UKIP - The Future - Volume 3

[Esseesse]

JustAnotherLogin said:

What I want for renegotiation and what we might get are different things.

As I have said before, if new immigrants cannot claim benefits for 5 years then I could live with that. That is I believe achievable.

I believe that the EU is one of those things where the restriction of benefits you mention would boost it's support in the short term. However once implemented the focus would go on to the next thing and sentiment would be back to where we are now.

A bit like how people who live off retail therapy are never satisfied, next month they will find something else to buy that they think they want just as much.

[Gaspode]

PRTVR said:

If it is achievable, why has it not been achieved ? You really have to judge future possible achievements against what happened in the past, nothing.

I didn't realise the UK had already had negotiations to restrict the right of foreign nationals to claim benefits. When was this attempted?

[JustAnotherLogin]

Scuffers said:

JustAnotherLogin said:

What I want for renegotiation and what we might get are different things.

As I have said before, if new immigrants cannot claim benefits for 5 years then I could live with that. That is I believe achievable.

that it?

so, if camoron gets that and nothing else you will be happy?

you don't care about the effects of immigration on the NHS? (NHS tourism)
or the lack of transparency that the EU budget has not been signed off for the 19th year in a row?
or the ever increasing financial demands by the EU to prop up failing states and programmes?
or the CAP?
Right-to-Buy?

the list goes on, but that's all fine by you?

Edited by Scuffers on Friday 30th January 08:30

Do you want to go back up and re-read what I said about what I want, what I think is achievable and what I would accept.

I've already said- on this page- that I care about other stuff. But I am realistic - more so than the current UKIP policies

[Scuffers]

JustAnotherLogin said:

Do you want to go back up and re-read what I said about what I want, what I think is achievable and what I would accept.

I've already said- on this page- that I care about other stuff. But I am realistic - more so than the current UKIP policies

That's a cop out.

Look at what you said about the UKIP 100 stuff....

Now explain you 180 attitude towards you list.

[PRTVR]

Gaspode said:

PRTVR said:

If it is achievable, why has it not been achieved ? You really have to judge future possible achievements against what happened in the past, nothing.

I didn't realise the UK had already had negotiations to restrict the right of foreign nationals to claim benefits. When was this attempted?

My point was why has it not negotiated this or let's face it anything, unless you have a list of things the UK government have negotiated for the benefit of the UK with the EU in the last 5 years.
Its almost as if they are a puppet, Brussels pulling the strings and the UK jumps.

[wc98]

JustAnotherLogin said:

What I want for renegotiation and what we might get are different things.

As I have said before, if new immigrants cannot claim benefits for 5 years then I could live with that. That is I believe achievable.

personally i would be quite happy to see immigrants get benefits far sooner than that if they had been subject to a similar entry procedure as austrailia or canada, ie have skill sets in demand (and with the lack of investment in training in the uk these skill sets are wide and varied) . make sure the people coming here to work are needed ,and then treat them the exact same way as everyone else.

[JustAnotherLogin]

PRTVR said:

Gaspode said:

PRTVR said:

If it is achievable, why has it not been achieved ? You really have to judge future possible achievements against what happened in the past, nothing.

I didn't realise the UK had already had negotiations to restrict the right of foreign nationals to claim benefits. When was this attempted?

My point was why has it not negotiated this or let's face it anything, unless you have a list of things the UK government have negotiated for the benefit of the UK with the EU in the last 5 years.
Its almost as if they are a puppet, Brussels pulling the strings and the UK jumps.

Off the top of my head
He kept us out of the Eurozone agreement on the handling of banks - big success in my view as it leaves London uniquely positioned inside the free trade area but without the encumberances of the financial treaty.


Was instrumental in stopping the EU budget rising.

Not as much as any of us would like, but better than Blair/Brown who gave away the rebate

[Scuffers]

JustAnotherLogin said:

Off the top of my head
He kept us out of the Eurozone agreement on the handling of banks - big success in my view as it leaves London uniquely positioned inside the free trade area but without the encumberances of the financial treaty.


Was instrumental in stopping the EU budget rising.

Not as much as any of us would like, but better than Blair/Brown who gave away the rebate

Bit early. to claim either of those two.

The eu budget did go up, and they are still after control of the city.

[JustAnotherLogin]

Scuffers said:

JustAnotherLogin said:

Off the top of my head
He kept us out of the Eurozone agreement on the handling of banks - big success in my view as it leaves London uniquely positioned inside the free trade area but without the encumberances of the financial treaty.


Was instrumental in stopping the EU budget rising.

Not as much as any of us would like, but better than Blair/Brown who gave away the rebate

Bit early. to claim either of those two.

The eu budget did go up, and they are still after control of the city.

?

http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/376558/Tough-talk...

The future is another country, he kept the city out of their control for his term (or first term depending on how you think May will go)

[steveT350C]

THE stat of 2015. Votes cast at parliamentary by-elections 2013-14:

80,884 UKIP
70,257 CON
49,205 LAB
18,164 LDEM
5,055 GRN

[steveT350C]

THE LEADER of the Slough Tory group has today defected to Ukip, The Observer can reveal.

http://www.sloughobserver.co.uk/news/slough/articl...

[JustAnotherLogin]

steveT350C said:

THE stat of 2015.

Bit early to claim that given that the GE will be somewhat more important

[Mojocvh]

JustAnotherLogin said:

What I want for renegotiation and what we might get are different things.

As I have said before, if new immigrants cannot claim benefits for 5 years then I could live with that. That is I believe achievable.

So you DO NOT support limiting immigration to those who could prove to be of use to the country then?

[Zod]

Mojocvh said:

JustAnotherLogin said:

What I want for renegotiation and what we might get are different things.

As I have said before, if new immigrants cannot claim benefits for 5 years then I could live with that. That is I believe achievable.

So you DO NOT support limiting immigration to those who could prove to be of use to the country then?

Are you of use to the country? There are plenty of self-made entrepreneur inmigrants who would never have passed such a test.

[Yazar]

Zod said:

Are you of use to the country? There are plenty of self-made entrepreneur inmigrants who would never have passed such a test.

So you want us to take in a million uneducated people who have done little thus far in their lives, on the off chance one or two may be dormant geniuses?

We are already taking in a million and hoping none of them are criminals, unfortunately that one hasn't turned out well...

Edited by Yazar on Friday 30th January 12:37

[Zod]

Yazar said:

Zod said:

Are you of use to the country? There are plenty of self-made entrepreneur inmigrants who would never have passed such a test.

So you want us to take in a million uneducated people who have done little thus far in their lives, on the off chance one or two may be dormant geniuses?

We are already taking in a million and hoping none of them are criminals, unfortunately that one hasn't turned out well...

Edited by Yazar on Friday 30th January 12:37

Of course not. I am merely pointing out that such a test is a very blunt instrument and that many of those who were born here are of little economic worth. I'd rather take a chance on an immigrant than a long term dolesucker.

[Gaspode]

Zod said:

Of course not. I am merely pointing out that such a test is a very blunt instrument and that many of those who were born here are of little economic worth. I'd rather take a chance on an immigrant than a long term dolesucker.

An Immigrant is prepared to leave everything familiar to them, travel thousands of miles to a strange country, often paying criminals to help them get here, in the knowledge that they will have to work extremely hard for rubbish pay in the hope of being able to carve out a better life for them than the one they have. I would think that people like that are almost axiomatically of more use to this country than ill-educated locals who refuse to work and claim that immigrants are taking all the jobs.

[Yazar]

Zod said:

Of course not. I am merely pointing out that such a test is a very blunt instrument and that many of those who were born here are of little economic worth. I'd rather take a chance on an immigrant than a long term dolesucker.

But that's not the question.

The post was about only letting in immigrants who are of use.

As the demand for incoming migrants is strong, we are in a position to select the best from a pool of migrants. So for a manual skilled worker we are in need of, take in someone in good health and with experience in that trade as opposed to the Eu open border format.

[fatboy18]

Gaspode said:

Zod said:

Of course not. I am merely pointing out that such a test is a very blunt instrument and that many of those who were born here are of little economic worth. I'd rather take a chance on an immigrant than a long term dolesucker.

An Immigrant is prepared to leave everything familiar to them, travel thousands of miles to a strange country, often paying criminals to help them get here, in the knowledge that they will have to work extremely hard for rubbish pay in the hope of being able to carve out a better life for them than the one they have. I would think that people like that are almost axiomatically of more use to this country than ill-educated locals who refuse to work and claim that immigrants are taking all the jobs.

Yea, I feel really sorry for them, maybe I should give them my house and cars too
They need to sort out their bloody problems in their own countries, making their own countries a better place for them to live with their families.
And if that means throwing out their own Governments, so be it! CLOSE THE BORDERS.

[Gaspode]

fatboy18 said:

ea, I feel really sorry for them, maybe I should give them my house and cars too
They need to sort out their bloody problems in their own countries, making their own countries a better place for them to live with their families.
And if that means throwing out their own Governments, so be it! CLOSE THE BORDERS.

I'm not entirely sure that this policy would either (a) attract sufficient appeal in the electorate to be enacted or (b) not result in a massive deficit of people prepared to do crap jobs.

And what would you do with all the useless tts in this country who refuse to do the jobs currently done by immigrants?