US journalist beheaded by ISIS...

[LeftmostAardvark]

Jimbeaux said:

Please. This woman wants to take known ISIS fighters, that return, and send them to "de-radicalization" training? Then she says; "We should attempt to show them the error of their ways"? Seriously?!?!?

Ah, so she'll send them on a Speed Awareness Course, but for terrorists. Now it all makes sense.

[Mermaid]

LeftmostAardvark said:

Jimbeaux said:

Please. This woman wants to take known ISIS fighters, that return, and send them to "de-radicalization" training? Then she says; "We should attempt to show them the error of their ways"? Seriously?!?!?

Ah, so she'll send them on a Speed Awareness Course, but for terrorists. Now it all makes sense.

The Right Club strategy, not quite.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Right_Club

[catso]

Jimbeaux said:

Please. This woman wants to take known ISIS fighters, that return, and send them to "de-radicalization" training? Then she says; "We should attempt to show them the error of their ways"? Seriously?!?!?

Not sure how closely you follow UK politics? but you need to know that this Woman is a first-class idiot whose stupidity is only eclipsed by that of her (also a politician) Husband.

Stupid s the pair of'em, I sincerely hope they don't breed...

[Mermaid]

catso said:

Stupid s the pair of'em, I sincerely hope they don't breed...

Agree, but too late - 3 kids.

[catso]

Mermaid said:

catso said:

Stupid s the pair of'em, I sincerely hope they don't breed...

Agree, but too late - 3 kids.

[Jimbeaux]

catso said:

Jimbeaux said:

Please. This woman wants to take known ISIS fighters, that return, and send them to "de-radicalization" training? Then she says; "We should attempt to show them the error of their ways"? Seriously?!?!?

Not sure how closely you follow UK politics? but you need to know that this Woman is a first-class idiot whose stupidity is only eclipsed by that of her (also a politician) Husband.

Stupid s the pair of'em, I sincerely hope they don't breed...

I can see that by her words alone. My worry is that some on here seem to see no problem with her reasoning.

[Mermaid]

Jimbeaux said:

I can see that by her words alone. My worry is that some on here seem to see no problem with her reasoning.

She wants to win votes.

[Jaykaybi]

Thought he seemed familiar. Article from December '13:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2531994/Fi...

[Jimbeaux]

Jaykaybi said:

Thought he seemed familiar. Article from December '13:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2531994/Fi...

So, the rapper turned jihadist (if confirmed) lived with his mother in a Maida Vale council house that is valued at at 1,000,000? Damn.

[otolith]

One of the memes amongst radicalised Muslim youths seems to be that fighting Jihad abroad is morally no different from being a member of the British armed forces. It's something one should bear in mind if advocating that we lower ourselves to their level.

[JagLover]

otolith said:

One of the memes amongst radicalised Muslim youths seems to be that fighting Jihad abroad is morally no different from being a member of the British armed forces. It's something one should bear in mind if advocating that we lower ourselves to their level.

Morally that could be the case from their perspective.

But one action is fighting for this country, the other is fighting against this country's interest. As I said they have made their choice, if they want to live in the Caliphrate let them, but strip them of UK nationality if they do.

[Countdown]

Jimbeaux said:

Nope, not at all. Jimbeaux has been standing his ground for close to 10 years here with very little support thank you very much. My response to you is one of recognition that we are at an empasse of opinions,opinions that neither of us are likey to change; therefore, I feel it better do agree to disagree before going to the next stage, which is insults and name calling.

Rather than an "impasse of opinions" it seems more the case that, when faced with facts that don't support your opinions, you "nobly" agree to disagree. And, by the way, it's possible to continue arguing without resorting to name calling, unless of course one has no more arguments left in the bag.

[audidoody]

Countdown said:

I'm not sure why you're having difficulties in reading or comprehending my post. Let me try again;

If something is not illegal then people who do it are not breaking the law.
If they are not breaking the law they cannot be charged with a criminal offence.
If they cannot be charged with a criminal offence they cannot be tried, or found guilty, or punished.
This is how most democratic law-abiding societies operate. It most certainly isn't a weakness.

What Yvette Cooper is saying is, IF (note the big letters) they can't be charged with a criminal offence, we should still try to show them the error of their ways.

Hope that clarifies.

People going to fight in another army that has as its aim the destruction of your own society have usually been classed throughout the ages as 'traitors'. Good luck with showing someone who has taken part in close-up-and-personal mass murder the "error of their ways".

Why don't you practice on Charles Bronson and let us know how that works out for you?

[Countdown]

Jimbeaux said:

Please. This woman wants to take known ISIS fighters, that return, and send them to "de-radicalization" training? Then she says; "We should attempt to show them the error of their ways"? Seriously?!?!?

Jimbo, before jumping straight to Defcon 1 would it be useful to check whether bring a member of IS is a criminal offence. As you know there are many US citizens fighting in the Israeli Army. Just because some people think the IDF are a bunch of terrorists doesn't make membership of the IDF a criminal offence.

For the avoidance of doubt my personal view is that membership of IS should be a capital punishment offence but we live in a democracy. Now if it isn't a criminal offence then they HAVEN'T BROKEN THE LAW. And if they haven't broken the law there isn't much that we can do to them forcibly. In which case what Yvette Cooper is suggesting MIGHT be the only way forward.

[Countdown]

audidoody said:

People going to fight in another army that has as its aim the destruction of your own society have usually been classed throughout the ages as 'traitors'. Good luck with showing someone who has taken part in close-up-and-personal mass murder the "error of their ways".

Why don't you practice on Charles Bronson and let us know how that works out for you?

Perfect example. CB has committed a crime. He's locked up. If Uk citizens have committed a crime, lock them up.

Is being a member of IS a crime!

[Mermaid]

Countdown said:

Is being a member of IS a crime!

It should be, rush it through. Or concoct some special powers.

[sugerbear]

Jimbeaux said:

Jaykaybi said:

Thought he seemed familiar. Article from December '13:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2531994/Fi...

So, the rapper turned jihadist (if confirmed) lived with his mother in a Maida Vale council house that is valued at at 1,000,000? Damn.

Good of the daily mail to get the house price in. Makes all the difference to frothing up the mail readers. And its a council house.. I can imagine their heads exploding at that one.

[otolith]

JagLover said:

otolith said:

One of the memes amongst radicalised Muslim youths seems to be that fighting Jihad abroad is morally no different from being a member of the British armed forces. It's something one should bear in mind if advocating that we lower ourselves to their level.

Morally that could be the case from their perspective.

But one action is fighting for this country, the other is fighting against this country's interest. As I said they have made their choice, if they want to live in the Caliphrate let them, but strip them of UK nationality if they do.

Yes, the question of allegiance to their "brothers" rather than their country is contentious - but what I was getting at was that we shouldn't be talking about playing to their rules if we wish to maintain the position that we are not the same and that they are supporting the bad guys.

[sugerbear]

Jimbeaux said:

Jaykaybi said:

Thought he seemed familiar. Article from December '13:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2531994/Fi...

So, the rapper turned jihadist (if confirmed) lived with his mother in a Maida Vale council house that is valued at at 1,000,000? Damn.

Good of the daily mail to get the house price in. Makes all the difference to frothing up the mail readers. And its a council house.. I can imagine their heads exploding at that one.

[Jimbeaux]

Countdown said:

Jimbeaux said:

Nope, not at all. Jimbeaux has been standing his ground for close to 10 years here with very little support thank you very much. My response to you is one of recognition that we are at an empasse of opinions,opinions that neither of us are likey to change; therefore, I feel it better do agree to disagree before going to the next stage, which is insults and name calling.

Rather than an "impasse of opinions" it seems more the case that, when faced with facts that don't support your opinions, you "nobly" agree to disagree. And, by the way, it's possible to continue arguing without resorting to name calling, unless of course one has no more arguments left in the bag.

It is less about facts than disagreeing about what those facts represent. I can certainly continue to debate and do so cordially, however, it will be a tedious affair as nothing is likely to change.
I am adding in a moral aspect to my argument CD. Just like law is open to intepretation, this issue cannot be void of a moral direction based upon the obvious.

Edited by Jimbeaux on Monday 25th August 21:20