UKIP - The Future - Volume 3
Discussion
Mrr T said:
So with potential 2/3 years to go before a In/Out referendum its to early to have a plan?
Yes I lambaste UKIP for going 20 years and still having no idea how to leave the EU.
Yes I applaud Owen Patterson for publicly presenting a plan. Remember its not Conservative policy to leave the EU, Conservative policy is to renegotiate and then have an In/Out referendum On which Cameron is likely to support the In option.
even though I have explained what a 'plan' is you don't understand, so no point to discuss with you.Yes I lambaste UKIP for going 20 years and still having no idea how to leave the EU.
Yes I applaud Owen Patterson for publicly presenting a plan. Remember its not Conservative policy to leave the EU, Conservative policy is to renegotiate and then have an In/Out referendum On which Cameron is likely to support the In option.
zygalski said:
I would like to take this opportunity to wish all my fellow EU members a merry Christmas & happy New Year 
me too, and good luck with the new European Empire (the old ones didn't do too well).Even though I descend from central European ancestry, I have no wish for England to be part of it.
XJ Flyer said:
Firstly assuming we are going back to where we were before we joined the EU we never actually had any 'type approval' rules of our own or at least any which made it any more difficult to put an American manufactured vehicle on the road than one made here or in Europe.
Actually we signed the United Nations Economic Committee for Europe "Agreement concerning the adoption of uniform technical prescriptions for wheeled vehicles, equipment and parts which can be fitted and/or be used on wheeled vehicles and the conditions for reciprocal recognition of approvals granted on the basis of these prescriptions", or the '1958 Agreement' to its friends, in 1963; 10 years before we joined the EU. That 1958 agreement is now at the heart of World Forum for Harmonization of Vehicle Regulations efforts to develop a single set of global technical requirements so that any vehicle can be sold in North America or the Rest of the World.Besides what the f
k does the situation before we joined the EU have to do with anything? The only relevant situation will be the one at the time of your fantasy being executed: you're not suddenly going to undo 40 years of consensus that vehicle regulations are a good thing. As sure as night follows day, domestic regulations will be introduced, probably by adopting the existing EU regulations in full anyway. said:
As for my ideas of how to run an economy under that situation the policy was mostly based on that idea if it is sold here then it is made here.Which is how we ended up with car manufacturing operations like Ford at Dagenham and truck component manufacture like Cummins engine plant at Shotts etc.That isn't fortress mentality it is/was actually just a pragmatic form of looking after the national interest.
That isn't how we ended up with Dagenham. Dagenham existed because it was far harder to transport parts and vehicles even around the UK, let alone transatlantic in anything like a reasonable scale. Cummins' Darlington plant was a domestic flop, which was only just kept afloat by exports to Mexico.Nowadays we have 44t Artics, we have 747s, we have Maersk Triple Es and above all we have containers. We have complex engines that require global supply chains in order to build them at anything close to the necessary scale.
As for your comments regarding R and D costs being recovered.As usual in the case of the pro EU cause you seem to have conveniently missed the point,that in a trade deficit situation,there is more chance of recovering those costs in a protected domestic market.Than by keeping access to the obviously less valuable EU market at all costs.
You cannot begin to compare the 1920s and the 1950s with 2015. In any event the periods you're imagining never even existed liked that in the first place.
And the greatest irony of all is that those UK plants were at the expense of Detroit jobs. But because the profits of Ford of Britain flowed back to Henry Ford in the States, the American economy as a whole was better off. Somehow I doubt you would be praising the many British companies who bring billions back into the UK every year from their overseas operations.
Do you think Henry Ford was paying $5 a day so his workers could afford one of his cars?
said:
As for that idea supposedly 'throwing away thousands of years' of trade links we never actually joined the EEC/EU until 1973 so how does that translate as 'thousands of years' in your view.
Free trade goes back long before the first protectionists came along. Civilisations in China, India, South East Asia, the Middle East, the Mediterranean and Northern Europe flourished through the free exchange of goods and ideas. You're proposing to ignore everything mankind has learned over millennia.Edited by ninja-lewis on Wednesday 24th December 16:35
TKF said:
Privately educated ex-bankers married to immigrants. Y'know, men of the people.
there you go again, more MSM lead crap.Farage has never been a banker, worked for a bank or anything of the sort, he was a metals trader (commodity markets), if that translates to banker in your understanding, then you need to go back to school.
Look, if you can't think for yourself and can only quote crap from MSM and twater, just give up now.
Scuffers said:
there you go again, more MSM lead crap.
Farage has never been a banker, worked for a bank or anything of the sort, he was a metals trader (commodity markets), if that translates to banker in your understanding, then you need to go back to school.
Look, if you can't think for yourself and can only quote crap from MSM and twater, just give up now.
Farage has never been a banker, worked for a bank or anything of the sort, he was a metals trader (commodity markets), if that translates to banker in your understanding, then you need to go back to school.
Look, if you can't think for yourself and can only quote crap from MSM and twater, just give up now.
Banks Farage Worked For said:
Initially, he joined the American commodity brokerage firm Drexel Burnham Lambert,[16] transferring to Credit Lyonnais Rouse in 1986.[16] He joined Refco in 1994, and Natexis Metals in 2003
Drexel was an investment bank, disgraced and forced into bankruptcy. Farage was a banker there.Credit Lyonnaise was a French bank. Almost bankrupt in 1993. Farage was a banker there.
Refco, investment bank, bankrupt 2005 after fraudulent accounting. Farage was a banker there.
Natexis, French investment bank. Farage was a banker there.
Cor blimey, people make lots of slurs against Farage, however describing him as an ex-banker seems pretty much bang on the money.
Interesting as to what is going on in the majority of the media of late. The almost hysterical attempts to smear UKIP , or anything remotely associated with them is akin to a circus, some, or even a lot of it, downright pathetic, and of very dubious authenticity.
The main parties, and those in their pockets are scared witless of the potential of a governement that reflects the interestss of people at large, and not unelected , unknown Brussels autocrats.
Well, upon them be it, because if we end up with that oaf Milliband in government, we will have a full blown Gerrymandered Parliament, a Gov't with no basis in democracy, something I find truly lamentable and more than a little scary.
The main parties, and those in their pockets are scared witless of the potential of a governement that reflects the interestss of people at large, and not unelected , unknown Brussels autocrats.
Well, upon them be it, because if we end up with that oaf Milliband in government, we will have a full blown Gerrymandered Parliament, a Gov't with no basis in democracy, something I find truly lamentable and more than a little scary.
Scuffers said:
lame
yes, several investment banks have commodity trading arms (in fact they almost all do) but that does not mean commodity brokerage is banking.
Thats like calling an estate agent a banker (as a lot of them are owned by banks)
Forgive me being blunt, however the debate isn't over what job title Farage held at the investment banks in which he worked.yes, several investment banks have commodity trading arms (in fact they almost all do) but that does not mean commodity brokerage is banking.
Thats like calling an estate agent a banker (as a lot of them are owned by banks)
TKF appeared to be making the point, for whatever reason, that Farage comes from a particular background.
We can all have our opinions on how relevant that is. However, to try and paint Farage as anything but what the public would term a 'banker' (however much this may be a misnomer for his work in trading), is arguing black is white.
Farage was fully embedded in the City as part of the establishment (whatever that is). I don't think that's either here or there, but whatever you care, it's a fact.
Kippers are funny. They pick on a tiny detail to discredit a post but ignore the real issue.
Farage claimed taxpayer funded expenses for a rent free office and refused to have them independently audited. "Actually they get an allowance, not expenses"
Farage isn't a man of the people. He is a 4 term MEP and he is a privately educated ex-banker married to an immigrant. "Actually he was only working for the commodities trading arm of several different banks"
Farage claimed taxpayer funded expenses for a rent free office and refused to have them independently audited. "Actually they get an allowance, not expenses"
Farage isn't a man of the people. He is a 4 term MEP and he is a privately educated ex-banker married to an immigrant. "Actually he was only working for the commodities trading arm of several different banks"
Cheese Mechanic said:
Interesting as to what is going on in the majority of the media of late. The almost hysterical attempts to smear UKIP , or anything remotely associated with them is akin to a circus, some, or even a lot of it, downright pathetic, and of very dubious authenticity.
.
Got any links to these 'hysterical attempts to smear UKIP'?.
TKF said:
Kippers are funny. They pick on a tiny detail to discredit a post but ignore the real issue.
Farage claimed taxpayer funded expenses for a rent free office and refused to have them independently audited. "Actually they get an allowance, not expenses"
Farage isn't a man of the people. He is a 4 term MEP and he is a privately educated ex-banker married to an immigrant. "Actually he was only working for the commodities trading arm of several different banks"
The only 'issues' there are in your head, which is a place I have no wish to explore.Farage claimed taxpayer funded expenses for a rent free office and refused to have them independently audited. "Actually they get an allowance, not expenses"
Farage isn't a man of the people. He is a 4 term MEP and he is a privately educated ex-banker married to an immigrant. "Actually he was only working for the commodities trading arm of several different banks"
that's pathetic, on so many levels.
if you use that benchmark, half the country are bankers then?
and since when is working in the city being part of the establishment? (I used to work in the city, and I never could have been described as part of the establishment).
Look, it's a pretty childish brush to tar somebody with when you have F*ck all else to throw at them.
the simple fact that the man actually will talk to anybody, and answer the questions put to him rather than weasle around clearly really upsets some of you?
if you use that benchmark, half the country are bankers then?
and since when is working in the city being part of the establishment? (I used to work in the city, and I never could have been described as part of the establishment).
Look, it's a pretty childish brush to tar somebody with when you have F*ck all else to throw at them.
the simple fact that the man actually will talk to anybody, and answer the questions put to him rather than weasle around clearly really upsets some of you?
zygalski said:
I don't have an immigrant wife who stole a secretarial job any half-decent British born person could have done.
Does that make me more Kipper than Farage?
A list of the things you 'don't have' would take all day.Does that make me more Kipper than Farage?
What is it YOU believe in?
Very boring to see you sad sacks attempt personal attacks rather than telling us what you stand for.
Scuffers said:
that's pathetic, on so many levels.
if you use that benchmark, half the country are bankers then?
and since when is working in the city being part of the establishment? (I used to work in the city, and I never could have been described as part of the establishment).
Look, it's a pretty childish brush to tar somebody with when you have F*ck all else to throw at them.
the simple fact that the man actually will talk to anybody, and answer the questions put to him rather than weasle around clearly really upsets some of you?
I don't understand what you mean by tarring with the same brush and throwing things at Farage?if you use that benchmark, half the country are bankers then?
and since when is working in the city being part of the establishment? (I used to work in the city, and I never could have been described as part of the establishment).
Look, it's a pretty childish brush to tar somebody with when you have F*ck all else to throw at them.
the simple fact that the man actually will talk to anybody, and answer the questions put to him rather than weasle around clearly really upsets some of you?
I don't see his past work at investments banks as a negative. Frankly I don't care what he used to do.
Why would you think otherwise?
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