scotland to reduce Drink Drive limit

[Edinburger]

technodup said:

it comes as absolutely no surprise that Edinburgher sides with the futile gesture politics of the SNP.

Banning singing? Tick.
Reducing alcohol limits even when proven not to work? Tick.
Increasing the cost of alcohol for everyone, to reduce 'problem' drinking? Tick.

That's two recent SNP policies which have been shown not to work, and one which has been reversed.

Top work.

What a lot of crap you post sometimes.

Banning singing? Only songs of sectarianism, racism and hatred.
Reducing alcohol limits even when proven not to work? Nothing has been proven not to work, but it brings our country into line with other countries.
Increasing the cost of alcohol for everyone, to reduce 'problem' drinking? I actually don't agree this was a good move either.

2/3 Could do better.

[bodhi]

Edinburger said:

To say "I’ll continue to take the car and enjoy a beer, thanks." is silly and illegal and socially offensive.

No it isn't. Unless that pint is Special Brew you will be well within the limit in civilised countries.

[Edinburger]

bodhi said:

Edinburger said:

To say "I’ll continue to take the car and enjoy a beer, thanks." is silly and illegal and socially offensive.

No it isn't. Unless that pint is Special Brew you will be well within the limit in civilised countries.

It's socially offensive in this country and it's silly in any country.

[technodup]

Edinburger said:

Reducing alcohol limits even when proven not to work? Nothing has been proven not to work, but it brings our country into line with other countries.

Why should we fall into line with other countries with higher road deaths?

[simoid]

Edinburger said:

To say "I’ll continue to take the car and enjoy a beer, thanks." is silly and illegal and socially offensive.

Silly = your opinion, with which I disagree
Illegal = no it’s not
Socially offensive = your opinion, with which I disagree

[Edinburger]

technodup said:

Edinburger said:

Reducing alcohol limits even when proven not to work? Nothing has been proven not to work, but it brings our country into line with other countries.

Why should we fall into line with other countries with higher road deaths?

Stats to prove that?

Would you get on a plane if the pilot had had a few pints?

[Evercross]

Edinburger said:

Let's make it simple. Can you explain i) why our society should encourage people to drink and drive

It doesn't, but your simplistic perception is that a lower limit discourages it more, whereas the data shows an unrealistically low limit is counterproductive.

Edinburger said:

and ii) exactly why the law change is so restrictive and bad.

See above. Deaths on Scottish roads due to the influence of alcohol have increased since the lower limit was introduced.

Edinburger said:

Reducing alcohol limits even when proven not to work? Nothing has been proven not to work.

Your perception is irrelevant and wrong because it is only the actual consequences that matter - deaths are up and that's unequivocal. Like your failure to understand the meaning of s.30 orders in the Scotland Act, ignoring or intentionally contradicting the facts just makes you look like an idiot.

I suspect however that once again you are on the wind up as I don't believe anyone is that stupid.

Edited by Evercross on Wednesday 15th May 14:02

[Edinburger]

Evercross said:

Edinburger said:

Let's make it simple. Can you explain i) why our society should encourage people to drink and drive

It doesn't, but your simplistic perception is that a lower limit discourages it more, whereas the data shows an unrealistically low limit is counterproductive.

Edinburger said:

and ii) exactly why the law change is so restrictive and bad.

See above. Deaths on Scottish roads due to the influence of alcohol have increased since the lower limit was introduced.

Your perception is irrelevant and wrong because it is only the actual consequences that matter. Like your failure to understand the meaning of s.30 orders in the Scotland Act.

Anecdotally, I know of lots and lots of people who may have had a couple of pints and drive and now don't have anything. We all will. It's too short a time operiod to use stats to say it's worked or hasn't worked,

Let's not cross threads.

[alfaman]

Edinburger said:

To say "I’ll continue to take the car and enjoy a beer, thanks." is silly and illegal and socially offensive.

It isn’t illegal to have A beer and drive .. don’t be so condescending, and holier than thou

FFS

Edited by alfaman on Wednesday 15th May 14:22

[alfaman]

To counter the somewhat facile and unscientific argument put forward that reducing the drink drive limit reduces drink driving , and drink drive alcohol limit is correlated to the amount of drink driving ...

( obv implication is that a NIL limit means NIL drink driving )

I’ve lived in the Middle East (Bahrain) where the alcohol limit for driving is ZERO... with compulsory loss of work visa and license, plus automatic jail time if an accident ..... so that would obviously eliminate drink driving .... according to our Scottish drink-drive messiah.



every weekend hundreds of pious and holy Saudi Arabians drive across from KSA to where I used to live (Al Juffair ) with the express purpose of getting completely st faced and shagging as many Thai hookers as they can manage over a weekend.

Quite normal to see crashed or rolled SUVs about on a Sunday after the drunk drivers had scarpered back to Saudi.

Yep - ZERO limit is a great cure for drunk driving

Edited by alfaman on Wednesday 15th May 14:25

[heebeegeetee]

Edinburger said:

To say "I’ll continue to take the car and enjoy a beer, thanks." is silly and illegal and socially offensive.

It’s a social norm in my world, and not illegal in any way.

I would also ask why you want to bring us in line with countries that have a worse road safety record.

[bodhi]

Edinburger said:

bodhi said:

Edinburger said:

To say "I’ll continue to take the car and enjoy a beer, thanks." is silly and illegal and socially offensive.

No it isn't. Unless that pint is Special Brew you will be well within the limit in civilised countries.

It's socially offensive in this country and it's silly in any country.

I said civilised countries.

[iphonedyou]

Edinburger said:

To say "I’ll continue to take the car and enjoy a beer, thanks." is silly and illegal and socially offensive.

Again, eh?

[technodup]

Edinburger said:

Would you get on a plane if the pilot had had a few pints?

Given some of the things I've done I'd be a bit of a hypocrite to say no...

Let's just say I'd argue being stoned is worse than being drunk.

[Shakermaker]

Edinburger said:

Let me know when you're going out so I can avoid the streets and roads then.

You better stay off the streets permanently if you wish to avoid people who have had one beer and then got in the car.

[Dog Star]

Edinburger said:

You sir, are an idiot.

And you sir, come across as a holier-than-thou idiot on this thread.

Don't judge others by your pathetically low standards and tolerances.

You berk.

If I could be bothered looking for that "coffee beans" gif then I'd insert it here. But it's not worth my bother.

[NomduJour]

Edinburger, should we also assume that you’re looking forward to car speed restrictors becoming mandatory?

[Edinburger]

Dog Star said:

Edinburger said:

You sir, are an idiot.

And you sir, come across as a holier-than-thou idiot on this thread.

Don't judge others by your pathetically low standards and tolerances.

You berk.

If I could be bothered looking for that "coffee beans" gif then I'd insert it here. But it's not worth my bother.

I couldn't give a monkey's chuff how I come across on this or any other thread.

I do have some emotional attachment to this topic as a very close family member was killed by a drunk driver a few years ago. The driver was a mid-50s respectable guy who worked in law and he was three times over the old Scottish limit, so not a totally pissed idiot.

But even before that happened, I never ever understood the need to drink (even or two) and drive. To me, if I'm drinking I'm drinking and not counting.

What the new drink drive limit did was tell people that actually one or two before driving isn't right and isn't acceptable. So when it was introduced it I welcomed it. Many of my friends did too. I think most people now either drink OR drive. And that seems sensible to me.

Anyway, crack on. Call me a berk or a wker or an idiot or whatever. I don't care. Just think about some of the points I posted earlier.

[Edinburger]

NomduJour said:

Edinburger, should we also assume that you’re looking forward to car speed restrictors becoming mandatory?

No.

[Shakermaker]

Edinburger said:

I couldn't give a monkey's chuff how I come across on this or any other thread.

I do have some emotional attachment to this topic as a very close family member was killed by a drunk driver a few years ago. The driver was a mid-50s respectable guy who worked in law and he was three times over the old Scottish limit, so not a totally pissed idiot.

But even before that happened, I never ever understood the need to drink (even or two) and drive. To me, if I'm drinking I'm drinking and not counting.

What the new drink drive limit did was tell people that actually one or two before driving isn't right and isn't acceptable. So when it was introduced it I welcomed it. Many of my friends did too. I think most people now either drink OR drive. And that seems sensible to me.

Anyway, crack on. Call me a berk or a wker or an idiot or whatever. I don't care. Just think about some of the points I posted earlier.

Three times over the limit is far more than one or two though. That's a sustained session of drinking to get to that level. And so under the new limit, he would be what, 5 times over the limit?

None of that detracts from the tragedy that you and your family have suffered, but a lower limit doesn't stop the people like him.