US journalist beheaded by ISIS...
Discussion
photosnob said:
Without wishing to get into the semantics of what is and isn't a terrorist organisation, I'm pretty confident that in recent history the nazis were the most evil. I can also think of a few others that caused more damage than Isis.
The reason I prefaced my statement with 'possibly' is because we simply don't know how they will turn out; they've barely got started.PorkInsider said:
I'd call eating some slightly iffy ham that you really should have thrown away a 'bad choice' that we might all have made.
Joining possibly the most evil terrorist organisation the world has ever seen isn't quite the same.
That's the point, isn't it? Some of those going over seem not to have intended to join ISIS. Joining possibly the most evil terrorist organisation the world has ever seen isn't quite the same.
The Dutch are allowing theirs back in (after detaining them, interrogating them, rehabilitating them).
No one has dealt with the the issue of those going out to fight with the Kurds. (Significant numbers of Brits, Germans, Dutch, as well as at least two ex GIs.)
TheRealFingers99 said:
Westy Pre-Lit said:
My heart bleeds for the poor little lambs,
I don't think anyone is asking for your heart to bleed. But Pre-Lit pretty much sums you up, don't you think? [b]Not a brain cell or an original thought in your body.[/b[ Are you going to let the GIs fighting for the Kurds back in the US?
Why the hell not allow GIs supporting the Kurds back into the US. The Kurds aren't anti-West, anti-Kaffir extremist scum wanting to destroy us and our values. You might not have noticed that instead of joining such vermin they've risked all to stand against them. And their US supporters are/would be GIs wanting to stand up to anti US parties too. What a dumb assed question.
griffin dai said:
TheRealFingers99 said:
Meanwhile, back on planet Earth, Isis threatens to kill British jihadis wanting to come home
Oh well.Family Guys on.....
TheRealFingers99 said:
Jimbeaux said:
Bad choice going in the first place, huh? Come back? f
k them, may they die where they stand and go to Hell.
Sure, a bad move. But we've all made bad choices.k them, may they die where they stand and go to Hell.Imagine they'd gone to fight Assad -- a position that both US and UK governments looked to be very close to endorsing -- and found themselves not with the FSA, but with one of the other groups. They might well want to come back. The alternatives:
a. keep fighting for whoever
b. desert to a "better" group (or surrender, if they're taking prisoners that day)
c. come home
Think of one of your GIs fighting for a Kurdish "terrorist" group. Are you going to allow them home to the land of the free?
It's not as if the situation was anything like clear cut -- groups that the US supported 3 months ago are now being bombed by them.
- Kurds. "Terrorists", supported by the US with arms, food, and medicine drops (also armed by Germany and the UK). Fighting the Daesh, sometimes the Turks, the Syrian and Iraqi armies if pushed, uneasy alliance with (parts of) the FSA who they were fighting.
- FSA. Supported by Turkey and the US, uneasy alliance with the Kurds, attacked by Syrian government and Daesh.
- Hezbollah. Fighting along the Syrian army for as long as the Iranians believe it's a good idea. Then probably going home.
- The Daesh. At least 3 different factions, all of whom have been fighting each other at some point. Attacked by the Syrians and the coallition, the FSA and Kurds.
- The Druze. Trying desperately to keep out of it.
What depresses more are the armchair warriors on here, gloating about death: something which I've never encountered among combatants.
What did it actually have to do with them personally??
Mojocvh said:
Can I just clear something up. You say they went to fight against Assad, right.
What did it actually have to do with them personally??
What did Afghan have to do with any British Soldier personally? Or Iraq for that matter?What did it actually have to do with them personally??
People go and fight for all sorts of reasons - most of them are stupid reasons, but it's rare for a war to be fought by people who had any personal reason to fight it.
It's surprising no-one's mentioned this yet.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-hampshire-297...
On second thoughts, let us not lock them up. ISIS can just go ahead and waste 'em.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-hampshire-297...
On second thoughts, let us not lock them up. ISIS can just go ahead and waste 'em.
BillPeart said:
Ironic. I'd keep your original thoughts in your head if I were you.
Why the hell not allow GIs supporting the Kurds back into the US. The Kurds aren't anti-West, anti-Kaffir extremist scum wanting to destroy us and our values. You might not have noticed that instead of joining such vermin they've risked all to stand against them. And their US supporters are/would be GIs wanting to stand up to anti US parties too. What a dumb assed question.
And the FSA? They were a significant part of my post, but not of your retort.Why the hell not allow GIs supporting the Kurds back into the US. The Kurds aren't anti-West, anti-Kaffir extremist scum wanting to destroy us and our values. You might not have noticed that instead of joining such vermin they've risked all to stand against them. And their US supporters are/would be GIs wanting to stand up to anti US parties too. What a dumb assed question.
I support the Kurds. Don't get me wrong on that.
BUT the Syrian Kurds are effectively the PKK (the "terrorists" who have been fighting the Turks, outlawed by the US, etc.). They have been described as Maoists by some American commentators. While they don't have territorial ambitions against the west (unless you include Turkey), they're not exactly pro-west.
YPG is their own words here recently, in Syria. Note the red star. What do you imagine that symbolises?
These are some of the most politicised people on the planet. Many have spent years in Turkish prisons or up in the mountains. Democrats, but not in any sense the West would rapidly accept. I've absolutely no problems with that.
But they'll be the coalition's proxy warriors only for as long as it suits them, and will expect something in return.
Edited by TheRealFingers99 on Sunday 26th October 14:55
Mojocvh said:
Can I just clear something up. You say they went to fight against Assad, right.
What did it actually have to do with them personally??
Very little, I'd think. But 6 or 9 months ago you'd have expected -- from the rhetoric -- the US and UK to be fighting Assad. Any troups we put in would just be fighting, without any choice in the matter.What did it actually have to do with them personally??
I've at least as much sympathy with those who may have gone to fight the evil SOB out of their own volition.
anonymous said:
[redacted]
See here. Technically it would be hard to define either Jihadis or those going to fight alongside the Kurds of FSA as mercenaries -- they'd have to be shown to be doing it for financial gain (and receiving substantially more than the combatants).
There is the Foreign Enlistment Act, but it was never used against those fighting in the Spanish Civil War or Angola.
TheRealFingers99 said:
Cobnapint said:
TheRealFingers99 said:
I think the "throughout the Muslim world" bit is telling. UK Muslims would be more appropriate, don't you think?
Same % I believe.Copied from another topic:
ICM Poll: 20% of British Muslims sympathize with 7/7 bombers
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1510866/Pol...
NOP Research: 1 in 4 British Muslims say 7/7 bombings were justified
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/08/14/opinion/...
http://www.webcitation.org/5xkMGAEvY
People-Press: 31% of Turks support suicide attacks against Westerners in Iraq.
http://people-press.org/report/206/a-year-after-ir...
YNet: One third of Palestinians (32%) supported the slaughter of a Jewish family, including the children:
http://pajamasmedia.com/tatler/2011/04/06/32-of-pa...
http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4053251,...
World Public Opinion: 61% of Egyptians approve of attacks on Americans
32% of Indonesians approve of attacks on Americans
41% of Pakistanis approve of attacks on Americans
38% of Moroccans approve of attacks on Americans
83% of Palestinians approve of some or most groups that attack Americans (only 14% oppose)
62% of Jordanians approve of some or most groups that attack Americans (21% oppose)
42% of Turks approve of some or most groups that attack Americans (45% oppose)
A minority of Muslims disagreed entirely with terror attacks on Americans:
(Egypt 34%; Indonesia 45%; Pakistan 33%)
About half of those opposed to attacking Americans were sympathetic with al-Qaeda’s attitude toward the U.S.
http://www.worldpublicopinion.org/pipa/pdf/feb09/S...
Pew Research (2010): 55% of Jordanians have a positive view of Hezbollah
30% of Egyptians have a positive view of Hezbollah
45% of Nigerian Muslims have a positive view of Hezbollah (26% negative)
43% of Indonesians have a positive view of Hezbollah (30% negative)
http://pewglobal.org/2010/12/02/muslims-around-the...
Pew Research (2010): 60% of Jordanians have a positive view of Hamas (34% negative).
49% of Egyptians have a positive view of Hamas (48% negative)
49% of Nigerian Muslims have a positive view of Hamas (25% negative)
39% of Indonesians have a positive view of Hamas (33% negative)
http://pewglobal.org/2010/12/02/muslims-around-the...
Pew Research (2010): 15% of Indonesians believe suicide bombings are often or sometimes justified.
34% of Nigerian Muslims believe suicide bombings are often or sometimes justified.
http://pewglobal.org/2010/12/02/muslims-around-the...
16% of young Muslims in Belgium state terrorism is "acceptable".
http://www.hln.be/hln/nl/1275/Islam/article/detail...
Populus Poll (2006): 12% of young Muslims in Britain (and 12% overall) believe that suicide attacks against civilians in Britain can be justified. 1 in 4 support suicide attacks against British troops.
http://www.populuslimited.com/pdf/2006_02_07_times...
http://www.danielpipes.org/blog/2005/07/more-surve...
Pew Research (2007): 26% of younger Muslims in America believe suicide bombings are justified.
35% of young Muslims in Britain believe suicide bombings are justified (24% overall).
42% of young Muslims in France believe suicide bombings are justified (35% overall).
22% of young Muslims in Germany believe suicide bombings are justified.(13% overall).
29% of young Muslims in Spain believe suicide bombings are justified.(25% overall).
http://pewresearch.org/assets/pdf/muslim-americans...
Pew Research (2011): 8% of Muslims in America believe suicide bombings are often or sometimes justified (81% never).
28% of Egyptian Muslims believe suicide bombings are often or sometimes justified (38% never).
http://www.people-press.org/2011/08/30/muslim-amer...
Pew Research (2007): Muslim-Americans who identify more strongly with their religion are three times more likely to feel that suicide bombings are justified
http://pewresearch.org/assets/pdf/muslim-americans...
ICM: 5% of Muslims in Britain tell pollsters they would not report a planned Islamic terror attack to authorities.
27% do not support the deportation of Islamic extremists preaching violence and hate.
http://www.scotsman.com/?id=1956912005
http://www.danielpipes.org/blog/2005/07/more-surve...
Federation of Student Islamic Societies: About 1 in 5 Muslim students in Britain (18%) would not report a fellow Muslim planning a terror attack.
http://www.fosis.org.uk/sac/FullReport.pdf
http://www.danielpipes.org/blog/2005/07/more-surve...
ICM Poll: 25% of British Muslims disagree that a Muslim has an obligation to report terrorists to police.
http://www.icmresearch.co.uk/reviews/2004/Guardian...
http://www.danielpipes.org/blog/2005/07/more-surve...
Populus Poll (2006): 16% of British Muslims believe suicide attacks against Israelis are justified.
37% believe Jews in Britain are a "legitimate target".
http://www.populuslimited.com/pdf/2006_02_07_times...
http://www.danielpipes.org/blog/2005/07/more-surve...
Pew Research (2013): At least 1 in 4 Muslims do not reject violence against civilians (study did not distinguish between those who believe it is partially justified and never justified).
http://www.pewforum.org/uploadedFiles/Topics/Relig...
Pew Research (2013): 15% of Muslims in Turkey support suicide bombings (also 11% in Kosovo, 26% in Malaysia and 26% in Bangladesh).
http://www.pewforum.org/uploadedFiles/Topics/Relig...
PCPO (2014): 89% of Palestinians support Hamas and other terrorists firing rockets at Israeli civilians.
http://www.jihadwatch.org/2014/08/poll-89-of-pales...
Pew Research (2013): Only 57% of Muslims worldwide disapprove of al-Qaeda. Only 51% disapprove of the Taliban. 13% support both groups and 1 in 4 refuse to say.
http://www.pewglobal.org/2013/09/10/muslim-publics...
http://www.pewglobal.org/2013/09/10/muslim-publics...
See also: http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Muslim_Statistics_(Terro... for further statistics on Islamic terror.
Pew Research (2007): 5% of American Muslims have a favorable view of al-Qaeda (27% can’t make up their minds). Only 58% reject al-Qaeda outright.
http://pewresearch.org/assets/pdf/muslim-americans...
Pew Research (2011): 5% of American Muslims have a favorable view of al-Qaeda (14% can’t make up their minds).
http://www.people-press.org/2011/08/30/muslim-amer...
Pew Research (2011): 1 in 10 native-born Muslim-Americans have a favorable view of al-Qaeda.
http://people-press.org/2011/08/30/muslim-american...
al-Jazeera (2006): 49.9% of Muslims polled support Osama bin Laden
http://terrorism.about.com/b/2006/09/11/al-jazeera...
Pew Research: 59% of Indonesians support Osama bin Laden in 2003
41% of Indonesians support Osama bin Laden in 2007
56% of Jordanians support Osama bin Laden in 2003
http://www.forbes.com/2010/02/15/iran-terrorism-al...
Pew Global: 51% of Palestinians support Osama bin Laden
54% of Muslim Nigerians Support Osama bin Laden
http://frontpagemag.com/2010/02/10/blinded-by-hate...
http://pewglobal.org/files/pdf/268.pdf
MacDonald Laurier Institute: 35% of Canadian Muslims would not repudiate al-Qaeda
http://www.torontosun.com/2011/11/01/strong-suppor...
http://www.macdonaldlaurier.ca/much-good-news-and-...
World Public Opinion: Muslim majorities agree with the al-Qaeda goal of Islamic law.
Muslim majorities agree with al-Qaeda goal of keeping Western values out of Islamic countries;
(Egypt: 88%; Indonesia 76%; Pakistan 60%; Morocco 64%)
http://www.worldpublicopinion.org/pipa/pdf/feb09/S...
ICM Poll: 13% of Muslim in Britain support al-Qaeda attacks on America.
http://www.icmresearch.co.uk/reviews/2004/guardian...
http://www.danielpipes.org/blog/2005/07/more-surve...
World Public Opinion: Attitude toward Osama bin Laden:
Egypt: 44% positive, 17% negative, and 25% mixed feelings
Indonesia: 14% positive, 26% negative, 21% mixed feelings (39% did not answer)
Pakistan: 25% positive, 15% negative, 26% mixed feelings (34% did not answer)
Morocco: 27% positive, 21% negative, 26% mixed feelings
Jordanians, Palestinians, Turks and Azerbaijanis. Jordanians combined for: 27% positive, 20 percent negative, and 27 percent mixed feelings. (Palestinians 56% positive, 20% negative, 22 percent mixed feelings).
http://www.worldpublicopinion.org/pipa/pdf/feb09/S...
Pew Research (2010): 49% of Nigerian Muslims have favorable view of al-Qaeda (34% unfavorable)
23% of Indonesians have favorable view of al-Qaeda (56% unfavorable)
34% of Jordanians have favorable view of al-Qaeda
25% of Indonesians have "confidence" in Osama bin Laden (59% had confidence in 2003)
1 in 5 Egyptians have "confidence" in Osama bin Laden
http://pewglobal.org/2010/12/02/muslims-around-the...
Pew Research (2011): 22% of Indonesians have a favorable view of al-Qaeda (21% unfavorable)
http://www.people-press.org/2011/08/30/muslim-amer...
Gallup: 51% of Pakistanis grieve Osama bin Laden (only 11% happy over death)
44% of Pakistanis viewed Osama bin Laden as a martyr (only 28% as an oulaw)
http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2011/05/majori...
Zogby International 2011: “Majorities in all six countries said they viewed the United States less favorably following the killing of the Al-Qaeda head [Osama bin Laden] in Pakistan”
http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM...
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/checkpoint-was...
Populus Survey: 18% of British Muslims would be proud or indifferent if a family member joined al-Qaeda.
http://www.populuslimited.com/poll_summaries/2006_...
http://www.danielpipes.org/blog/2005/07/more-surve...
Policy Exchange (2006): 7% Muslims in Britain admire al-Qaeda and other terrorist groups.
http://www.policyexchange.org.uk/images/libimages/...
http://www.danielpipes.org/blog/2005/07/more-surve...
Informal poll of Saudis in August 2014 shows 92% agree that Islamic State (ISIS) "conforms to the values of Islam and Islamic law."
http://muslimstatistics.wordpress.com/2014/08/24/9...
al-Arabiya: 36% of Arabs polled said the 9/11 attacks were morally justified; 38% disagreed; 26% Unsure
http://www.alarabiya.net/articles/2011/09/10/16627...
Gallup: 38.6% of Muslims believe 9/11 attacks were justified (7% "fully", 6.5% "mostly", 23.1% "partially")
http://elderofziyon.blogspot.com/2008/05/that-tiny...
http://www.washingtoninstitute.org/templateC06.php...
Pew Research (2011): Large majorities of Muslims believe in 9/11 conspiracy
http://pewresearch.org/pubs/2066/muslims-westerner...
40% of Indonesians approve of violence in defense of Islam.
http://www.thejakartapost.com/detailweekly.asp?fil...
Pew Global: 68% of Palestinian Muslims say suicide attacks against civilians in defense of Islam are justified.
43% of Nigerian Muslims say suicide attacks against civilians in defense of Islam are justified.
38% of Lebanese Muslims say suicide attacks against civilians in defense of Islam are justified.
15% of Egyptian Muslims say suicide attacks against civilians in defense of Islam are justified.
13% of Indonesian Muslims say suicide attacks against civilians in defense of Islam are justified.
12% of Jordanian Muslims say suicide attacks against civilians in defense of Islam are justified.
7% of Muslim Israelis say suicide attacks against civilians in defense of Islam are justified.
http://cnsnews.com/node/53865 (Pew Global Attitudes Project September, 2009)
Center for Social Cohesion: One Third of British Muslim students support killing for Islam
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1340599/Wi...
http://www.socialcohesion.co.uk/pdf/IslamonCampus....
Policy Exchange: One third of British Muslims believe anyone who leaves Islam should be killed
http://www.civitas.org.uk/pdf/ShariaLawOrOneLawFor...
NOP Research: 78% of British Muslims support punishing the publishers of Muhammad cartoons;
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/08/14/opinion/...
http://www.webcitation.org/5xkMGAEvY
NOP Research: Hardcore Islamists comprise 9% of Britain's Muslim population;
Another 29% would "aggressively defend" Islam;
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/08/14/opinion/...
http://www.webcitation.org/5xkMGAEvY
Pew Research (2010): 84% of Egyptian Muslims support the death penalty for leaving Islam
86% of Jordanian Muslims support the death penalty for leaving Islam
30% of Indonesian Muslims support the death penalty for leaving Islam
76% of Pakistanis support death the penalty for leaving Islam
51% of Nigerian Muslims support the death penalty for leaving Islam
http://pewglobal.org/2010/12/02/muslims-around-the...
ICM Poll: 11% of British Muslims find violence for religious or political ends acceptable.
http://www.icmresearch.co.uk/reviews/2004/Guardian...
http://www.danielpipes.org/blog/2005/07/more-surve...
Terrorism Research Institute Study: 51% of mosques in the U.S. have texts on site rated as severely advocating violence; 30% have texts rated as moderately advocating violence; and 19% have no violent texts at all.
http://www.terrorismanalysts.com/pt/index.php/pot/...
Pew Research (2013): 76% of South Asian Muslims and 56% of Egyptians advocate killing anyone who leaves the Islamic religion.
http://www.pewforum.org/uploadedFiles/Topics/Relig...
Pew Research (2013): 19% of Muslim Americans believe suicide bombings in defense of Islam are at least partially justified (global average is 28% in countries surveyed).
http://www.pewforum.org/uploadedFiles/Topics/Relig...
Pew Research (2013): 39% of Muslims in Malaysia say suicide bombings "justified" in defense of Islam (only 58% say 'never').
http://www.themalaysianinsider.com/sideviews/artic...
Die Presse (2013): 1 in 5 Muslims in Austria believe that anyone wanting to leave Islam should be killed.
http://muslimstatistics.wordpress.com/2013/12/03/s...
Muslims have highest claimed disability rates in the UK (24% of men, 21% of women)
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1340599/Wi...
2011: 16% of UK prisoners in 2010 are Muslim (Muslims comprise about 3% of the total population)
http://www.google.com/hostednews/ukpress/article/A...
Pakistani Muslims in the UK are three times more likely to be unemployed than Hindus. Indian Muslims are twice as likely to be unemployed as Indian Hindus.
http://frontpagemag.com/2012/daniel-greenfield/isl...
Policy Exchange: 1 in 4 Muslims in the UK have never heard of the Holocaust;
Only 34% of British Muslims believe the Holocaust ever happened.
http://www.imaginate.uk.com/MCC01_SURVEY/Site%20Do...
http://www.civitas.org.uk/pdf/ShariaLawOrOneLawFor...
Could be all hot air though eh...?
So where are the figures showing 25% of UK Muslims support ISIS?
ICM Poll: 13% of Muslim in Britain support al-Qaeda attacks on America.
http://www.icmresearch.co.uk/reviews/2004/guardian...
http://www.danielpipes.org/blog/2005/07/more-surve...
I actually tried those links. One is to Daniel Pipes, "Through Campus Watch, Pipes encouraged students and faculty to submit information on "Middle East-related scholarship, lectures, classes, demonstrations, and other activities relevant to Campus Watch". The project was accused of "McCarthyesque intimidation" of professors who criticized Israel when it published "dossiers" on eight professors it thought "hostile" to America. In protest, more than 100 academics demanded to be added to what some called a "blacklist". In October 2002 Campus Watch removed the dossiers from their website." [Wikipaedia entry for Daniel Pipes] But I can't find the poll there. The other gives:
"Not found
Sorry, but the page you were trying to view does not exist."
The pages are from 2004/5.
I'm not drawing any conclusions from that, but when one of the links points to the Elders of Zion (another link that throws up a page not found error) you start to become a little suspicious.
I'd certainly agree that the results -- if properly composed questions were put -- are extremely alarming, but there's nowt there that backs up your second assertion.
Cobnapint said:
OR, he will have a family that might be part of the 25% and are partly to blame for filling his head full of the type of st that made him go over there in the first place.
t that made him go over there in the first place.Cobnapint said:
TheRealFingers99 said:
I think the "throughout the Muslim world" bit is telling. UK Muslims would be more appropriate, don't you think?
Same % I believe.http://www.icmresearch.co.uk/reviews/2004/guardian...
http://www.danielpipes.org/blog/2005/07/more-surve...
I actually tried those links. One is to Daniel Pipes, "Through Campus Watch, Pipes encouraged students and faculty to submit information on "Middle East-related scholarship, lectures, classes, demonstrations, and other activities relevant to Campus Watch". The project was accused of "McCarthyesque intimidation" of professors who criticized Israel when it published "dossiers" on eight professors it thought "hostile" to America. In protest, more than 100 academics demanded to be added to what some called a "blacklist". In October 2002 Campus Watch removed the dossiers from their website." [Wikipaedia entry for Daniel Pipes] But I can't find the poll there. The other gives:
"Not found
Sorry, but the page you were trying to view does not exist."
The pages are from 2004/5.
I'm not drawing any conclusions from that, but when one of the links points to the Elders of Zion (another link that throws up a page not found error) you start to become a little suspicious.
I'd certainly agree that the results -- if properly composed questions were put -- are extremely alarming, but there's nowt there that backs up your second assertion.
TheRealFingers99 said:
Meanwhile, back on planet Earth, Isis threatens to kill British jihadis wanting to come home
"........the former Guantánamo Bay detainee Moazzam Begg confirmed that he was also aware of dozens of British men keen to return to the UK but who were trapped in Syria and Iraq, in effect held by a group they wanted to leave. Begg said he knew of more than 30 who wanted to come back. They had travelled to join rebels fighting the Syrian regime of President Bashar al-Assad but had subsequently become embroiled with Isis, some for language reasons – Isis had more English-speaking members."
I saw this article myself and have agonised over it."........the former Guantánamo Bay detainee Moazzam Begg confirmed that he was also aware of dozens of British men keen to return to the UK but who were trapped in Syria and Iraq, in effect held by a group they wanted to leave. Begg said he knew of more than 30 who wanted to come back. They had travelled to join rebels fighting the Syrian regime of President Bashar al-Assad but had subsequently become embroiled with Isis, some for language reasons – Isis had more English-speaking members."
Edited by TheRealFingers99 on Saturday 25th October 23:31
thanks for linking to it on here. I think what should happen is that we should send British troops into this hell hole of a place and they should bring back the British men that want to come back. It is our moral duty to do this. It isn't opening up the war but it is a rescue mission that we need to do. These guys that went out there may have been brainwashed and coerced, they have families back here that love them.
Obviously there will be some that will return that will have been well naughty and its clear that action should be taken against them. They should be charged with terrorist offences or traitorism or whatever and remanded in custody. At that point our brilliant legal system can get involved and bogged down in defending them. They should all get legal aid as its the right of every one to has it.
This will actually create wealth as the solicitors will get money and they will spend it in the local economy like at the sandwich shops and cafe's near where the court is on court days when they is there defending the mullah lads.
Everyone deserves a second chance you see and its about time this country stopped being so hard on people that hate us and started being friendlier to them.
In the meantime this article shocks me:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-hampshire-297...
"The brother of a Portsmouth man killed while fighting for Islamic State (IS) in Syria has been charged with preparing terrorist acts"
"Mr Jaman is due at Westminster Magistrates' Court on Monday. Another brother, Tuhin Shahensha, 26, has also been charged with terrorism offences."
It's little more than an outrage - these 2 lads have lost a loved one and here we are giving them more grief. They should be getting counselling not grief off the police.
We are far too nasty to these people, sure they may not be loving us at the minute but that's no reason for Britain to be nasty to them.
gpo746 said:
I saw this article myself and have agonised over it.
thanks for linking to it on here. I think what should happen is that we should send British troops into this hell hole of a place and they should bring back the British men that want to come back. It is our moral duty to do this. It isn't opening up the war but it is a rescue mission that we need to do.
It's little more than an outrage - these 2 lads have lost a loved one and here we are giving them more grief. They should be getting counselling not grief off the police.
We are far too nasty to these people, sure they may not be loving us at the minute but that's no reason for Britain to be nasty to them.
Now that is funny. For a sarcastic, piss taking narrative off the cuff, I'll give you a B+. You are short of an A due to not fleshing out the magistrate boosting the economy part to its full potential. thanks for linking to it on here. I think what should happen is that we should send British troops into this hell hole of a place and they should bring back the British men that want to come back. It is our moral duty to do this. It isn't opening up the war but it is a rescue mission that we need to do.
It's little more than an outrage - these 2 lads have lost a loved one and here we are giving them more grief. They should be getting counselling not grief off the police.
We are far too nasty to these people, sure they may not be loving us at the minute but that's no reason for Britain to be nasty to them.
Edited by Jimbeaux on Monday 27th October 02:51
TheRealFingers99 said:
Jimbeaux said:
Bad choice going in the first place, huh? Come back? fk them, may they die where they stand and go to Hell.
Sure, a bad move. But we've all made bad choices.k them, may they die where they stand and go to Hell.Imagine they'd gone to fight Assad -- a position that both US and UK governments looked to be very close to endorsing -- and found themselves not with the FSA, but with one of the other groups. They might well want to come back. The alternatives:
a. keep fighting for whoever
b. desert to a "better" group (or surrender, if they're taking prisoners that day)
c. come home
Think of one of your GIs fighting for a Kurdish "terrorist" group. Are you going to allow them home to the land of the free?
It's not as if the situation was anything like clear cut -- groups that the US supported 3 months ago are now being bombed by them.
- Kurds. "Terrorists", supported by the US with arms, food, and medicine drops (also armed by Germany and the UK). Fighting the Daesh, sometimes the Turks, the Syrian and Iraqi armies if pushed, uneasy alliance with (parts of) the FSA who they were fighting.
- FSA. Supported by Turkey and the US, uneasy alliance with the Kurds, attacked by Syrian government and Daesh.
- Hezbollah. Fighting along the Syrian army for as long as the Iranians believe it's a good idea. Then probably going home.
- The Daesh. At least 3 different factions, all of whom have been fighting each other at some point. Attacked by the Syrians and the coallition, the FSA and Kurds.
- The Druze. Trying desperately to keep out of it.
What depresses more are the armchair warriors on here, gloating about death: something which I've never encountered among combatants.
Jimbeaux said:
gpo746 said:
I saw this article myself and have agonised over it.
thanks for linking to it on here. I think what should happen is that we should send British troops into this hell hole of a place and they should bring back the British men that want to come back. It is our moral duty to do this. It isn't opening up the war but it is a rescue mission that we need to do.
It's little more than an outrage - these 2 lads have lost a loved one and here we are giving them more grief. They should be getting counselling not grief off the police.
We are far too nasty to these people, sure they may not be loving us at the minute but that's no reason for Britain to be nasty to them.
Now that is funny. For a sarcastic, piss taking narrative off the cuff, I'll give you a B+. You are short of an A due to not fleshing out the magistrate boosting the economy part to its full potential. thanks for linking to it on here. I think what should happen is that we should send British troops into this hell hole of a place and they should bring back the British men that want to come back. It is our moral duty to do this. It isn't opening up the war but it is a rescue mission that we need to do.
It's little more than an outrage - these 2 lads have lost a loved one and here we are giving them more grief. They should be getting counselling not grief off the police.
We are far too nasty to these people, sure they may not be loving us at the minute but that's no reason for Britain to be nasty to them.
Edited by Jimbeaux on Monday 27th October 02:51
There will be some do gooding soft t
t out there that actually thinks that is what we should do ?How the hell we became so soft and so scared of these people beats me
TheRealFingers99 said:
Westy Pre-Lit said:
My heart bleeds for the poor little lambs,
I don't think anyone is asking for your heart to bleed. But Pre-Lit pretty much sums you up, don't you think? Not a brain cell or an original thought in your body. Are you going to let the GIs fighting for the Kurds back in the US?
gpo746 said:
Jimbeaux said:
gpo746 said:
I saw this article myself and have agonised over it.
thanks for linking to it on here. I think what should happen is that we should send British troops into this hell hole of a place and they should bring back the British men that want to come back. It is our moral duty to do this. It isn't opening up the war but it is a rescue mission that we need to do.
It's little more than an outrage - these 2 lads have lost a loved one and here we are giving them more grief. They should be getting counselling not grief off the police.
We are far too nasty to these people, sure they may not be loving us at the minute but that's no reason for Britain to be nasty to them.
Now that is funny. For a sarcastic, piss taking narrative off the cuff, I'll give you a B+. You are short of an A due to not fleshing out the magistrate boosting the economy part to its full potential. thanks for linking to it on here. I think what should happen is that we should send British troops into this hell hole of a place and they should bring back the British men that want to come back. It is our moral duty to do this. It isn't opening up the war but it is a rescue mission that we need to do.
It's little more than an outrage - these 2 lads have lost a loved one and here we are giving them more grief. They should be getting counselling not grief off the police.
We are far too nasty to these people, sure they may not be loving us at the minute but that's no reason for Britain to be nasty to them.
Edited by Jimbeaux on Monday 27th October 02:51
There will be some do gooding soft t
t out there that actually thinks that is what we should do ?How the hell we became so soft and so scared of these people beats me
TheRealFingers99 said:
photosnob said:
Whilst I won't be shedding any years for the bloke, he will have a family who may well be completely innocent. He's dead - that's it, we don't need to celebrate it.
Exactly that. http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-hampshire-29778...
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