Osbourne Announces Benefit Changes for manifesto
Discussion
Hackney said:
Tell me how the public sector caused the "macroshift in world economics"
Yet they are forced (by those who did) to pay the costs of it.
How is that an answer, you need to react to circumstance, and not stick your fingers in your ears, well one finger and the other hand out grasping for more.Yet they are forced (by those who did) to pay the costs of it.
The state is too large, it would be a lot smaller if G Brown and T Blair hadn't inflated the scale of it massively.
rich1231 said:
Hackney said:
Tell me how the public sector caused the "macroshift in world economics"
Yet they are forced (by those who did) to pay the costs of it.
How is that an answer, you need to react to circumstance, and not stick your fingers in your ears, well one finger and the other hand out grasping for more.Yet they are forced (by those who did) to pay the costs of it.
The state is too large, it would be a lot smaller if G Brown and T Blair hadn't inflated the scale of it massively.
"the state is too large" what does that even mean? And how do midwife wages impact on the size (large or otherwise) of "the state".
Or don't pay midwifes a decent wage, watch them leave and go into private sector admin where the pay is better and the hours regular. Meanwhile infant mortality races towards 3rd world levels.
I'm sick to death of this "we're all in this together" when the top x% caused and continue to cause the problems yet play no part in the solution.
Not just the banks who immediately went back to business as usual, but the companies who syphon money out of the country in "licencing" fees back to Seattle or "UK sales" going through an office in Dublin, or Vodaphone's European operation "managed" from a one man office in Luxemburg.
But continue to go after the people on benefits; the low paid; ones asking for a living wage for the pittance of difference that makes to the UK economy.
f
k the midwifes. fk the nurses. fk the teachers. fk the people doing the same job they did three years ago but now on their 5th different employer paying them 60% of what they were getting while Veolia or Group 4 subcontract and subcontract to their hearts content. Those people only keep things working.
Not just the banks who immediately went back to business as usual, but the companies who syphon money out of the country in "licencing" fees back to Seattle or "UK sales" going through an office in Dublin, or Vodaphone's European operation "managed" from a one man office in Luxemburg.
But continue to go after the people on benefits; the low paid; ones asking for a living wage for the pittance of difference that makes to the UK economy.
f
k the midwifes. fk the nurses. fk the teachers. fk the people doing the same job they did three years ago but now on their 5th different employer paying them 60% of what they were getting while Veolia or Group 4 subcontract and subcontract to their hearts content. Those people only keep things working.Hackney said:
What? Respond to circumstances that you didn't create, that are completely outside your influence, that you neither asked for or wanted.
Despite that, the circumstances nevertheless exist. Denial will not change that.Hackney said:
"the state is too large" what does that even mean?
It means too many taking out of the system compared to those paying in. It means that the system is unsustainable in its current form & therefore needs to change so as to become sustainable.Hackney said:
And how do midwife wages impact on the size (large or otherwise) of "the state".
Public sector wages have to be paid and therefore have direct impact on the system's sustainability.Hackney said:
Or don't pay midwifes a decent wage, watch them leave and go into private sector admin where the pay is better and the hours regular.
If there is sufficient capacity to accommodate them, then I'm all in favour. I doubt the private sector can match the pension provision, btw. The alternative is that the market can decide the rate, as per how it works outside the public sector.Hackney said:
Meanwhile infant mortality races towards 3rd world levels.
Nice soundbite, but if the midwife simply works for another employer as you've just suggested then how does this happen?
Hackney said:
I'm sick to death of this "we're all in this together" when the top x% caused and continue to cause the problems yet play no part in the solution..
Well except for the 1/3 of all income tax they pay of course (from the top 1% of tax payers).But no they are not paying their fair share so the obvious solution is to raise taxes until they all leave, that will show them
XJ Flyer said:
To which the answer was an increase in wage rates and an increase in social security benefits together with tax cuts for industry in an obviously Fordist economic system in which the cash pumped into the economy didn't just run out again in the form of being spent on imports.
Where's the magic money tree to fund increased expenditure with reduced taxation?Rovinghawk said:
XJ Flyer said:
To which the answer was an increase in wage rates and an increase in social security benefits together with tax cuts for industry in an obviously Fordist economic system in which the cash pumped into the economy didn't just run out again in the form of being spent on imports.
Where's the magic money tree to fund increased expenditure with reduced taxation?sidicks said:
Fittster said:
Because they know you're wrong on that point.
"governments with the power to issue their own currency are always solvent, and can afford to buy anything for sale in their domestic unit of account even though they may face inflationary and political constraints"
http://www.levyinstitute.org/pubs/wp_778.pdf
And?"governments with the power to issue their own currency are always solvent, and can afford to buy anything for sale in their domestic unit of account even though they may face inflationary and political constraints"
http://www.levyinstitute.org/pubs/wp_778.pdf
Have you seen the extent of the borrowing requirement in the next few years? That's not just new borrowing, that's refinancing existing debt that has matured. Who is going to purchase this (and at what price) if they think the government hasn't got spending / inflation under control...?
Justayellowbadge said:
Trade barriers and re-opening the pits?
Amazing.
Global Free Market Economy.Way to go if the aim is down the tubes that is.Amazing.
www.citizen.org/Page.aspx?pid=2126
Gargamel said:
Fittster said:
He's made the situation worse so I don't see how it can be judged as a qualified success.
We have the highest economic growth in the Western Economies. Unemployment has fallen substantially, the deficit is reducing, our total Debt remains below 80% of GDP If you had said this is where we would be in 2014 during the last election campaign they would have had a landslide. To achieve this kind of stability after a shaky start and hampered by a coalition partner that does not get it. I think is a decent achievement.
Additional Personal tax allowances for everyone have lifted to £10,000 tax free
I think he has done a good job, but I recognise not everyone agrees.
Earnings aren't rising as fast as inflation.
Now benefits won't be rising as fast as inflation.
Everyone will be poorer with the exception of a very small number of high rate tax payers and people who squirrel money away into obscure pension products to avoid tax.
Nice to know we're all in this together.
Now benefits won't be rising as fast as inflation.
Everyone will be poorer with the exception of a very small number of high rate tax payers and people who squirrel money away into obscure pension products to avoid tax.
Nice to know we're all in this together.
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