No charges for Missouri cop who shot unarmed teenager

No charges for Missouri cop who shot unarmed teenager

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Discussion

unrepentant

21,212 posts

255 months

Tuesday 25th November 2014
quotequote all
Jimbeaux said:
UR is correct here. Not having a Grand Jury does not imply no jury. A traditional jury trial would likely be watched on TV or at least open to witnesses and reporters, unlike a GJ. It appears the evidence, much of which was not available to the public until now, was overwhelming in defense of the cop, therefore, the outcome would have likely been the same.
I don't disagree. This whole thing was about justice being SEEN to be done as much as anything else. That's why there should have been a jury trial so that there was full transparency. As the evidence came out during the course of the trial things would have become apparent and that would have helped to keep a lid on some of the unrest.

RobGT81

5,227 posts

185 months

Tuesday 25th November 2014
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unrepentant said:
Wilson is 6'4, 210 and presumably trained in self defence. Brown was 6'5 and 280.
Glad to hear he put his self defence to good use.

Jimbeaux

33,791 posts

230 months

Tuesday 25th November 2014
quotequote all
unrepentant said:
Jimbeaux said:
The smallish cop was defending himself from the asault of a 6'4" 300lb man that was, as evidence now shows, in the front seat of the cruiser beating the cop. That will get you shot everytime.
Wilson is 6'4, 210 and presumably trained in self defence. Brown was 6'5 and 280. A little perspective.
I was unaware of that; thanks.

anonymous-user

53 months

Tuesday 25th November 2014
quotequote all
unrepentant said:
Wilson is 6'4, 210 and presumably trained in self defence. Brown was 6'5 and 280. A little perspective.
I don't really have an opinon on the shooting, I don't know the facts but 70lb's is a massive difference in a fight irrespective of training. 9 times out of 10 the big guy is going to win.

KTF

9,788 posts

149 months

Tuesday 25th November 2014
quotequote all
Why was he in the front seat of the officers car?

I thought they put suspects in the back when the invite to 'come and have a seat in my car' was offered (cuffed or otherwise) to protect the officer?

to3m

1,226 posts

169 months

Tuesday 25th November 2014
quotequote all
Jimbeaux said:
jdw100 said:
McWigglebum4th said:
Just make blacks immune to the law
Wow, just wow...'blacks'. eek
When I am referred to with the "Whites", am I to be offended too? Just checking.
You probably should be - or you should at least distrust whoever's using that turn of phrase. (Of course, this is just a rule of thumb that I happen to use myself; you're welcome to ignore it or consider it inappropriate.) People are individuals, and deserve to be referred to in some way that doesn't suggest they're some kind of faceless cipher. Don't let people turn you into an adjective, and do to others the same courtesy.

When one doesn't care about the people in question, which one sometimes doesn't, I recommend something like "black people" and "white people". With these phrases, anybody complaining really has very little to go on (and I've never seen it successfully done). The phrase includes nothing anybody couldn't find out from using their eyes and/or looking in a mirror, and doesn't look even vaguely like it might be trying to dehumanize.

Jimbeaux

33,791 posts

230 months

Tuesday 25th November 2014
quotequote all
KTF said:
Why was he in the front seat of the officers car?

I thought they put suspects in the back when the invite to 'come and have a seat in my car' was offered (cuffed or otherwise) to protect the officer?
That's the point, he was in the front seat uninvited.

98elise

26,376 posts

160 months

Tuesday 25th November 2014
quotequote all
fblm said:
unrepentant said:
Wilson is 6'4, 210 and presumably trained in self defence. Brown was 6'5 and 280. A little perspective.
I don't really have an opinon on the shooting, I don't know the facts but 70lb's is a massive difference in a fight irrespective of training. 9 times out of 10 the big guy is going to win.
5 stone heavier, and 30% weight advantage over the Cop! The Cop was a big bloke, but Wilson was huge!

Matt Harper

6,613 posts

200 months

Tuesday 25th November 2014
quotequote all
KTF said:
Why was he in the front seat of the officers car?

I thought they put suspects in the back when the invite to 'come and have a seat in my car' was offered (cuffed or otherwise) to protect the officer?
He wasn't inside the car - he attacked the cop through the open drivers door window - being assaulted when you are seated in a car is obviously disadvantageous, despite the assailants size. The cop fired two rounds from inside his vehicle and then extracted himself. Then it was on like donkey kong in the street. He actually fired a further ten .40 cal rounds before he stopped the assailant.

Jimbeaux

33,791 posts

230 months

Tuesday 25th November 2014
quotequote all
to3m said:
Jimbeaux said:
jdw100 said:
McWigglebum4th said:
Just make blacks immune to the law
Wow, just wow...'blacks'. eek
When I am referred to with the "Whites", am I to be offended too? Just checking.
You probably should be - or you should at least distrust whoever's using that turn of phrase. (Of course, this is just a rule of thumb that I happen to use myself; you're welcome to ignore it or consider it inappropriate.) People are individuals, and deserve to be referred to in some way that doesn't suggest they're some kind of faceless cipher. Don't let people turn you into an adjective, and do to others the same courtesy.

When one doesn't care about the people in question, which one sometimes doesn't, I recommend something like "black people" and "white people". With these phrases, anybody complaining really has very little to go on (and I've never seen it successfully done). The phrase includes nothing anybody couldn't find out from using their eyes and/or looking in a mirror, and doesn't look even vaguely like it might be trying to dehumanize.
You see, that hand wringing thought process, regarding what amounts to nothing more than an overbloated PC talking point, is why society is too busy chasing its own tail as opposed to getting on with life and real progress.
The next time I am referred to as "White" as opposed to "European American", I will drive my Jag down to the urban community center and throw a Waterford goblet through the window and peel off in an unseemly manner. We can all play this game.

Edited by Jimbeaux on Tuesday 25th November 16:12

KTF

9,788 posts

149 months

Tuesday 25th November 2014
quotequote all
Matt Harper said:
KTF said:
Why was he in the front seat of the officers car?

I thought they put suspects in the back when the invite to 'come and have a seat in my car' was offered (cuffed or otherwise) to protect the officer?
He wasn't inside the car - he attacked the cop through the open drivers door window - being assaulted when you are seated in a car is obviously disadvantageous, despite the assailants size. The cop fired two rounds from inside his vehicle and then extracted himself. Then it was on like donkey kong in the street. He actually fired a further ten .40 cal rounds before he stopped the assailant.
Ah, in that case what did he expect would happen? I have little sympathy for people who bring it upon themselves.

OllieC

3,816 posts

213 months

Tuesday 25th November 2014
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dudleybloke said:
And the looting is in full force now.
can't they shoot a few ?

Jimbeaux

33,791 posts

230 months

Tuesday 25th November 2014
quotequote all
unrepentant said:
Jimbeaux said:
UR is correct here. Not having a Grand Jury does not imply no jury. A traditional jury trial would likely be watched on TV or at least open to witnesses and reporters, unlike a GJ. It appears the evidence, much of which was not available to the public until now, was overwhelming in defense of the cop, therefore, the outcome would have likely been the same.
This whole thing was about justice being SEEN to be done as much as anything else.
That bit there is the nail on the head of the whole issue. That said, there is an element at work here that would have been disruptive no matter what the process or outcome would have been IMO.

unrepentant

21,212 posts

255 months

Tuesday 25th November 2014
quotequote all
Matt Harper said:
He wasn't inside the car - he attacked the cop through the open drivers door window - being assaulted when you are seated in a car is obviously disadvantageous, despite the assailants size. The cop fired two rounds from inside his vehicle and then extracted himself. Then it was on like donkey kong in the street. He actually fired a further ten .40 cal rounds before he stopped the assailant.
Sounds like he needs to spend some time on the range.......


As to the comments about the 70lb weight difference - Wilson is a trained police officer, presumably pretty fit and he carried a night stick. Brown was overweight and unarmed and probably pretty slow.

jshell

11,006 posts

204 months

Tuesday 25th November 2014
quotequote all
to3m said:
You probably should be - or you should at least distrust whoever's using that turn of phrase. (Of course, this is just a rule of thumb that I happen to use myself; you're welcome to ignore it or consider it inappropriate.) People are individuals, and deserve to be referred to in some way that doesn't suggest they're some kind of faceless cipher. Don't let people turn you into an adjective, and do to others the same courtesy.

When one doesn't care about the people in question, which one sometimes doesn't, I recommend something like "black people" and "white people". With these phrases, anybody complaining really has very little to go on (and I've never seen it successfully done). The phrase includes nothing anybody couldn't find out from using their eyes and/or looking in a mirror, and doesn't look even vaguely like it might be trying to dehumanize.
Try living in sub-Saharan Africa for a few years like some on here, then see what you are referred to.

'Black people' and 'white people' are the favoured terms by black Africans.

Matt Harper

6,613 posts

200 months

Tuesday 25th November 2014
quotequote all
unrepentant said:
Sounds like he needs to spend some time on the range.......


As to the comments about the 70lb weight difference - Wilson is a trained police officer, presumably pretty fit and he carried a night stick. Brown was overweight and unarmed and probably pretty slow.
Oh I dunno, Paul - he hit him 7 times - better than 50% ratio - though God only knows where the other 5 rounds ended up - that's a worry.

I think that Mr Brown had already made known his intentions to the cop - "You're too much of a f*****g p***y to shoot me"- after he'd cold-clocked the officer. If you are inclined to assault armed police and then attempt to steal their sidearms, you really should consider the consequences of such action.

paranoid airbag

2,679 posts

158 months

Tuesday 25th November 2014
quotequote all
La Liga said:
The governed have made the decision. That's what a jury is. It's the public judging their peer through a justice structure they consent to.

How can this not be considered superior to a prosecutor, part of the "governers", making the decision on his / her own?

Unfortunately, people can't comprehend this over there, and as a collective, behave in the manner we've been witnessing. It has parallels with Mark Duggan; a perfectly lawful shooting with a "community" unwilling to attribute any blame to the person who was shot.
A maximum of 12 people (remember only 3 needed to not indict), 9 of whom white, do not necessarily represent the governed. And I don't ever remember consenting to having them represent me. Put a jury of 9 muslims in a trial where someone had attacked me for eating a bacon sandwich and it's quite possible I would vocally not consent.

So no, they don't need to consent, they haven't consented, and they're going around with guns not consenting. Which, AFAICT, is *precisely* how the 2nd amendment should work - if they yield, it's not because the government has overwhelming force (though clearly, they still do), but because they actually need said government.

anonymous-user

53 months

Tuesday 25th November 2014
quotequote all
unrepentant said:
As to the comments about the 70lb weight difference - Wilson is a trained police officer, presumably pretty fit and he carried a night stick. Brown was overweight and unarmed and probably pretty slow.
I'm sorry if you're 210lb, unless you're Randy Couture, this guy is going to fvck you up, stick or no stick.




dudleybloke

19,718 posts

185 months

Tuesday 25th November 2014
quotequote all
At least we know the Ferguson Bookshop is safe from being looted.

Crush

15,077 posts

168 months

Tuesday 25th November 2014
quotequote all
dudleybloke said:
At least we know the Ferguson Bookshop is safe from being looted.
hehe