Scottish Referendum / Independence - Vol 6
Discussion
Strocky said:
Explain why it's laughable that the Scottish Defence budget would be far less than the current share of the UK's, unless you think an IS would being launching an attack on Putin or ISIS?
Your 2nd point is fair comment and would have been a political football if the referendum had went the other way
However the GERS figures don't take into account every penny contributed by Scotland as I touched on in my initial post (Supermarket VAT / Whisky Port of departure)
Is it really a surreal concept that a small resource rich country could at least outperform a UK up to it's oxters in debt?
Seeing as that small resource rich country would have taken on its share of the debt, and it seems to be doing ok at the moment, no not really.Your 2nd point is fair comment and would have been a political football if the referendum had went the other way
However the GERS figures don't take into account every penny contributed by Scotland as I touched on in my initial post (Supermarket VAT / Whisky Port of departure)
Is it really a surreal concept that a small resource rich country could at least outperform a UK up to it's oxters in debt?
Oh wait a minute I'm forgetting this picture:
which might make you resource rich but cash poor.Strocky said:
Is it really a surreal concept that a small resource rich country could at least outperform a UK up to it's oxters in debt?
Not reallyHOWEVER
To do it then scotland would of been a very very different scotland from the one we were told we would be voting YES to
It would of meant massive spending cuts
Of course at this point you will scream that scotland spends far less then it takes in tax
Have you ever visited england?
I have
According to you lot the current 3% spending cuts means then complete end of civilization as we know it
The UK as a whole currently overspends by 10%
So if a 3% cut is the end of the world then over a 10% difference must be HUGE
So why is it when i visit england i can't see any difference from scotland?
McWigglebum4th said:
Have you ever visited england?
I have
According to you lot the current 3% spending cuts means then complete end of civilization as we know it
The UK as a whole currently overspends by 10%
So if a 3% cut is the end of the world then over a 10% difference must be HUGE
So why is it when i visit england i can't see any difference from scotland?
I earn 3x what my wife does, why isn't she poor.I have
According to you lot the current 3% spending cuts means then complete end of civilization as we know it
The UK as a whole currently overspends by 10%
So if a 3% cut is the end of the world then over a 10% difference must be HUGE
So why is it when i visit england i can't see any difference from scotland?
Because she is supported by the larger earner.
She also spends more on clothes than me and expects me to pay for her when we do something together.
Strocky said:
andymadmak said:
OK. First of business for Scotland is your source? Really? That famous powerhouse grouping comprising a care home manager, a "consultant" and a hairdresser?
Secondly, even if you take what he says at face value (and the stuff about defence is laughable) he keeps making the point that Scotland would be able to make savings by sharing stuff with the rest of the UK! Which rather assumes that : a) the rest of the UK would have let you, b) that you don't already enjoy these savings as part of the Union.
Explain why it's laughable that the Scottish Defence budget would be far less than the current share of the UK's, unless you think an IS would being launching an attack on Putin or ISIS?Secondly, even if you take what he says at face value (and the stuff about defence is laughable) he keeps making the point that Scotland would be able to make savings by sharing stuff with the rest of the UK! Which rather assumes that : a) the rest of the UK would have let you, b) that you don't already enjoy these savings as part of the Union.
Your 2nd point is fair comment and would have been a political football if the referendum had went the other way
However the GERS figures don't take into account every penny contributed by Scotland as I touched on in my initial post (Supermarket VAT / Whisky Port of departure)
Is it really a surreal concept that a small resource rich country could at least outperform a UK up to it's oxters in debt?
It's a silly point I am making on one level, but it illustrates the paucity of thinking displayed by the SNP on defence matters. The articles defence budget estimates do not appear to take into account the hard costs of having enough kit of the right quality to be able to defend yourself effectively. - we can leave aside Mr Salmonds assertions that Scotland would be an active partner in NATO! Defence spending is what it is across the whole of the UK and we just about hold our own at the moment.......
On your point about the GERS figures, I don't think you are correct. There might be a few more hundreds of millions unaccounted for by Whiskey and such like, but the reality of it is that Scotland already spends BILLIONS more than it takes taxes - just like the rest of the UK. The recent fall in oil prices would have blown a further MASSIVE hole in IS finances. - A hole you would have found almost impossible to fill without a currency to borrow under. The fall hurts UK as a whole right now, but as a strong set of shoulders we can all carry the burden.....
One last point. You made an extremely offensive comment a few pages back when posters criticised Mr Salmond for wiping his nose on the flag of England. I believe you suggested that he should have wiped his arse on it instead? Perhaps you might consider a retraction?
Strocky said:
simoid said:
The image you have supplied pops up every now and again on this thread and is nonsense.
Here are the Scottish government figures showing how much was spent in Scotland in terms of "identifiable" (ie obviously for the region of Scotland, so not London's sewer system or the roads of the south east) and "non-identifiable" ie army, interest payments.
As you can see, identifiable expenditure is above £50bn every year.
And to piss in your kettle a little more, we've spent more on identifiable expenditure in the last 5 years than we've taken in taxes, including our geographical share of the UK's oil.
Thanks for keeping my research brain active
Apologies for the delay in replying, whilst having a quick trawl of the web regarding the GERS figures came across this analysis in the comments section of this link regarding identifiable costs (84%) vs un-identifiable (16%)Here are the Scottish government figures showing how much was spent in Scotland in terms of "identifiable" (ie obviously for the region of Scotland, so not London's sewer system or the roads of the south east) and "non-identifiable" ie army, interest payments.
As you can see, identifiable expenditure is above £50bn every year.
And to piss in your kettle a little more, we've spent more on identifiable expenditure in the last 5 years than we've taken in taxes, including our geographical share of the UK's oil.
Thanks for keeping my research brain active
http://www.businessforscotland.co.uk/independence-...
Read from Ivan McKee says:
09/05/2013 at 2:13 pm
..................
mcdjl said:
Seeing as that small resource rich country would have taken on its share of the debt, and it seems to be doing ok at the moment, no not really.
Oh wait a minute I'm forgetting this picture: which might make you resource rich but cash poor.
I forgot Oil was only discovered in the last 3 months Oh wait a minute I'm forgetting this picture:
which might make you resource rich but cash poor.
andymadmak said:
On your first point about the Scottish defence budget. The comments in your linked article talked about "a lot of defence spending being based in London" , which is not really true. Nobody is talking about attacking Putin, although given how acquisitive he has become of late how can you be 100% sure that IS could defend itself if Putin took a shine to your North Sea Oil assets? And as for ISIS, ISIL or whichever iteration of that beast we are talking about, you might not be inclined to attack them, but they might well fancy a pop at you at some point!
It's a silly point I am making on one level, but it illustrates the paucity of thinking displayed by the SNP on defence matters. The articles defence budget estimates do not appear to take into account the hard costs of having enough kit of the right quality to be able to defend yourself effectively. - we can leave aside Mr Salmonds assertions that Scotland would be an active partner in NATO! Defence spending is what it is across the whole of the UK and we just about hold our own at the moment.......
On your point about the GERS figures, I don't think you are correct. There might be a few more hundreds of millions unaccounted for by Whiskey and such like, but the reality of it is that Scotland already spends BILLIONS more than it takes taxes - just like the rest of the UK. The recent fall in oil prices would have blown a further MASSIVE hole in IS finances. - A hole you would have found almost impossible to fill without a currency to borrow under. The fall hurts UK as a whole right now, but as a strong set of shoulders we can all carry the burden.....
One last point. You made an extremely offensive comment a few pages back when posters criticised Mr Salmond for wiping his nose on the flag of England. I believe you suggested that he should have wiped his arse on it instead? Perhaps you might consider a retraction?
I wouldn't think an IS foreign policy wishing to be the USA's lapdog and bomb brown people for oil or whatever resource they where after at the time, so we should be safe from extremists floating up the Clyde on Jihadi Speedboats It's a silly point I am making on one level, but it illustrates the paucity of thinking displayed by the SNP on defence matters. The articles defence budget estimates do not appear to take into account the hard costs of having enough kit of the right quality to be able to defend yourself effectively. - we can leave aside Mr Salmonds assertions that Scotland would be an active partner in NATO! Defence spending is what it is across the whole of the UK and we just about hold our own at the moment.......
On your point about the GERS figures, I don't think you are correct. There might be a few more hundreds of millions unaccounted for by Whiskey and such like, but the reality of it is that Scotland already spends BILLIONS more than it takes taxes - just like the rest of the UK. The recent fall in oil prices would have blown a further MASSIVE hole in IS finances. - A hole you would have found almost impossible to fill without a currency to borrow under. The fall hurts UK as a whole right now, but as a strong set of shoulders we can all carry the burden.....
One last point. You made an extremely offensive comment a few pages back when posters criticised Mr Salmond for wiping his nose on the flag of England. I believe you suggested that he should have wiped his arse on it instead? Perhaps you might consider a retraction?
Re the flag remark, was tongue in cheek (like most of my posts) however if you found it offensive I apologise for misjudging the tone of the forum/thread
Strocky said:
mcdjl said:
Seeing as that small resource rich country would have taken on its share of the debt, and it seems to be doing ok at the moment, no not really.
Oh wait a minute I'm forgetting this picture: which might make you resource rich but cash poor.
I forgot Oil was only discovered in the last 3 months Oh wait a minute I'm forgetting this picture:
which might make you resource rich but cash poor.Strocky said:
I forgot Oil was only discovered in the last 3 months
Okay, what's your view on a 5 year low in the oil price?While prices fall extraction costs will remain pretty much the same and North Sea costs are somewhere around $70 to $80 per barrel. No doubt the industry can take the long view and will continue to extract for a while but the profit, and hence the tax take, will be non existent.
Given OPEC's reluctance to cap production prices aren't likely to rise any time soon and indeed Russia's Central Bank is already working on intervention strategies for $60 per barrel and they aren't doing that for s
ts and giggles, they see that as a real possibility.There's a massive oversupply and falling demand. The UK/Scotland isn't a big producer by any measure but the price fall would hit an independent Scotland much harder than the UK.
Strocky said:
Big brave words from a supine Unionist cuckold
Do you have an answer? 
You are a yes voter I'm getting from your posts, you must have seen something on the yes groups on how they planed to help the poor. What were the powers they needed and why can't they be done currently?
A.J.M said:
Do you have an answer?
You are a yes voter I'm getting from your posts, you must have seen something on the yes groups on how they planed to help the poor. What were the powers they needed and why can't they be done currently?
I'm guessing we've met them before in a different guise.You are a yes voter I'm getting from your posts, you must have seen something on the yes groups on how they planed to help the poor. What were the powers they needed and why can't they be done currently?
Same s
t as previous posters, quips instead of genuine debate, has no problem punting out PHisms like "fixed that for you"... who else would join PH to talk about the Scottish referendum if it wasn't someone to wind us up?Strocky said:
McWigglebum4th said:
You mean a gobby idiot who can't answer questions
Big brave words from a supine Unionist cuckold kerYour total life is an utter f
king failureYou know how f
king hopeless you areYou life is a failure because of you, you and you
Westminster and the english are powerless to hold me back
Why have they held you back?
Stagecoach ( owned by Scottish independence lover - Mr B Soutar ........
Devolution of powers for England.... It will be a disaster for Stagecoach.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-30289913
So... nationalisation is bad. Privatisation is good.
Devolution of powers for England.... It will be a disaster for Stagecoach.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-30289913
So... nationalisation is bad. Privatisation is good.
Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff