Another year and another broken promise
Discussion
Justayellowbadge said:
crankedup said:
'No if's or but's immigration will be reduced to the tens of thousands', this was the promise made by our P.M. back in 2010. Immigration numbers just released show that immigration is now higher than at any time at 268,000 people (2013 - 2014) mainly from Poland Bulgaria and Romania.
Mr Cameron has just felt another nail being firmly hammered home. Glee for Mr Farage I would imagine. What a complete and utter shambles this E.U. is, thankfully we did not join the Euro monetary system.
As I understand it, if you remove EU from the figures, net migration is still 160,000 odd, so your 'mainly' is palpably bMr Cameron has just felt another nail being firmly hammered home. Glee for Mr Farage I would imagine. What a complete and utter shambles this E.U. is, thankfully we did not join the Euro monetary system.
ks. 
heppers75 said:
Justayellowbadge said:
crankedup said:
'No if's or but's immigration will be reduced to the tens of thousands', this was the promise made by our P.M. back in 2010. Immigration numbers just released show that immigration is now higher than at any time at 268,000 people (2013 - 2014) mainly from Poland Bulgaria and Romania.
Mr Cameron has just felt another nail being firmly hammered home. Glee for Mr Farage I would imagine. What a complete and utter shambles this E.U. is, thankfully we did not join the Euro monetary system.
As I understand it, if you remove EU from the figures, net migration is still 160,000 odd, so your 'mainly' is palpably bMr Cameron has just felt another nail being firmly hammered home. Glee for Mr Farage I would imagine. What a complete and utter shambles this E.U. is, thankfully we did not join the Euro monetary system.
ks. ks it becomes somewhat difficult to actually differentiate! economicpygmy said:
Yazar said:
b) understand the concept of percentages. For example there are 30 Million people in employment in the UK and only 2 million ish EU migrants + 5.5Million ish non-eu. So since 75% (22.5 Million) jobs are being done by UK citizens
Fantastic; reliable statistics which you got from...? 
2011 census used for eu & non-eu to keep simple - link
As you can probably guess now, I actually put the numbers in favour of migrants by counting *all* of them as unemployed
, the reason purely to keep things simple as to the point of the vast majority of jobs in the UK are done by British nationals. The EU at their own last check have 600,000 of the 2.5 million as not in work .Would appreciate if you could put some numbers into any replies rather than just incredulity.
heppers75 said:
wolves_wanderer said:
heppers75 said:
Well it would seem you do have some rather pent up resentment there... I shall leave you to that.
It also seems that the point I was making which is that the reason it is broken is because it would seem, though of course my limited experience (I am interested to know yours BTW outside of being able to use Google!) that those "immigrants" are willing to do jobs and then work harder than our indigenous workshy morons would ever contemplate. You then couple with the fact that when they are skilled have a more socially and familialy responsible attitude which is far less selfish than the likes of most of the ingrates who were born here have.
Then I think you start to understand why "blaming immigration" is pretty much a fallacy. If we had the people in this country who were willing to do those jobs rather than the likes of the ones on the BTL thread who think they have the right to a £400k house then we might be less shafted as a nation!
Pathetic. You are as usual throwing a massive broad brush over two entire groups of people based on your limited experiences of both. FWIW in a previous job I worked with a large number of both immigrants and "indigenous workshy morons" and found them to be pretty similar in terms of attitude to a quality of work. I did notice was about 80% of our shoplifters were from Eastern Europe, what I'm not daft enough to do, unlike you, is to extrapolate my limited experiences to tens of millions of people. It also seems that the point I was making which is that the reason it is broken is because it would seem, though of course my limited experience (I am interested to know yours BTW outside of being able to use Google!) that those "immigrants" are willing to do jobs and then work harder than our indigenous workshy morons would ever contemplate. You then couple with the fact that when they are skilled have a more socially and familialy responsible attitude which is far less selfish than the likes of most of the ingrates who were born here have.
Then I think you start to understand why "blaming immigration" is pretty much a fallacy. If we had the people in this country who were willing to do those jobs rather than the likes of the ones on the BTL thread who think they have the right to a £400k house then we might be less shafted as a nation!
heppers75 said:
Is it not nothing if not ironic to call someone pathetic, accuse them of making sweeping statements based on their own limited experience - then proceed to do exactly the same?
Yes, we all know how you hate irony heppersheppers75 said:
s for childlike posts I'll just leave this here for you
heppers75 said:
Ignoring the cranky pillock...
Poor dodge 1/10crankedup said:
heppers75 said:
wolves_wanderer said:
heppers75 said:
Well it would seem you do have some rather pent up resentment there... I shall leave you to that.
It also seems that the point I was making which is that the reason it is broken is because it would seem, though of course my limited experience (I am interested to know yours BTW outside of being able to use Google!) that those "immigrants" are willing to do jobs and then work harder than our indigenous workshy morons would ever contemplate. You then couple with the fact that when they are skilled have a more socially and familialy responsible attitude which is far less selfish than the likes of most of the ingrates who were born here have.
Then I think you start to understand why "blaming immigration" is pretty much a fallacy. If we had the people in this country who were willing to do those jobs rather than the likes of the ones on the BTL thread who think they have the right to a £400k house then we might be less shafted as a nation!
Pathetic. You are as usual throwing a massive broad brush over two entire groups of people based on your limited experiences of both. FWIW in a previous job I worked with a large number of both immigrants and "indigenous workshy morons" and found them to be pretty similar in terms of attitude to a quality of work. I did notice was about 80% of our shoplifters were from Eastern Europe, what I'm not daft enough to do, unlike you, is to extrapolate my limited experiences to tens of millions of people. It also seems that the point I was making which is that the reason it is broken is because it would seem, though of course my limited experience (I am interested to know yours BTW outside of being able to use Google!) that those "immigrants" are willing to do jobs and then work harder than our indigenous workshy morons would ever contemplate. You then couple with the fact that when they are skilled have a more socially and familialy responsible attitude which is far less selfish than the likes of most of the ingrates who were born here have.
Then I think you start to understand why "blaming immigration" is pretty much a fallacy. If we had the people in this country who were willing to do those jobs rather than the likes of the ones on the BTL thread who think they have the right to a £400k house then we might be less shafted as a nation!
wolves_wanderer said:
heppers75 said:
Is it not nothing if not ironic to call someone pathetic, accuse them of making sweeping statements based on their own limited experience - then proceed to do exactly the same?
Yes, we all know how you hate irony heppersheppers75 said:
s for childlike posts I'll just leave this here for you
heppers75 said:
Ignoring the cranky pillock...
Poor dodge 1/10crankedup said:
'No if's or but's immigration will be reduced to the tens of thousands', this was the promise made by our P.M. back in 2010.
Cameron pledged Tories would cut net migration to the tens of thousands but policy capable of doing so was never adopted by the coalition after opposition from Lib Dems. So the thread title should be 'another year hogtied by the useless Lib Dems' aka the 349ers.JustAnotherLogin said:
Yeah right
If it looks like a kipper, and quacks like a kipper, we have at least to consider the possibility that we have a small smoked fish of the family Clupea harengus on our hands.
(With apologies to Douglas Adams)
Having a rational view on immigration does not necessarily make one a 'kipper'.If it looks like a kipper, and quacks like a kipper, we have at least to consider the possibility that we have a small smoked fish of the family Clupea harengus on our hands.
(With apologies to Douglas Adams)
Edited by sidicks on Friday 28th November 10:35
Yazar said:
b) understand the concept of percentages. For example there are 30 Million people in employment in the UK and only 2 million ish EU migrants + 5.5Million ish non-eu. So since 75% (22.5 Million) jobs are being done by UK citizens, Would you now agree that your labelling them as 'indigenous workshy morons' cannot be correct?
quick point - just because they are in work, does not mean they are working hard or to their full potential.heppers75 said:
Ok you old boys have your fun - I was trying to have an actual conversation on the subject but if you just want to play silly games then press on - I am sure it makes you feel much better about whatever lot in life you have!
And again. You try to act superior by criticising me for something you do, (ignoring the entire point I made in the rest of the post because you had no answer I imagine). You are as easy to read as the top row of an opticians eye chart. I can only assume with your feeble attempts at misdirection the 75 in your name refers to your IQ. And thanks for your concern about my station in life, I'm doing fine thanks, about to go off cocking around in a helicopter over London for a couple of hours if the weather clears up.turbobloke said:
crankedup said:
'No if's or but's immigration will be reduced to the tens of thousands', this was the promise made by our P.M. back in 2010.
Cameron pledged Tories would cut net migration to the tens of thousands but policy capable of doing so was never adopted by the coalition after opposition from Lib Dems. So the thread title should be 'another year hogtied by the useless Lib Dems' aka the 349ers.
If I didn't understand you better I would have consigned your post to the troll basket, but I make allowances in your case because I know I can respond in such a fashion and you will not take offence.
wolves_wanderer said:
crankedup said:
heppers75 said:
wolves_wanderer said:
heppers75 said:
Well it would seem you do have some rather pent up resentment there... I shall leave you to that.
It also seems that the point I was making which is that the reason it is broken is because it would seem, though of course my limited experience (I am interested to know yours BTW outside of being able to use Google!) that those "immigrants" are willing to do jobs and then work harder than our indigenous workshy morons would ever contemplate. You then couple with the fact that when they are skilled have a more socially and familialy responsible attitude which is far less selfish than the likes of most of the ingrates who were born here have.
Then I think you start to understand why "blaming immigration" is pretty much a fallacy. If we had the people in this country who were willing to do those jobs rather than the likes of the ones on the BTL thread who think they have the right to a £400k house then we might be less shafted as a nation!
Pathetic. You are as usual throwing a massive broad brush over two entire groups of people based on your limited experiences of both. FWIW in a previous job I worked with a large number of both immigrants and "indigenous workshy morons" and found them to be pretty similar in terms of attitude to a quality of work. I did notice was about 80% of our shoplifters were from Eastern Europe, what I'm not daft enough to do, unlike you, is to extrapolate my limited experiences to tens of millions of people. It also seems that the point I was making which is that the reason it is broken is because it would seem, though of course my limited experience (I am interested to know yours BTW outside of being able to use Google!) that those "immigrants" are willing to do jobs and then work harder than our indigenous workshy morons would ever contemplate. You then couple with the fact that when they are skilled have a more socially and familialy responsible attitude which is far less selfish than the likes of most of the ingrates who were born here have.
Then I think you start to understand why "blaming immigration" is pretty much a fallacy. If we had the people in this country who were willing to do those jobs rather than the likes of the ones on the BTL thread who think they have the right to a £400k house then we might be less shafted as a nation!
heppers75 said:
My observations on it are (admittedly based on my own experiences) they are doing a fair amount of jobs that many of our own citizens would not be willing to do.
If America tomorrow opened their borders and offered 4 times the UK minimum salary to work in a factory, brits would be exactly the same and would flock over. We live in a richer country than most in the world, so have a different outlook - for many it is not worthwhile economically to work abroad. People are people, some are lazy, some work hard-there is no difference on the whole between the brits and the poles in my opinion. heppers75 said:
experience of in more professional circles
Being raised working class plus having moved around the country and chosen to live in the cheap bits when single (as I am tight 
) I have heavy experience of living in the chavvy bits, scruffy foreign born but british citizen bits, the eastern european bit and also the nice bits. Happy to discuss any of them.The most recent move I did was a perm move to London. Now married and with wife working nearby we move dto a typical East London town. My experience of London easter europeans:
Professional work - great, no difference.
Living with the working class elements: - Great but minor cultural differences such as gathering in the street and drinking from cans whilst talking very loudly (living many to flats with no gardens didn't help)! They also stick up satellite dishes so large they overshadow their own windows!!
But this is minor, the problem was the sheer numbers with a constant roll of wheeled suitcases, meaning schools, GP surgery and hospitals were a mess. Small flats housed 8 people and houses split into bedsits by profit motivated landlords, with people constantly moving in and out it removed any family/community atmosphere. If you look at where all the politicians live, you will see the hypocrites themselves choose not to live next to mass immigration areas. A service designed for a 5000 can't just adapt to 20,000.
The number of migrants, eu and non-eu, made this area a less than ideal choice when having kids though and I wrote this post upon leaving. I now live in SW London My new area is also very multi-cultural, but it is settled with a steady turnover.
I was lucky enough to choose a move, there people all over the country who are stuck in communities where the sheer numbers have overwhelmed the services. Very happy to have migrants, but not an open door where we cannot plan anything or check their history.
heppers75 said:
Then the ones that I have experience of in more professional circles seem to be quite happy to live a lower standard of living in the UK than their income belies and send good portions of their earnings back home to families. However I fully admit that picture might not be played out on a macro level.
Standard practice for migrants, including British migrants abroad- I worked in Europe where there were many other (EU) foreigners in the company and English the standard language. Despite earning a decent experienced professional type salary, we shared flats in zone 2-3 and flew back to family every so often as opposed to weekly as the money is saved for the bills and saving to spend in future back in your country. A temp migrants priorities are different as your home is elsewhere.
heppers75 said:
So if there are 7.5 million non UK workers in the UK are there any statistics of credible source outside of either of our experience that tells us what sort of work they are doing?
Sort of work being done by EUA8 countries. 
‘EU14’ refers to: Austria, Belgium, Denmark, Finland, France, Germany, Greece, Ireland, Italy, Luxembourg, the
Netherlands, Portugal, Sweden and Spain.
‘EUA8’ refers to: the Czech Republic, Estonia, Hungary, Latvia, Lithuania, Poland, Slovakia and Slovenia.
Note there are migrants who are doing work they are over qualified for, either as there qualifications are not recognised here, or that the job just happens to pay more than their normal occupation in Poland.
ikarl said:
Yazar said:
b) understand the concept of percentages. For example there are 30 Million people in employment in the UK and only 2 million ish EU migrants + 5.5Million ish non-eu. So since 75% (22.5 Million) jobs are being done by UK citizens, Would you now agree that your labelling them as 'indigenous workshy morons' cannot be correct?
quick point - just because they are in work, does not mean they are working hard or to their full potential.Can you demonstrate that it is not a normal distribution curve?
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