing and consulting in Payments systems etc


Just for the sake of discussion... Do you think if there are 10 people willing to go and fight, there are a larger number less motivated but are happy to help out financially? Or do you think all those sympathetic as soon as they reach that point of view they pack bags and travel?

[s1962a]

rich1231 said:

Just for the sake of discussion... Do you think if there are 10 people willing to go and fight, there are a larger number less motivated but are happy to help out financially? Or do you think all those sympathetic as soon as they reach that point of view they pack bags and travel?

I have no idea. I have never met a muslim with extremist views, so I have no idea what spurns them. Have you? You must have some insight into this surely?

[s1962a]

Guam said:

s1962a said:

So thats one example - keep em coming

Who indoctrinated her? How did she become radicalised? Thats what we need to focus on.

No Idea, I don't monitor that stuff in the press, the point was though that wasn't Saudi money in all Likelihood, how much more there may be generated in the UK I for one couldn't say. her Two brothers were out there IIRC, so they probably twisted her outlook, who turned them no idea. As I indicated earlier this is like an infectious disease and we need to increasingly view it that way imho.

You seem to have a lot of insight into how this organisation works. I've been a muslim all my life and have never come across these nutters - even once.

How do you know so much about them?

[s1962a]

fesuvious said:

paranoid airbag said:

FTR - this statement was released by the Muslim Council of Britain:

Muslim Council of Britain said:

The Muslim Council of Britain once again condemned the actions of the so called “Islamic State in Syria and the Levant”, ISIS. Today we express once again our rebuke of this reprehensible organisation. We are horrified at the abhorrent murder of James Foley, a reporter who initially went to the region to expose the human rights abuses of the Syrian regime. ISIS has murdered this man for no reason at all.

Each day ISIS seeks to carry out an act more barbarous than the day before, craving the oxygen of publicity to give credibility to their heinous acts. We condemn unreservedly their psychopathic violence, whether it is on minorities, on civilians, or on fellow Muslims.

The MCB expressed the British Muslim community’s common censure of the group as early as June, and called for joint action to ensure the poison of extremism and sectarianism is not injected into our communities.

ISIS does not speak for Islam, and has been repudiated by all Muslims. Their message only appeals to those who are easily duped by their twisted message purporting to be Islam. They seek to glamorise their violence, and unfortunately, the media has a part to play in adding to that glamour.

We urge the media in refraining from giving them any further undue exposure beyond conventional reporting. And we urge Muslim communities to re-double their efforts in coming together, condemning the barbarity of ISIS and persuading those gullible enough to take in their message that they are on a path to futility.

Great, now condemn the wider aim for a caliphate please instead of solely condemning the barbarism

MCB said:

ISIS does not speak for Islam, and has been repudiated by all Muslims

What part of that is unclear?

[s1962a]

Guam said:

s1962a said:

You seem to have a lot of insight into how this organisation works. I've been a muslim all my life and have never come across these nutters - even once.

How do you know so much about them?

Which organisation? Isis, how do you come to that conclusion? I have made plain I have no clue as to how they get radicalised, so show me where I have said otherwise. I have lots of Muslim customers who have fed me their opinions over the years, otherwise like everyone else I review what is coming out in the press ( presumably you do the same given your admission).

Sorry, I thought you were giving an insight into how ISIS works considering you talked about the woman who was carrying 20k out to Syria. I presume that was for ISIS?

[Lost soul]

But they do what they do using the name of islam

[s1962a]

Lost soul said:

But they do what they do using the name of islam

Doesn't make it right.

Do you equate what these barbarians do in the name of Islam to what the vast majority of muslims practice in this country?

[rich1231]

s1962a said:

I have no idea. I have never met a muslim with extremist views, so I have no idea what spurns them. Have you? You must have some insight into this surely?

So extremism in the I'm flying out now sense is a binary mental state?

[VinceFox]

Tbh i'm beyond fking sick of ANY religion of ANY name being bought into this. It's a geopolitical push by spoilt rich aholes who've leant on a supposed class system so they can play in the sand with someone elses blood.

The majority, the VAST fkING MAJORITY of this entire mess could be solved by the outright banning of anyone who believes in any religion being able to have any determining influence. On either side.

[s1962a]

rich1231 said:

s1962a said:

I have no idea. I have never met a muslim with extremist views, so I have no idea what spurns them. Have you? You must have some insight into this surely?

So extremism in the I'm flying out now sense is a binary mental state?

Why would you say that? I've never actually conversed with an extremist - only what I read in the news.

Have you?

[VinceFox]

fesuvious said:

s1962a said:

What part of that is unclear?

Nothing, but I still don't see a clear condemnation of the stated aims for a Caliphate. The text clearly states the actions (barbarism) of IS are abhorrent.

That I see.

But I have not (yet) read a condemnation of IS' territorial actions and their stated aim to bring about a caliphate under Shariah.

I'd like to see an Imam come out on TV and clearly say this.
I'd like an Imam to clearly state the Islam does not desire a Caliphate. And by extension see's no need for Shariah across Western countries.

I watched a uk imam do this on bbc news earlier.

The more pertinent question should be why the fk are we giving even the slightest credibility to the opinions of anyone who believes in any god? Some serious growing up as a species needs to happen here.

[EggsBenedict]

What motivates people to do this?

Well, outright belief that the writings in an ancient book are a direct manual on how to live your life based on them being the word of a divine being is clearly one of them.

Might be interested in looking at this site: http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/quran/023-violen...

I have not checked the book, or made my own interpretations (as this web author has), but if this is what you've been taught, and you outright believe it, I guess there's no real reason why you would not have an utterly perverse view on human life.