Scottish Referendum / Independence - Vol 6
Discussion
Moonhawk said:
Cobnapint said:
I'm well glad it was a No, but I have to disagree when people say it wasn't close. The difference between Yes and No was just 383,937 - or 4.26 Wembley stadium fulls.
When you consider the number of major towns and cities that is spread over - Perth, Stirling, Dundee, Inverness, Aberdeen, Glasgee and Edinburgh - THAT is fook all.
And then consider that if just 191,969 - or just 2.133 Wembley fulls, had voted the other way, Salmond would have been sat there stroking a fluffy white cat on his lap.
It makes no difference how close it was. The referendum could have gone one way or the other off the back of a single vote.When you consider the number of major towns and cities that is spread over - Perth, Stirling, Dundee, Inverness, Aberdeen, Glasgee and Edinburgh - THAT is fook all.
And then consider that if just 191,969 - or just 2.133 Wembley fulls, had voted the other way, Salmond would have been sat there stroking a fluffy white cat on his lap.
If Yes had won by one vote - do you think the Yessers would be giving a second thought to the "50% -1 vote" - or would they be partying in the street celebrating their win, waving flags and planning to implement the split?
I'm just responding to to the assertion that the vote wasn't close - when it was.
Cobnapint said:
I know it doesn't make a difference to the outcome of the result, you are missing my point.
I'm just responding to to the assertion that the vote wasn't close - when it was.
Depends how you define "close" though. I'm just responding to to the assertion that the vote wasn't close - when it was.
The final vote was about as far apart as the polls indicated it would be. If you are expecting a result somewhere between 1% and 10% - and you get 10%.......that's quite a decisive win wouldn't you say? Looking back at all polls going back to 2011, no averaged a 14% win.
There were over 20% more votes for No than for Yes - that's a decent margin in my book.
The fact is - Scotland has a relatively small population - so the difference between Yes and No was always going to be able to fill X Wembley stadiums.
Edited by Moonhawk on Monday 22 September 09:22
Cobnapint said:
I'm well glad it was a No, but I have to disagree when people say it wasn't close. The difference between Yes and No was just 383,937 - or 4.26 Wembley stadium fulls.
When you consider the number of major towns and cities that is spread over - Perth, Stirling, Dundee, Inverness, Aberdeen, Glasgee and Edinburgh - THAT is fook all.
And then consider that if just 191,969 - or just 2.133 Wembley fulls, had voted the other way, Salmond would have been sat there stroking a fluffy white cat on his lap.
In percentage terms it wasn't close, 10% is a sizeable majority.When you consider the number of major towns and cities that is spread over - Perth, Stirling, Dundee, Inverness, Aberdeen, Glasgee and Edinburgh - THAT is fook all.
And then consider that if just 191,969 - or just 2.133 Wembley fulls, had voted the other way, Salmond would have been sat there stroking a fluffy white cat on his lap.
In terms of 'seats' as would be used to determine the outcome of a conventional election it was a landslide.
It terms of numbers it was close but that's because the electorate was small, only 3.6m or so.
Whilst I appreciate the sentiment about the closeness, I do wish our countrymen would have the good grace and sense to shut the f
k up about it.
And devo max too.
I didn't vote for any more powers, any more devolution, anything. I voted to remain in the UK just like the other 2m+ no voters. That's all we were asked.
The rank hypocrisy from those who didn't disgusts me, and the continued attempts to divide our country with all the "45" ste is wearing very thin with me. For the next few years, many a yes voter who doesn't get exactly what they want politically or economically is just going to shout "ah see, we should've voted yes." Immature, childish, irresponsible are just a few kinder words I can think of for this noisy minority.
I am however very grateful that we are able to still complain about the relative minutiae of what power is where and which MPs vote for what, instead of watching as the SNP promises crumbled one by one (or more likely all at once).
The largely silent majority has spoken and the rest should put up with it. #democracysucks
k up about it.And devo max too.
I didn't vote for any more powers, any more devolution, anything. I voted to remain in the UK just like the other 2m+ no voters. That's all we were asked.
The rank hypocrisy from those who didn't disgusts me, and the continued attempts to divide our country with all the "45" s
te is wearing very thin with me. For the next few years, many a yes voter who doesn't get exactly what they want politically or economically is just going to shout "ah see, we should've voted yes." Immature, childish, irresponsible are just a few kinder words I can think of for this noisy minority.I am however very grateful that we are able to still complain about the relative minutiae of what power is where and which MPs vote for what, instead of watching as the SNP promises crumbled one by one (or more likely all at once).
The largely silent majority has spoken and the rest should put up with it. #democracysucks
xjsdriver said:
OpulentBob said:
No, you're British, old bean. And will be for the rest of your life.
That's where you're wrong!!! - I'm Irish.....nice try though.....
Oh, you mean Irish like american Irish. An ancestor was Irish so that makes you greener than the Blarney Stone.
Well by that reckoning, I'm Scottish, so as a Scot I'll say get your paddy nose out of my country's business thanks. We're part of the Union and are staying that way for our lifetimes. It's what we voted on.
HenryJM said:
It's always hard to understand what people mean by that. We have that nutter who lives in Bath or Bristol and claims to be scottish then there's you who claims to live in Scotland, seems to support scottish independence but now isn't scottish. Ah well, each to their own.
Nope, never was Scottish - I'm Irish!!! I have lived here for many years though, and I support the Scots in their wish to become independent, just as Ireland did. Scotland has managed to keep the process entirely to a free and democratic level. They have not had the need to take recourse to armed struggle like happened in Ireland. This is an achievement in itself, especially when we had wkers from Northern Ireland coming over to stir up trouble. I take my hat off to the many, many Rangers fans who told the bigots to fk right off!!!ianrb said:
Fail.... utter fail, in fact!!! 
xjsdriver said:
HenryJM said:
It's always hard to understand what people mean by that. We have that nutter who lives in Bath or Bristol and claims to be scottish then there's you who claims to live in Scotland, seems to support scottish independence but now isn't scottish. Ah well, each to their own.
Nope, never was Scottish - I'm Irish!!! I have lived here for many years though, and I support the Scots in their wish to become independent, just as Ireland did. Scotland has managed to keep the process entirely to a free and democratic level. They have not had the need to take recourse to armed struggle like happened in Ireland. This is an achievement in itself, especially when we had wkers from Northern Ireland coming over to stir up trouble. I take my hat off to the many, many Rangers fans who told the bigots to fk right off!!!xjsdriver said:
ianrb said:
Fail.... utter fail, in fact!!! OpulentBob said:
Make your mind up. You were "English" - from the NE - a few pages ago.
Oh, you mean Irish like american Irish. An ancestor was Irish so that makes you greener than the Blarney Stone.
Well by that reckoning, I'm Scottish, so as a Scot I'll say get your paddy nose out of my country's business thanks. We're part of the Union and are staying that way for our lifetimes. It's what we voted on.
No, I mean my mother and father were Irish, not like the American Irish, where a long distant ancestor was Irish...... as you were!!! Let's face it - The genie is well and truly out of the bottle........and I don't think it's for going back in either!!!Oh, you mean Irish like american Irish. An ancestor was Irish so that makes you greener than the Blarney Stone.
Well by that reckoning, I'm Scottish, so as a Scot I'll say get your paddy nose out of my country's business thanks. We're part of the Union and are staying that way for our lifetimes. It's what we voted on.
ianrb said:
xjsdriver said:
ianrb said:
Fail.... utter fail, in fact!!! xjsdriver said:
No, I mean my mother and father were Irish, not like the American Irish, where a long distant ancestor was Irish...... as you were!!! Let's face it - The genie is well and truly out of the bottle........and I don't think it's for going back in either!!!
What genie is that?The one that says democracy in Scotland doesn't matter? The one where the quiet majority is ignored because of the wishes of a noisy minority?
I'm not sure you're correct.
The majority have spoken.
Scotland remains in the UK - the "once in a lifetime opportunity" has passed and the continued attempts to break up the country, contrary to the wishes of over 2m Scots, is disgusting, divisive and most importantly, damaging.
The sovereign will of the Scottish people. Remember that? Salmond said it often enough.
They voted no. Accept it. Get over it. The genie went back in the bottle around 6am on Friday.
The public (the 55, you know, the majority) won't stand for another referendum, and you can forget about the 'other ways' of declaring independence. If the 45 want to split Scotland for a generation, hamper investment and get nowhere then they're going the right way about it.
And BTW I didn't vote no for more powers either. I'd disband Holyrood given the chance, so how anyone can claim we voted for devo max is beyond me.
They voted no. Accept it. Get over it. The genie went back in the bottle around 6am on Friday.
The public (the 55, you know, the majority) won't stand for another referendum, and you can forget about the 'other ways' of declaring independence. If the 45 want to split Scotland for a generation, hamper investment and get nowhere then they're going the right way about it.
And BTW I didn't vote no for more powers either. I'd disband Holyrood given the chance, so how anyone can claim we voted for devo max is beyond me.
Rovinghawk said:
xjsdriver said:
I support the Scots in their wish to become independent
The majority don't want to be independent.If you want proof of this, there was a recent vote......................
A democratically held election has just taken place where the Scottish people have clearly indicated that they don't want independence. It is unequivocal.
What the holy crap is it with some people that - when faced with a democratic decision taken by a free thinking majority - they simply carry on regardless just because their opinion does not tie in with the majority view?
If XJS took the line " I support independence and I would wish to see more Scottish people do the same" that is fine, but to myopically pretend that the result ( and the settled will of the Scottish people ) is somehow wrong ( just because he does not support it ) is beyond arrogant. It is one the reasons why I dislike modern nationalism - because you see this all the time.
I am getting pissed off with people who bang on about democracy ( the Scottish nationalists being a case in point ) only to then adjust their language and start bleating when the democratic process ends up showing that the majority disagree with them. They should just STFU and accept that their point of view is not held by the majority and get back to trying to win the debate instead.
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