UKIP - The Future - Volume 3
Discussion
Wombat3 said:
Classic UKIP MO...and a load of b
ks. What has my opinion/observation that the vast majority of UKIPers I have come across/observed simply aren't interested in any compromise and , in very large part, seem to ignore the practicalities of the current situation, got to do with the flat earth nutters of yester-year?
In peacetime politics there is rarely, if ever, not a contrary view that may hold some validity. Successful government also always features compromise and recognition that there is always an opposing view. Same works in most businesses funnily enough.
I am not saying that some of UKIP's views are not valid or without merit, but I do find some of them highly and unrealistically simplistic and the delivery of them antagonistic, overly aggressive, and therefore potentially destabilising. I have seldom (possibly never) seen anyone of a UKIP persuasion (on this forum or elsewhere) say anything positive about anything anyone else had to say or indeed what the current government has done. The overriding theme from UKIP is "ITS ALL CRAP AND WE WANT TO BLOW IT ALL UP!!! " Whoop, whoop, won't that be a grand wheeze?
Well, actually, no it fking won't thanks very much!
I am also bored of hearing negative bks about how st it all is and equally just amazed at how short some people's memories are, and how little patience and tolerance some people seem to have. Such an approach leads nowhere IMO.
(And, for the record, neither do I accept the (apparent) UKIP premise that all Westminster politicians are self serving, lying scum & elitist tts who couldn't do a day's work if their lives depended on it!).
Would it be safe to assume you will not vote for them then?ks. What has my opinion/observation that the vast majority of UKIPers I have come across/observed simply aren't interested in any compromise and , in very large part, seem to ignore the practicalities of the current situation, got to do with the flat earth nutters of yester-year?In peacetime politics there is rarely, if ever, not a contrary view that may hold some validity. Successful government also always features compromise and recognition that there is always an opposing view. Same works in most businesses funnily enough.
I am not saying that some of UKIP's views are not valid or without merit, but I do find some of them highly and unrealistically simplistic and the delivery of them antagonistic, overly aggressive, and therefore potentially destabilising. I have seldom (possibly never) seen anyone of a UKIP persuasion (on this forum or elsewhere) say anything positive about anything anyone else had to say or indeed what the current government has done. The overriding theme from UKIP is "ITS ALL CRAP AND WE WANT TO BLOW IT ALL UP!!! " Whoop, whoop, won't that be a grand wheeze?
Well, actually, no it f
king won't thanks very much!I am also bored of hearing negative b
ks about how st it all is and equally just amazed at how short some people's memories are, and how little patience and tolerance some people seem to have. Such an approach leads nowhere IMO.(And, for the record, neither do I accept the (apparent) UKIP premise that all Westminster politicians are self serving, lying scum & elitist t
ts who couldn't do a day's work if their lives depended on it!). Can I make a suggestion? Well I am going to anyway.... Instead of continually moaning about how much you dislike / disagree with UKIP, their policies and their members...why not go onto the Tory thread I started for you and bang on about the Tory positives instead?
You have been banging the same drum since I came to this section of PH, about 3 yrs now IIRC, surely even you now realise you are wasting your time on here and are getting nowhere fast.
Wombat3 said:
IMO UKIP clearly doesn't do compromise & isn't interested in negotiating anything with anyone. It wants what it wants & fk the other 85%. Nearly as bad as the SNP IMO. That kind of approach to anything just never does it for me (and, rarely if ever works either that I can recall).
Happy?
That's the trouble with democracy though - a party with 15% of the vote has no real say. So UKIP are nothing to worry about...k the other 85%. Nearly as bad as the SNP IMO. That kind of approach to anything just never does it for me (and, rarely if ever works either that I can recall).Happy?
brenflys777 said:
Wombat3 said:
steveT350C said:
We have a contract with CMD. He has failed, therefore, according to his contract, we must kick him out... 
Because clearly the alternative would be better That article, that contract is/was a stupid thing to do but then sadly its the kind of lowest denominator politics that politicians in this country have to resort to because large chunks of the electorate are so bloody thick that's the kind of crap you have to come up with in order to "out -crap" the other guy.
It then suits an agenda to look back on that & go "ooooh
we must kick him out!!". That in itself is infantile, at best. I'm only interested in what happens next & personally, I've got mouths to feed & businesses to run. I need/want stability & practicality. Anyone who thinks that what the government does is easy, thinks all the country's problems could even be half way solved in four years and reduces it all down to black & white paths/options simply has no f
king clue what they are talking about IMO.Edited by Wombat3 on Friday 28th November 19:01
Or maybe the renegotiation is the bit he intends to dismiss after election
Cameron's only hope is there are enough people who are so scared of Ed Milliband that they vote for Cameron because they haven't got the spine to do anything other than be petrified. Sad.
Yep, more binary rubbish.
If you can't see the difference between (granted highly ill-advisedly because of the legal situation) setting an immigration target and then acknowledge/ recognise that at least some of the figures involved are down to the relative economic success of the UK; and a clear commitment to legislate for and then deliver a referendum then I really can't help you.
Equally, if the thought of Ed Miliband and Ed Balls (possibly propped up by Alex Salmond) does not petrify you then I'd guess you must have one of those indestructible jobs (and pension schemes) that just keeps on delivering a salary, rain or shine . In which case, lucky you.
mrpurple said:
Wombat3 said:
Classic UKIP MO...and a load of bks. What has my opinion/observation that the vast majority of UKIPers I have come across/observed simply aren't interested in any compromise and , in very large part, seem to ignore the practicalities of the current situation, got to do with the flat earth nutters of yester-year?
In peacetime politics there is rarely, if ever, not a contrary view that may hold some validity. Successful government also always features compromise and recognition that there is always an opposing view. Same works in most businesses funnily enough.
I am not saying that some of UKIP's views are not valid or without merit, but I do find some of them highly and unrealistically simplistic and the delivery of them antagonistic, overly aggressive, and therefore potentially destabilising. I have seldom (possibly never) seen anyone of a UKIP persuasion (on this forum or elsewhere) say anything positive about anything anyone else had to say or indeed what the current government has done. The overriding theme from UKIP is "ITS ALL CRAP AND WE WANT TO BLOW IT ALL UP!!! " Whoop, whoop, won't that be a grand wheeze?
Well, actually, no it fking won't thanks very much!
I am also bored of hearing negative bks about how st it all is and equally just amazed at how short some people's memories are, and how little patience and tolerance some people seem to have. Such an approach leads nowhere IMO.
(And, for the record, neither do I accept the (apparent) UKIP premise that all Westminster politicians are self serving, lying scum & elitist tts who couldn't do a day's work if their lives depended on it!).
Would it be safe to assume you will not vote for them then?ks. What has my opinion/observation that the vast majority of UKIPers I have come across/observed simply aren't interested in any compromise and , in very large part, seem to ignore the practicalities of the current situation, got to do with the flat earth nutters of yester-year?In peacetime politics there is rarely, if ever, not a contrary view that may hold some validity. Successful government also always features compromise and recognition that there is always an opposing view. Same works in most businesses funnily enough.
I am not saying that some of UKIP's views are not valid or without merit, but I do find some of them highly and unrealistically simplistic and the delivery of them antagonistic, overly aggressive, and therefore potentially destabilising. I have seldom (possibly never) seen anyone of a UKIP persuasion (on this forum or elsewhere) say anything positive about anything anyone else had to say or indeed what the current government has done. The overriding theme from UKIP is "ITS ALL CRAP AND WE WANT TO BLOW IT ALL UP!!! " Whoop, whoop, won't that be a grand wheeze?
Well, actually, no it f
king won't thanks very much!I am also bored of hearing negative b
ks about how st it all is and equally just amazed at how short some people's memories are, and how little patience and tolerance some people seem to have. Such an approach leads nowhere IMO.(And, for the record, neither do I accept the (apparent) UKIP premise that all Westminster politicians are self serving, lying scum & elitist t
ts who couldn't do a day's work if their lives depended on it!). Can I make a suggestion? Well I am going to anyway.... Instead of continually moaning about how much you dislike / disagree with UKIP, their policies and their members...why not go onto the Tory thread I started for you and bang on about the Tory positives instead?
You have been banging the same drum since I came to this section of PH, about 3 yrs now IIRC, surely even you now realise you are wasting your time on here and are getting nowhere fast.
Wombat3 said:
Classic UKIP MO...and a load of bks. What has my opinion/observation that the vast majority of UKIPers I have come across/observed simply aren't interested in any compromise and , in very large part, seem to ignore the practicalities of the current situation, got to do with the flat earth nutters of yester-year?
In peacetime politics there is rarely, if ever, not a contrary view that may hold some validity. Successful government also always features compromise and recognition that there is always an opposing view. Same works in most businesses funnily enough.
I am not saying that some of UKIP's views are not valid or without merit, but I do find some of them highly and unrealistically simplistic and the delivery of them antagonistic, overly aggressive, and therefore potentially destabilising. I have seldom (possibly never) seen anyone of a UKIP persuasion (on this forum or elsewhere) say anything positive about anything anyone else had to say or indeed what the current government has done. The overriding theme from UKIP is "ITS ALL CRAP AND WE WANT TO BLOW IT ALL UP!!! " Whoop, whoop, won't that be a grand wheeze?
Well, actually, no it fking won't thanks very much!
I am also bored of hearing negative bks about how st it all is and equally just amazed at how short some people's memories are, and how little patience and tolerance some people seem to have. Such an approach leads nowhere IMO.
(And, for the record, neither do I accept the (apparent) UKIP premise that all Westminster politicians are self serving, lying scum & elitist tts who couldn't do a day's work if their lives depended on it!).
can you slow your hyperactivity down a notch or three.ks. What has my opinion/observation that the vast majority of UKIPers I have come across/observed simply aren't interested in any compromise and , in very large part, seem to ignore the practicalities of the current situation, got to do with the flat earth nutters of yester-year?In peacetime politics there is rarely, if ever, not a contrary view that may hold some validity. Successful government also always features compromise and recognition that there is always an opposing view. Same works in most businesses funnily enough.
I am not saying that some of UKIP's views are not valid or without merit, but I do find some of them highly and unrealistically simplistic and the delivery of them antagonistic, overly aggressive, and therefore potentially destabilising. I have seldom (possibly never) seen anyone of a UKIP persuasion (on this forum or elsewhere) say anything positive about anything anyone else had to say or indeed what the current government has done. The overriding theme from UKIP is "ITS ALL CRAP AND WE WANT TO BLOW IT ALL UP!!! " Whoop, whoop, won't that be a grand wheeze?
Well, actually, no it f
king won't thanks very much!I am also bored of hearing negative b
ks about how st it all is and equally just amazed at how short some people's memories are, and how little patience and tolerance some people seem to have. Such an approach leads nowhere IMO.(And, for the record, neither do I accept the (apparent) UKIP premise that all Westminster politicians are self serving, lying scum & elitist t
ts who couldn't do a day's work if their lives depended on it!). you say you run businesses and employ people and don't want uncertainty.
Perhaps you are making shedloads and don't wish to endanger that.
Alternatively, perhaps you are over extended and terrified about losing the lot.
what ever, you are not able to discuss this topic in any rational manner without hyperbole, swearing and, ranting..
frankly, you are not a good advert for an opposition.
Wombat3 said:
Whoop, whoop, lets blow it all up, a grand wheeze that will be!
I know it's been a bad day to be a conservative but this is just wibble.
Wombat3 said:
Yep, more binary rubbish.
Like true or false, truth or lies, etc Wombat3 said:
If you can't see the difference between (STUFF) an immigration target (STUFF) and a clear commitment to legislate for and then deliver a referendum then I really can't help you.
I've cut some bits out, but if you can't see the similarity between making a promise to do something on immigration - if we voted for him and making a promise to deliver a referendum - if we vote for him, then you need to get help rather than offer it. Without your faith in Cameron, it's necessary to look at the evidence. Four years plus of failure to deliver on promises is a good indicator that the next few years with conservatives would be equally disappointing.
Wombat3 said:
Equally, if the thought of Ed Miliband and Ed Balls (possibly propped up by Alex Salmond) does not petrify you then I'd guess you must have one of those indestructible jobs (and pension schemes) that just keeps on delivering a salary, rain or shine . In which case, lucky you.
No, I don't work for local government or the EU Commission! No it doesn't petrify me, Labour were actually less financially damaging for my family than Cameron, but worse for the country. On balance, Cameron's promise to increase foreign aid to levels above the Police budget for the UK means that I'd be amazed if Labour are a much worse prospect.My local conservative candidate Lucy Allen and adjacent MP Mark Pritchard could be better prospects but they both seem ok, but neither of them will give a comment on Cameron's contract to the voters, this might be one of the times a conservative supporter has to think about the country, the party and then loyalty to a leader who has lost all their credibility.
egor110 said:
It's interesting that the pro ukip people are happy to support ukip yet don't try to persuade others to , yet supporters of every other party can't wait to come here and say why ukip is bad and we should vote conservative/labour.
A Sign of a True ProfessionalA true professional is confident in their product and abilities to deliver what they promise. A true professional does not feel the need to attack a competitor and instead focuses on what makes him more professional and a better choice than any other choice.
A true professional does not respond out of fear, but instead out of confidence. In the end, a true professional will beat his competitor more times than he loses to them.
From an old marketing assignment I did a few years back but still relevant IMO.
egor110 said:
It's interesting that the pro ukip people are happy to support ukip yet don't try to persuade others to , yet supporters of every other party can't wait to come here and say why ukip is bad and we should vote conservative/labour.
You are kidding aren't you?I have a horrible feeling not. If this forum is evidence to the contrary, my experience is the Kippers are the one to do the haranguing when eating out or whatever
JustAnotherLogin said:
egor110 said:
It's interesting that the pro ukip people are happy to support ukip yet don't try to persuade others to , yet supporters of every other party can't wait to come here and say why ukip is bad and we should vote conservative/labour.
You are kidding aren't you?I have a horrible feeling not. If this forum is evidence to the contrary, my experience is the Kippers are the one to do the haranguing when eating out or whatever
You don't get pro con/lab threads and ukipers saying why they are idiots for voting blue/red.
JustAnotherLogin said:
egor110 said:
It's interesting that the pro ukip people are happy to support ukip yet don't try to persuade others to , yet supporters of every other party can't wait to come here and say why ukip is bad and we should vote conservative/labour.
You are kidding aren't you?I have a horrible feeling not. If this forum is evidence to the contrary, my experience is the Kippers are the one to do the haranguing when eating out or whatever
Wombat3 said:
mrpurple said:
Wombat3 said:
mrpurple said:
Wombat3 said:
What he said, very clearly, was that he was ruling nothing out. That is the correct position from which in which to go into any discussion/negotiation IMO. The EU know what the issues are, they don't need to have them spelled out.
Perhaps they don't but if they know already there is no harm in stating what his red lines are, concisely, openly and honestly to all and sundry especially those he may want to vote for him......If I do not get X,Z, then I will recommend leaving.... You might find he will get a lot more respect if he did....so in that respect I hope he doesn't so his past history of empty promises and pledges will be all we have to judge him on.
An archaic and antagonistic approach to any negotiation which seldom, if ever, works because the other party will simply say no and then one of you, eventually, has to retreat or no deal happens. While that clearly would suit the Kipperati, then again, you don't represent the other 85%.
Edited by XJ Flyer on Friday 28th November 22:46
Wombat3 said:
Because clearly the alternative would be better
That article, that contract is/was a stupid thing to do but then sadly its the kind of lowest denominator politics that politicians in this country have to resort to because large chunks of the electorate are so bloody thick that's the kind of crap you have to come up with in order to "out -crap" the other guy.
It then suits an agenda to look back on that & go "ooooh we must kick him out!!". That in itself is infantile, at best.
I'm only interested in what happens next & personally, I've got mouths to feed & businesses to run. I need/want stability & practicality. Anyone who thinks that what the government does is easy, thinks all the country's problems could even be half way solved in four years and reduces it all down to black & white paths/options simply has no fking clue what they are talking about IMO.
The electorate are stupid, so politicians must lie to them and deceive them by making promises they surely can't keep - and that's OK?That article, that contract is/was a stupid thing to do but then sadly its the kind of lowest denominator politics that politicians in this country have to resort to because large chunks of the electorate are so bloody thick that's the kind of crap you have to come up with in order to "out -crap" the other guy.
It then suits an agenda to look back on that & go "ooooh
we must kick him out!!". That in itself is infantile, at best. I'm only interested in what happens next & personally, I've got mouths to feed & businesses to run. I need/want stability & practicality. Anyone who thinks that what the government does is easy, thinks all the country's problems could even be half way solved in four years and reduces it all down to black & white paths/options simply has no f
king clue what they are talking about IMO.Edited by Wombat3 on Friday 28th November 19:01
TKF said:
mrdemon said:
one reason to vote ukip
black Friday !!!! who needs it, look who is buying and fighting over crap
Just wow. So we leave EU and all of "them" will suddenly disappear?black Friday !!!! who needs it, look who is buying and fighting over crap
. But if and I say a Big IF we are allowed to close and police our borders hopefully we would be able to check up on who is coming in and who is going out.Anyway Im pleased to tell you that I did not have to fight anyone tonight in my local ASDA, the 6 pack of Bog rolls I bought went unchallenged
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