Scottish Referendum / Independence - Vol 6

[HenryJM]

Edinburger said:

I've always said England needs and deserves it's own devolved parliament.

Dear God no, there is enough parliament as it stands. Scottish MPs not voting if the issue doesn't effect Scotland (ditto other areas) is all that is required.

[Welshbeef]

Edinburger said:

Pardon?

"paid by the English"?

Really? Please explain that. Is there a pot of money raised solely by "the English"?

Think about it.

Seeing at the tax is planned to be on houses >£2m they are nearly all in SE hardly any in Scotland as per QT Scottish labour leader tax raised in England to pay for Scotland.


Keep up at the back.

[andymadmak]

Edinburger said:

Pardon?

"paid by the English"?

Really? Please explain that. Is there a pot of money raised solely by "the English"?

Think about it.

Well, since Scottish politicians , SNP and LABOUR are both talking about stuff in Scotland being paid for by a Mansion tax that they themselves say will largely fall on those in the South east of England I think its you that needs to think about it!

The south east is one of the few areas of the UK that actually pays in more than it takes out of the pot. Not a problem for the people of the UNITED KINGDOM, but it will become a rather different matter if it becomes clear that the south east is being cnically used as a cash cow to pay for SNP electioneering and largesse. I suppose on one level it comes down to this.... For all the time the south east has been as wealthy as it is it has rarely if ever complained about shouldering the lions share of the burden to support the less well off areas of the UK. You might argue that it should pay even more, but thats a political point that in no way detracts from the fact that the south east already pays a shed load.
Contrast with Scot nats who were largely ignored when Scotland had little, but as soon as oil is discovered then all of a sudden it becomes Scotlands oil, and Scotlands money etc. The rest of the UK are now seen as parasites by Nats.
Its hard enough having to listen to that sort of nonsense as an Englishman, imagine how disgusted the Welsh and the Norns must be feeling!

[AstonZagato]

Edinburger said:

I've always said England needs and deserves it's own devolved parliament.

No thank you. Another layer of bureaucracy. Another layer of incompetent politicians. Jumped up councillors who think they can run a county but couldn't organise a panic in a doomed submarine. Growth of unpleasant nationalism - people wrapping themselves in meaningless flags merely to gain more power for themselves and stir up hatred and discontent to ensure their own reelection.

I've seen it in Scotland and don't want it in England.

[Welshbeef]

Edinburger said:

I've always said England needs and deserves it's own devolved parliament.

Why? C£5billion a year extra cost for what?

We have UK wide a great system of representation until hot houses were built in N Ire Wales and Scotland needlessly

100k people per MP 650 of them they vote on the needs of the country from the requirements of the constituents. Why try to make it harder than it needs to be.

[Einion Yrth]

AstonZagato said:

couldn't organise a panic in a doomed submarine.

I shall steal this phrase, if that's alright.

[Strocky]

Sway said:

arp1 said:

You haven't answered my question

The part of the union ruling right now is mixed - a large part by the tossers in Holyrood, who I believe are all Scottish, and the rest by an unweighted ballot of representatives voting in the best interests of the 100k odd constituents they represent.

Now tell me, why should Scottish representatives than London ones?

You need to recognise, like Cornwall has, that you're a country in name only. You're not. Neither is England. You're a region, sparsely populated, and therefore your needs should have the same weight as other regional groups of similar populations.

Unfortunately, you've been appeased so you have your own parliament etc. in addition to the country's proper one. But best you learn to control these ideas above your station. Otherwise you'll really understand what happens when the majority are fked off with your whining.

Thick deluded alert

[Strocky]

Welshbeef said:

She wants another £180 billion in the next parliament, paid by the English for the benefit of the Scots — this, though her nation already receives a disproportionate share of UK public spending.





Why is this fair? £36 billion EACH year for 5 years paid for by England to go to Scotland... Um bailing out Lloyds and RBS cost about the same as one year of this yet that was dammed as those vile bankers yet now they want 5x that level of funding.



Thing is she hasn't even given an idea as to what it would mean as a return we know in 3 years time following the Tory plan we will be in surplus. This deal mean we will be £180 billion additional debt the current defecit remaining and we'd have to assume the additional £36billoon a year would simply stop in 2020 I bet it wouldn't those nasty Westminster changing the boosted Barnet formulae again.
Actually they want it £180billion but also another vote and get the Yes leave and refuse to pay back any money.


Must think rUK voters are muggs

You do realise she's talking about spending £180bn within the UK for the benefit of the UK?

Don't let the facts get in the way of another wee rant against the Scots

[Big Rod]

rovermorris999 said:

Blimey! Is this thread still here? I thought there was a referendum or was I dreaming?

If the proponents of the circus would accept that those who are eligible to vote in Scotland decided that the majority of them absolutely don't want Scotland to be independent from the rest of the United Kingdom then this thread would end.

Sadly they don't, and they keep trying to chip away at it.

So those that have built a happy life around the infrastructure that is provided for us, (by those that we pay to do so), and don't want it to change are consistently harangued by those that refuse to accept the will of the people that they cohabitate with.

If I was in a flatshare and didn't like the terms and conditions, I'd move out to find somewhere more habitable.

Simple and effective.

[Rollin]

Strocky said:

Welshbeef said:

She wants another £180 billion in the next parliament, paid by the English for the benefit of the Scots — this, though her nation already receives a disproportionate share of UK public spending.





Why is this fair? £36 billion EACH year for 5 years paid for by England to go to Scotland... Um bailing out Lloyds and RBS cost about the same as one year of this yet that was dammed as those vile bankers yet now they want 5x that level of funding.



Thing is she hasn't even given an idea as to what it would mean as a return we know in 3 years time following the Tory plan we will be in surplus. This deal mean we will be £180 billion additional debt the current defecit remaining and we'd have to assume the additional £36billoon a year would simply stop in 2020 I bet it wouldn't those nasty Westminster changing the boosted Barnet formulae again.
Actually they want it £180billion but also another vote and get the Yes leave and refuse to pay back any money.


Must think rUK voters are muggs

You do realise she's talking about spending £180bn within the UK for the benefit of the UK?

Don't let the facts get in the way of another wee rant against the Scots

Is she going to put your bit in an oil fund?

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Casio-FX-730P-Vintage-LC...

[McWigglebum4th]

Strocky said:

You do realise she's talking about spending £180bn within the UK for the benefit of the UK?

And where does this extra 180 billion come from?

Strocky said:

Don't let the facts get in the way of another wee rant against the Scots

victim card

[Welshbeef]

Strocky said:

You do realise she's talking about spending £180bn within the UK for the benefit of the UK?

Don't let the facts get in the way of another wee rant against the Scots

She cannot dictate to rUK what should or shouldn't happen - she doesn't represent them.

We need RUK MPs to dictate to Holyrood what they should be doing - oh hold on that would go down well wouldn't it and they'd call that individual a freity and fiert

[arp1]

Welshbeef said:

Strocky said:

You do realise she's talking about spending £180bn within the UK for the benefit of the UK?

Don't let the facts get in the way of another wee rant against the Scots

She cannot dictate to rUK what should or shouldn't happen - she doesn't represent them.

We need RUK MPs to dictate to Holyrood what they should be doing - oh hold on that would go down well wouldn't it and they'd call that individual a freity and fiert

Does 'just call me dave' and his ilk represent Scotland though? Exactly the same idea, reversed... This country can't have it all ways and slanted in just one direction, and unfortunately that's the way it seems and the way the vast majority in ph seem to think it should be... A fair and equal partnership?

[McWigglebum4th]

arp1 said:

Does 'just call me dave' and his ilk represent Scotland though? Exactly the same idea, reversed... This country can't have it all ways and slanted in just one direction, and unfortunately that's the way it seems and the way the vast majority in ph seem to think it should be... A fair and equal partnership?

He represents 20% of the people who live in scotland

As 20% of people who live in scotland voted tory

But you probably believe that we aren't true scots as we vote tory

[McWigglebum4th]

McWigglebum4th said:

McWigglebum4th said:

arp1 said:

If the media are portraying one part of the country 'ruling' another, then what part is 'ruling' just now? Media hypocracy as usual and as we are in this rosy Union, ten what does it matter who is 'ruling' and from what part of the country?

If you don't want to be ruled by another nation then can i ask for an answer to this

Why do you hate UKIP so much?

Why is being in the EU so important?

Any chance of a sensible answer here

Or even an honest answer

Will i get an answer

Of course not

Edited by McWigglebum4th on Saturday 7th March 07:28

[arp1]

Ukip are akin to the nasty party with their racist and blame the immigrant culture and are so anti-scottish it is beyond belief, that is why I do not support them. I am mixed over the eu however for trade reasons it makes sense, however we should be able to take 'guidance' as opposed to dictated terms re legislation etc that comes from the eu.

There ye go, as the saying goes, fixed it for ye

[Troubleatmill]

arp1 said:

A fair and equal partnership?

Scotland is a region of the United Kingdom.
It has exactly the same representative rights and ratios to every other region.

There 650 seats divvied up per 90,000 or so people of the United Kingdom.
How do you make it more fair and equal than that?

There have also been a lot of very prominent Scots in the top jobs over the years too.


You need to explain why you don't the this as fair and equal.

[McWigglebum4th]

arp1 said:

Ukip are akin to the nasty party with their racist and blame the immigrant culture and are so anti-scottish it is beyond belief, that is why I do not support them. I am mixed over the eu however for trade reasons it makes sense, however we should be able to take 'guidance' as opposed to dictated terms re legislation etc that comes from the eu.

There ye go, as the saying goes, fixed it for ye

Care to point out UKIPs anti Scottish policies?

So you are mixed over the EU

you believe it is good for trade but you believe we should leave the UK despite we sell more to England then we do to the EU

[Sway]

Troubleatmill said:

arp1 said:

A fair and equal partnership?

Scotland is a region of the United Kingdom.
It has exactly the same representative rights and ratios to every other region.

There 650 seats divvied up per 90,000 or so people of the United Kingdom.
How do you make it more fair and equal than that?

There have also been a lot of very prominent Scots in the top jobs over the years too.


You need to explain why you don't the this as fair and equal.

Exactly.

We in England bought you. We'd stopped trying to conquer you militarily, and instead thrashed you economically. Your leaders made stupid mistakes like Darien, and we had you by the balls. Also meant our Queen's descendants would always be your monarch.

As is usual, when an economic takeover occurs, we did what we could to make you still feel important - you weren't. You were poor, unable to trade anywhere near as well as us, but had resources we wanted. So we let you have some concessions that made you feel good.

That doesn't mean you were, or are now, that important. You have a tiny population, and a poor economy (that has only moderately changed over the last 30 years).

If it were a union of equals, then half of parliament would be Scottish. That fact alone shows what a sham that statement was.

Now dry your eyes petal, and recognise that regardless of how much stamping of feet or whining, you're just another region whose needs should be balanced against the whole. If that works out well for Scotland feel lucky. If it doesn't then suck it up like everywhere else does.

You have more representation and power than you deserve. That has been accepted by the wider population as they didn't really know what was happening. The vast majority weren't aware of Barnett. Nor the West Lothian question. Now they are. If you remained grateful then things would have been fine, but you've pushed and insulted and whinged. The mood is changing...

[AstonZagato]

Strocky said:

Thick deluded alert

Thanks for announcing your arrival. We look forward to your contribution.