Tories the future (part1)

Author
Discussion

FiF

44,050 posts

251 months

Sunday 16th November 2014
quotequote all
True but we are where we are. Now how to move forward. The public perception is that if we increase the pay the expenses system will still stay.

An expenses and allowances system t get that within the rules allows one to claim thousands of pounds simply in relation to the costs of getting the kids to school.

The public see this, and the MP who said he couldn't manage on a ministerial salary whilst living in a listed building cwhich had been bought on the back of capital gains on property financed by the taxpayer and that's going to be a difficult one to sell.

Then they see revelations about non MPs, for example Treasury officials in benefit of a non contributory final salary pension that is costing the taxpayers 50% of the salary, look at their own arrangements and wonder.

People feel that resolving this will just increase the degree to which people are out of touch.

Maybe it's right to sort it properly once and for all, but the mood at the moment isn't going to support it.

ClaphamGT3

11,292 posts

243 months

Sunday 16th November 2014
quotequote all
FiF said:
True but we are where we are. Now how to move forward. The public perception is that if we increase the pay the expenses system will still stay.

An expenses and allowances system t get that within the rules allows one to claim thousands of pounds simply in relation to the costs of getting the kids to school.

The public see this, and the MP who said he couldn't manage on a ministerial salary whilst living in a listed building cwhich had been bought on the back of capital gains on property financed by the taxpayer and that's going to be a difficult one to sell.

Then they see revelations about non MPs, for example Treasury officials in benefit of a non contributory final salary pension that is costing the taxpayers 50% of the salary, look at their own arrangements and wonder.

People feel that resolving this will just increase the degree to which people are out of touch.

Maybe it's right to sort it properly once and for all, but the mood at the moment isn't going to support it.
I think that your last point is bang on the money and, of course, any change would need a tightening up of rules on post ministerial employment and an introduction of a 'conventional' expenses system

FiF

44,050 posts

251 months

Sunday 16th November 2014
quotequote all
ClaphamGT3 said:
I think that your last point is bang on the money and, of course, any change would need a tightening up of rules on post ministerial employment and an introduction of a 'conventional' expenses system
That's basically my view too. A conventional expenses system would be easy to sort. The post ministerial employment somewhat more difficult. It would be possible to make it so tight that life back out on the streets became quite difficult and society in general lost the resource of capable peoplet with a certain knowledge and insight. That's a tricky one to balance.

NicD

3,281 posts

257 months

Sunday 16th November 2014
quotequote all
cameron must be doing something right:

France has risked a major diplomatic row with the UK after a senior government figure likened David Cameron to far-Right leader Marine Le Pen, saying his handling of a row over whether Britain should pay a £1.7 billion bill was “nationalistic” and “Byzantine”.

The French figure, who is close to President Francois Hollande, said that the Prime Minister had displayed “no European solidarity” when he hit out against the budget bill demanded by the EU because of the success of Britain’s economy.

turbobloke

103,877 posts

260 months

Sunday 16th November 2014
quotequote all
“no European solidarity”

True, the EU is crumbly.

NicD

3,281 posts

257 months

Sunday 16th November 2014
quotequote all
turbobloke said:
“no European solidarity”

True, the EU is crumbly.
and the prick wrongly said 'Byzantine' which the French (together with the Belgies and Luxemburgers) are very familiar with

Of, relating to, or characterized by intrigue; scheming or devious: "a fine hand for Byzantine deals and cozy arrangements"
b. Highly complicated; intricate and involved:

Yazar

1,476 posts

120 months

Monday 24th November 2014
quotequote all
'#CameronMustGo' - No1 Trend on Twitter uk with 180k+ tweets so far.

https://twitter.com/search?f=realtime&q=%23Cam...

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/nov/24/ca...

hidetheelephants

24,220 posts

193 months

Monday 24th November 2014
quotequote all
Unless byzantine has a different meaning in France, which is 'lumpen, clumsy or clod-hopping', CMD's handling of the EU surcharge debacle has not been byzantine in any way.

irocfan

40,388 posts

190 months

Monday 24th November 2014
quotequote all
About as much chance of him going before the election as milipeded or smeggy - just about the only thing that is providing a glimmer of hope for next year

oyster

12,589 posts

248 months

Monday 24th November 2014
quotequote all
Esseesse said:
toppstuff said:
I have never really understood all the vitriol and spittle hurled at CMD. Did he sleep with your mum or something?
Blair clone, not a conservative etc etc
Cameron resembles an old-fashioned one-nation Conservative like McMillan, Eden, Heath, Douglas-Home and Major.

What's not Consewrvative about that?

Yazar

1,476 posts

120 months

Monday 24th November 2014
quotequote all
irocfan said:
About as much chance of him going before the election as milipeded or smeggy - just about the only thing that is providing a glimmer of hope for next year
Never say never.


BlackLabel

13,251 posts

123 months

Monday 24th November 2014
quotequote all
I wonder if Cameron really wants to win a majority next year. If he wins outright he has no excuse not to implement his manifesto promises which won't be the case in a coalition. Also for Cameron the Lib Dems are probably easier to deal with than his own backbenchers are.

Edited by BlackLabel on Monday 24th November 13:56

Esseesse

8,969 posts

208 months

Monday 24th November 2014
quotequote all
BlackLabel said:
I wonder if Cameron really wants to win a majority next year. If he wins outright he has no excuse not to implement his manifesto promises which won't be the case in a coalition. Also for Cameron the Lib Dems are probably easier to deal with than his own backbenchers are.

Edited by BlackLabel on Monday 24th November 13:56
I can't see it now but a few months back Peter Hitchens gave his opinion that Cameron probably would rather not winning outright in 2015 because to do so would mean being held to his manifesto.

mrpurple

Original Poster:

2,624 posts

188 months

Monday 24th November 2014
quotequote all
Esseesse said:
BlackLabel said:
I wonder if Cameron really wants to win a majority next year. If he wins outright he has no excuse not to implement his manifesto promises which won't be the case in a coalition. Also for Cameron the Lib Dems are probably easier to deal with than his own backbenchers are.

Edited by BlackLabel on Monday 24th November 13:56
I can't see it now but a few months back Peter Hitchens gave his opinion that Cameron probably would rather not winning outright in 2015 because to do so would mean being held to his manifesto.
IIRC UKIP would agree to a confidence and supply arrangement but CMd would have a hell of a job convincing anyone that we couldn't have a referendum because the kippers won't support him.

IanMorewood

4,309 posts

248 months

Monday 24th November 2014
quotequote all
Conservatives will have a big shake up next year, the party will fracture into Eurosceptics and Europhiles and no unity will be found until the much promised referendum is set in process.

FiF

44,050 posts

251 months

Thursday 27th November 2014
quotequote all
Go on then insiders, is the party going to pay for Mitchell's failed plebgate libel suit legal costs as is currently rumoured?

dandarez

13,276 posts

283 months

Friday 28th November 2014
quotequote all
toppstuff said:
dandarez said:
Tories the future?

With CMD that's simple.

There isn't one!
I have never really understood all the vitriol and spittle hurled at CMD. Did he sleep with your mum or something?
I have never really understood retarded answers.

Why would he sleep with my mum? She died of cancer in 1981 aged 56.
Did he sleep with 'something' is even more retarded.

Regardless, what I said is correct.
With him at the helm the Tories have no future.

Wait and see.

Liokault

2,837 posts

214 months

Friday 28th November 2014
quotequote all
dandarez said:
toppstuff said:
dandarez said:
Tories the future?

With CMD that's simple.

There isn't one!
I have never really understood all the vitriol and spittle hurled at CMD. Did he sleep with your mum or something?
I have never really understood retarded answers.

Why would he sleep with my mum? She died of cancer in 1981 aged 56.
Did he sleep with 'something' is even more retarded.

Regardless, what I said is correct.
With him at the helm the Tories have no future.

Wait and see.
You attacked the questioner, you didn't answer the question.


Why is CMD so bad for the Tories?

Esseesse

8,969 posts

208 months

Friday 28th November 2014
quotequote all
Liokault said:
You attacked the questioner, you didn't answer the question.


Why is CMD so bad for the Tories?
Not conservative?

Liokault

2,837 posts

214 months

Friday 28th November 2014
quotequote all
Esseesse said:
Not conservative?
Its harder to type on my Ipod.