Lame Duck Pres

Author
Discussion

Bluebarge

4,519 posts

177 months

Wednesday 5th November 2014
quotequote all
scherzkeks said:
I don't think so. He did what all politicians have done since the Reagan era. Prop up his donors and allow private business interests to dictate domestic and and foreign policy. The country is an oligarchy, there are no meaningful differences between the two major parties, and I believe we are watching the great experiment that was America come to an end.
Lots of Russian wishful thinking there laugh

Meantime, in Putinland, everything is much better, which is why so many people are clamouring to get into the country. Oh, wait...

CrutyRammers

13,735 posts

197 months

Wednesday 5th November 2014
quotequote all
CamMoreRon said:
extraT said:
I cannot comment on the cause of his unpopularity.. ..but I can tell you, if there is a Republican President, we can expect another war, and lots of profits for our friends at Lockheed.
Plus a load more blanket surveillance, a massive step back in Green progress / social progress, and absolutely no hope for gun control. Do you think it's the Middle Eastern events and the constant "threat" of terrorism that has swung things back towards red?
Yeah, Obama has been quite the pacifist hasn't he? Apart from all the drone attacks and that. And surveillance? The name "Snowdon" mean anything to you? He wasn't exactly cutting back, was he?

But I suppose his wars and surveillance are good because he's a lefty.

scherzkeks

4,460 posts

133 months

Wednesday 5th November 2014
quotequote all
CrutyRammers said:
But I suppose his wars and surveillance are good because he's a lefty.
You jest, but it's true, and indicative of the IQ of large swaths of the American population at present. The system is utterly broken, but the meltdown remains enjoyable to watch.

Muntu

7,631 posts

198 months

Wednesday 5th November 2014
quotequote all
hornetrider said:
So the Democrats have been wiped out. I'm no lefty but I do remember vividly the optimism which swept Obama into office 6 years ago. I even thought it was a bit of a good thing myself.

Where has it all gone wrong?
You can't polish a turd

Jasandjules

69,825 posts

228 months

Wednesday 5th November 2014
quotequote all
Well, I have quite a few American friends. Most hate him. A couple however love him (the more lefty than Scargill ones)..


Jimbeaux

33,791 posts

230 months

Wednesday 5th November 2014
quotequote all
Regiment said:
I always thought it was a case of

1. Barack Obama elected president on promises...
2. ...the promises took a little longer to be implemented than quite a few people were hoping, so they...
3. ...then voted for Republicans at the mid-term elections...
4. ...meaning it was much harder for Barack Obama to carry out any of his promises, especially with the Republicans fighting tooth and nail again anything and everything Barack Obama had promised.

Call me cynical but the only thing wrong with the Democratic political system is the average voter.
No sir, actually the problem came when the president made various promises all of which he has not followed up on. He made very specific promises regarding Obamacare that he has 100% not followed through on. That, along with numerous scandals, all of which he claims no responsibility for when they went wrong has made people very untrusting of him. It's one incompetent show after another. People do not want to see incompetence in government, rather it be ISIS, foreign-policy in general, ebola, etc.

Edited by Jimbeaux on Wednesday 5th November 22:27

Jimbeaux

33,791 posts

230 months

Wednesday 5th November 2014
quotequote all
scherzkeks said:
Elroy Blue said:
He did what all Politicians is power do and went for the easy votes. He targeted 'poor' America (including giving hundreds of thousands of illegal immigrants citizenship) and abandoned 'middle America'.

It hasn't gone well for him.
I don't think so. He did what all politicians have done since the Reagan era. Prop up his donors and allow private business interests to dictate domestic and and foreign policy. The country is an oligarchy, there are no meaningful differences between the two major parties, and I believe we are watching the great experiment that was America come to an end.
Bizarre; almost funny...just almost.

Jimbeaux

33,791 posts

230 months

Wednesday 5th November 2014
quotequote all
scherzkeks said:
CrutyRammers said:
But I suppose his wars and surveillance are good because he's a lefty.
You jest, but it's true, and indicative of the IQ of large swaths of the American population at present. The system is utterly broken, but the meltdown remains enjoyable to watch.
Are you XJ Flyer's less smarter brother?

jammy_basturd

29,775 posts

211 months

Wednesday 5th November 2014
quotequote all
Jimbeaux said:
No sir, actually the problem came when the president made various promises all of which he has not followed up on. He made very specific promises regarding Obamacare that he has 100% not followed through on. That, along with numerous scandals, all of which he claims no responsibility for when they went wrong has made people very untrusting of him. It's one incompetent show after another. People do not want to see incompetence in government, rather it be ISIS, foreign-policy in general, ebola, etc.

Edited by Jimbeaux on Wednesday 5th November 22:27
But it seems the senate have made it next to impossible for him to follow through with his promises, whilst a lot of those scandals pre-date him becoming president?

Justayellowbadge

37,057 posts

241 months

Wednesday 5th November 2014
quotequote all
Jimbeaux said:
Are you XJ Flyer's less smarter brother?
Less smarter?

Colonial

13,553 posts

204 months

Wednesday 5th November 2014
quotequote all
I have no issue if the real Republican party gets in - straight down the line conservatives. Sure. I'll disagree with some policies but hey ho. That's life. Business will continue to tick over.

If Tea Party style nutters continue to win endorsement and hold a majority in the party then I am quite concerned over the direction things will take. It will either go isolationist, which will be a negative for the US, or expansionist, which will be a negative for the wider world.

Talksteer

4,843 posts

232 months

Thursday 6th November 2014
quotequote all
paranoid airbag said:
Blib said:
CamMoreRon said:
Plus a load more blanket surveillance, a massive step back in Green progress / social progress, and absolutely no hope for gun control. Do you think it's the Middle Eastern events and the constant "threat" of terrorism that has swung things back towards red?
What 'green progress' has he made?
Similarly gun control?

In fact for that issue, a Republican govt might actually be more effective. Measures from them are more likely to be seen as reasonable compromises by moderate gun owners - from the Democrats, they're gubbermint diktats. Meanwhile out of power the Democrats can take a step back and learn from their mistakes.
The Republicans have one big issue...... by and large they are wrong.

The Democratic position on most issues is actually the majority position for most Americans in social attitude surveys.

The reason why the Democrats don't win every election is that voting is fundamentally a statement of identity rather than a rational choice based on fundamental policy positions. Secondly there is the issue of perceived competence which Obama has not done well on partially because of the grid lock of the US system.

kilty2

226 posts

170 months

Thursday 6th November 2014
quotequote all
Jimbeaux, as a 20 year resident of the USA, I do notice that that lobby money and election spending are ridiculous.

Money can buy elections, I live in Illinois – the Quinn/Rauner race was the most expensive in Illinois history.

If you believe the press, then Rauner spent $23 per vote cast for him, Quinn spent $17/vote.

For a state of 12 million people – I find the combined campaign costs (reportedly $100 million) pretty obscene.

Art0ir

9,401 posts

169 months

Thursday 6th November 2014
quotequote all
I don't imagine you'll find many outside of America that will disagree with the idea that politics is a money game, but hey, that's their prerogative.

I don't follow a whole lot of US politics any more but the Republican's issue seemed to be a lack of credible candidates. Most seem to be bible thumping, sexist nut jobs.

The only possible contender I've see is Rand Paul but I'm not sure if the more hawkish members of the GOP (or the arms industry) will allow him to lead the party.

scherzkeks

4,460 posts

133 months

Thursday 6th November 2014
quotequote all
Jimbeaux said:
Bizarre; almost funny...just almost.
PH's resident Fox News staffer doesn't agree. Color me surprised.

Derek Smith

45,512 posts

247 months

Thursday 6th November 2014
quotequote all
Talksteer said:
The Republicans have one big issue...... by and large they are wrong.

The Democratic position on most issues is actually the majority position for most Americans in social attitude surveys.

The reason why the Democrats don't win every election is that voting is fundamentally a statement of identity rather than a rational choice based on fundamental policy positions. Secondly there is the issue of perceived competence which Obama has not done well on partially because of the grid lock of the US system.
I've got a few American friends and I try not to talk politics to them. This mid-term they've hardly said anything.

But the odd thing is that, as you say, a couple of them obviously believe one thing and yet vote for the party that will ensure it doesn't come about.

It is a strange world out there and stranger still is the USA. They see nothing odd in this.

All my friends are openly racist, or what would be seen as racist over here. I've been in a restaurant in mid-Sussex where I was embarrassed at their comments, and this was shared by those on neighbouring tables. And this was from the one who would, no doubt, be described by some on here as left of Scargill.

Making comparisons between the UK and USA politics is pointless. There are few similarities.

The worry is that this apparent lurch to the republicans will hurt this country. If the USA becomes isolationist then we might well have problems.

Whilst many of our MPs might be inept, criminal and selfish, they do seem to be a step or two up the evolutionary ladder compared to some of the yanks. Just listen to what some of them say.

Remarkable.

The main problem with USA politics is religion. When I was a kid we were told about Americans jumping off high buildings expecting to be rescued by their particular breed of god. What got me was the second bloke who did it. I had trouble believing it then but not now. I saw a TV programme about the Arab spring, back a millennium or so. Great leaps in science. Yet it all ended when religion decided it didn't like new. I wondered at the time if it would be the same for the yanks.


CrutyRammers

13,735 posts

197 months

Thursday 6th November 2014
quotequote all
Talksteer said:
The Republicans have one big issue...... by and large they are wrong.

The Democratic position on most issues is actually the majority position for most Americans in social attitude surveys.

The reason why the Democrats don't win every election is that voting is fundamentally a statement of identity rather than a rational choice based on fundamental policy positions.
So the majority position is right, except when they vote in the republicans, when it's because they voted irrationally, and are wrong.

nuts

and again

nuts

DJRC

23,563 posts

235 months

Thursday 6th November 2014
quotequote all
Derek Smith said:
Talksteer said:
The Republicans have one big issue...... by and large they are wrong.

The Democratic position on most issues is actually the majority position for most Americans in social attitude surveys.

The reason why the Democrats don't win every election is that voting is fundamentally a statement of identity rather than a rational choice based on fundamental policy positions. Secondly there is the issue of perceived competence which Obama has not done well on partially because of the grid lock of the US system.
I've got a few American friends and I try not to talk politics to them. This mid-term they've hardly said anything.

But the odd thing is that, as you say, a couple of them obviously believe one thing and yet vote for the party that will ensure it doesn't come about.

It is a strange world out there and stranger still is the USA. They see nothing odd in this.

All my friends are openly racist, or what would be seen as racist over here. I've been in a restaurant in mid-Sussex where I was embarrassed at their comments, and this was shared by those on neighbouring tables. And this was from the one who would, no doubt, be described by some on here as left of Scargill.

Making comparisons between the UK and USA politics is pointless. There are few similarities.

The worry is that this apparent lurch to the republicans will hurt this country. If the USA becomes isolationist then we might well have problems.

Whilst many of our MPs might be inept, criminal and selfish, they do seem to be a step or two up the evolutionary ladder compared to some of the yanks. Just listen to what some of them say.

Remarkable.

The main problem with USA politics is religion. When I was a kid we were told about Americans jumping off high buildings expecting to be rescued by their particular breed of god. What got me was the second bloke who did it. I had trouble believing it then but not now. I saw a TV programme about the Arab spring, back a millennium or so. Great leaps in science. Yet it all ended when religion decided it didn't like new. I wondered at the time if it would be the same for the yanks.

Hmmm. When I was a kid and was told about Americans jumping off high buildings it was about the history of the Wall St Crash and there was no mentioning of any bankers doing so in the expectation of any rescue. Your apparently st schooling probably explains the usual level of bullocks you come out with.



Jimbeaux

33,791 posts

230 months

Thursday 6th November 2014
quotequote all
jammy_basturd said:
Jimbeaux said:
No sir, actually the problem came when the president made various promises all of which he has not followed up on. He made very specific promises regarding Obamacare that he has 100% not followed through on. That, along with numerous scandals, all of which he claims no responsibility for when they went wrong has made people very untrusting of him. It's one incompetent show after another. People do not want to see incompetence in government, rather it be ISIS, foreign-policy in general, ebola, etc.

Edited by Jimbeaux on Wednesday 5th November 22:27
But it seems the senate have made it next to impossible for him to follow through with his promises, whilst a lot of those scandals pre-date him becoming president?
The Senate has allowed virtually no bills to come to vote; therefore POTUS neither had to sign or veto. That's is about to change and the Excel pipeline will be the first test. That has considerable Democratic support. Now, will he do what the peoples' representatives want (both Dems and Rep) or will he continue to pander to the Greenies?

Edited by Jimbeaux on Thursday 6th November 23:50

Jimbeaux

33,791 posts

230 months

Thursday 6th November 2014
quotequote all
Justayellowbadge said:
Jimbeaux said:
Are you XJ Flyer's less smarter brother?
Less smarter?
Precisely. An illiterate phrasing to drive home a point; much in the vein of ain't got no sense. wink